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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1998 12 02 Regular Item C CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA 1126 EAST STATE ROAD 434 WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA 32708-2799 Telephone (407) 327-1800 Community Development PLANNING & ZONING BOARD / LOCAL PLANNING AGENCY AGENDA ITEM II.C. DISCUSSION WITH ATTORNEY ROBERT GUTHRIE ON THE DRAFT BYLA WS/RULES OF PROCEDURE Staff Report Bob Guthrie will focus primarily on the Rules of Procedure portion of the document. Page 2 Fall 1998 ____20G0mGj111.50G.1JIIII?'l:lll!000!,!!"lm"lflllij1!.~!1!"J:H_:s:'___~!ik0H Raising the Standard for our Communities FLORIDA PLANNING AND ZONING ASSOCIATION CENTRAL FLORIDA , CHAPTER OFFICERS Whit Blanton, AlCP President and Newsletter Editor Ph: 422-8813, eld. 311; Fax: 422-3928 charles.w.blanton@cpmx.saic.com Carol StrIcklin, AlCP Vice President Ph: 836-5611; Fax: 836.5862 pwplcs 1@citizens4irst.co.orange.lI.us Carey S. Hayo, AlCP Treasurer Ph: 843-6552; Fax: 839-1789 chayo@glatting.com Andre A. Anderson Secretary Ph: 836-5884; Fax: 836-58l32 pwplaa1@citizens-first.co.orangeJl.us DIRECTORS TertBowIey, AICP Ph: 262'7700. eld. 1108; Fax: 262-7763 Tracey..Crcv!e,..AICP Ph: 677~8143; Fax: 678-2886 lcrOW/l@tynangroup.com AbraHome, AlCP P,,;656,2322, eX!. 131; Fl!X;658-ll504 planning@ocoee.org . . 't1indliP8inter,AICP Ph: 246-3414; Fax: 24~H!895 Ipainte@ci.orlandoJI.us Vince Sandersfeld Ph: 889-1712; F1J!C 889,1791 Ken Stokes, PE, AleP Ph: 422-74ll7; Fax: 422,7413 k$tok/ls@zhMI.eom FPZA State President Joan CerrettI-Randolph Ph: 644-5297; Fax: 644-3274 <, '-....1~'" State District Director Mack Cope, ASLA .~h:~-9398; Fax: 888-9399 Past Chapter President , . C.Douglas Kelly, AlCP cC, Ph: 422-3330; Fax: 245-1184 dougk@mlller-sellen.com Fall 1998 1'2i~~!GB:.z . Page 3 '''G''!U11!~~i1~~1lS!k.~''lj1:111!5.j1'j1':l:-;.zj1~EJ:;f&j1'),.3'',.Il1:!!~~ President's Message CENTRAL FLORIDA CHAPTER FLORIDA PLANNING AND ZONING ASSOCIATION If you spend any amount of time traveling around Central Florida or, for that matter, throughout the state, it's easy to see plenty of tangible evidence of good planning being put into practice. From visioning to redevelopment planning and urban design - raising the standard for the built environment has moved to cen- ter stage in many communities. We've heard how Collier County developed strict architectural design stan- dards; now. several Central Florida local governments are developing similar standards. Oviedo's City Council recently voted to spend money on landscaping rather than hire additional firefighters. Ambitious landscaping and urban design plans have been developed for Highway 17-92 and SR 50, and we're finally making progress building better facilities for bicyclists, pedestrians and transit riders. In transportation planning, the discussion has moved squarely onto the topic of land use, urban form and urban design. away from more capacity. These landscaping and beautification projects, feasibility studies and ambi- tious redevelopment plans, all suggest that the public is demanding more attention be paid to the character of their communities. In large measure, economic pros- perity has made much of this possible. With the exception of a few select places, these activities and studies have traditionally been seen as luxuries; wants rather than needs. Now. with fat budget coffers they are moving closer to reality. Is this trend merely a result of our robust economy and constant rate of growth? Or is it a sign that Central Florida is maturing, moving beyond the "growth is good" mantra of the last several decades and into an emphasis on preservation, quality and character? Regardless of the motivations, our profes- sion has a unique and rare window of opportunity to create better communities. We need to take full advantage of this environment to improve cooperation and forge strong partnerships to implement visionary, yet defensible plans, and craft sustaining agreements that will help our communities create and retain their unique sense of character. There's no better time than now. SAMPLE BALLOT FOR OFFICERS AND BOARD OF DIRECTORS Slate of Officers President Andre Anderson Orange County (Write-In Candidate) Vice-President Teri Bowley City of Casselberry Tom Grimms City of Winter Springs (Write-In Candidate) Secretary Nicole Guillett-Dary City of Apopka (Write-In Candidate) As we prepare to elect a new slate of officers for the coming year. I am very impressed with the number and quality of candidates for office. It says a lot about this organization when it's not hard to find good people interested in giving their time and energy for a professional association. Our slate of candi- dates includes several folks who have selflessly given their time and talent to this organization over the last year or more, as well as a number of fresh faces. I've been very fortunate to have the opportunity to work with an excellent group of people who serve on the Chapter Board. It's comforting to know the talent and interest is there to make next year even more successful. Kudos to Tracey Crowe and Vince Sandersfeld for developing an excellent slate! Treasurer Todd Peetz Ivey, Harris & Walls Beth Hanson City of Maitland (Write-In Candidate) Board of Directors (Five positions open - select five candidates from the list below) o Carol Stricklin, Orange County o Ian Ratliff, City of Tavares o Matt West, City of Leesburg o Laura Mimms, City of Kissimmee o Lisa Chiblow, Canin Associates o John Omana, City of Lake Mary o Andrew Van Gaale, City of Sanford o Patricia Mayhill, City of Eustis o Maria Triscari, Executive Director, International Drive Chamber of Commerce o (Write"ln Candidate) This is not a ballot BaUots will be moikd to FPZA members in good standing within the next week. Results of the election will be announced at the December 9,1998, Holiday Paity FPZA Central Florida Chapter by-laws require that the slate of officers he published prior to mailing ballots to members for the election. If you would like to suggest a nominee, including yourself, please contact Tracy Crowe at 677-8143 by November 10. I recently traveled to Fon Myers with my five year old daughter to visit my grandmother for her 92nd binhday. During our visit we looked through some old photo albums she kept with pictures of the family, documenting their lives in the Piedmont area of North Carolina from the turn of the century through the late 1970s. Several letters were included, neatly folded, still inside the original enve- lope. The letters were from my grandfather. dating from the early 1920s through the 1930s, when he traveled the country on business. They were a fascinating read. One letter was sent while he was traveling to Fort Lauderdale in 1927. It read, in part: "The real estate salesmen here are as thick as thieves, and all wear name badges so they don't sell to themselves." He then mentioned some of the sights he'd seen, including" ....a beautiful new development that's really something...it's called Coral Gables." Quintessential Florida. CONFERENCE continedfrom page J ranged from executives with Universal Studios to members of the Florida Legislature. A very special thank you goes out to those speakers who captured and held the attention of both the delegates, the Orlando Sentinel and Orange TV through- out the 24 hours of educational programs and tours. The conference concluded on Friday evening with the installation of our own Joan Ceretti-Randolph as State President of the FPZA. This year's conference was full of information, fun and opportunities to exchange ideas and resumes with fellow plan- ners from throughout Florida. 1 want to offer a special thank you to the 10 or so members of the conference planning com- mittee who have worked so diligently during the past 11 months to make this year's conference a huge success. A very special thank you is extended to all the mobile tour and session coordinators especially Andre Anderson, Whit Blanton, Tom Blanton and John Sember, who put so much effort into organizing each of the sessions. Last, a big thank you goes out to Abra Home and Carol Stricklin, who gar- nered local sponsorship that provided the [mancial support necessary for this undertaking. It was a job well done. Page 4 Fall I 998 ____-~~l.j~~lyJJft!~ill!ll.~~.~.I_ MAKE A SMART INVESTMENT IN YOUR FUTURE - JOIN FPZA Upcoming Events ANNUAL MEMBERSlllP DUES: Individuals: $45; Organizations (limit 3 members each): $125 r-------------------, I FPZA MEMBERSHIP APPLICATION I I I I Name: I IAddress: I Iph.lFax: I I I IAffiliation: I I Please make checks payable to: The Florida PIllIlIIing and II I Zoning Association, and mail to Dee Emery, P.O. Box 896. I Tallahassee, FL 32302 (850/878-4051). I L___________________J PLANNING PROGRESSIONS Abra Horne, AICP, has been promoted to principal planner for the City of Ocoee. David Moon, AICP, has joined Science Applications Inter- national Corporation (SAle) in Orlando as senior planner. He previously served as planning and zoning director for Oviedo. Also joining SAlC is Dan Preslar, PE. Bryan Cobb has been promoted to planning and zoning di- rector for Oviedo. Alice Gilmartin, formerly with Allamonte Springs and FDOT District 5, has joined RS&H's Orlando office. Stephanie Gallagher has recently joined Orange County's urban design section. Jay Sargeant has joined the City of Longwood as planning director. Please send in your notices afjob changes, promotions and awards. FPZA will print them infurure issues of the newsletter; space pennitting. Florida Planning and Zoning Association Planning Perspective Holiday Party - Wednesday, December 9. 1998: Oncc again, FPZA's Central Florida Chapter will tcarn \lP with the Mctro Orlando Section of Florida APA for our annual Holiday Party. Last year's joint party was a tremendous success, with nearly 100 attendees. So why mess with success? This year's party will also be at Or- ange County's Cypress Grove Estate house, beginning at 6:30 PM. An awards programs is planned, along with instaJlation of the new FPZA officers. Music wiJI be pro- vided by Tony Luke and his band Slashback. Also on the bill will be the debut of the "Planning Band," featuring Jay Marder, Dick WeJls, KendaJl Keith and other planner/mu- sicians. Join us for this very special and fun event. Cost wiJI be $10; $15 for couples. Invitations will be mailed. For more information, call Andre Anderson at 836-5884. Luncheons: The FPZA Central Florida Chapter continues to hold monthly luncheons featuring relevant planning and development topics. Luncheons are usually held the fourth Th\lrsday of each month at the Homeb\lilders Association of Mid-Florida (HBA) in Maitland. The next sched\lled luncheon is Thursday, No- vember 19, featuring economic redevelopment plans for the Lake Apopka mea, from II :45 to 1 PM at the REA. Volume 2, Number 2 ~~~t.. 1IiiiI:~"~!:iiI II!l:iijij.,~~ W Central Florida Chapter Fall 1998 FPZA STATE CONFERENCE A BIG SUCCESS Hard Work Pays Off for the Central Florida Chapter By Doug Kelly, AICP If you were not among the 150 del- egates, spouses and presenters who attended the 47th Annual State FPZA Conference in Orlando. you missed a history-making event! This year's con- ference with the theme "Florida at the Crossroads" was cosponsored by the Central Florida Chapter of the FPZA and was held September 16 through the 19th at the beautiful Grosvenor Resort in Lake Buena Vista. By all accounts, this year's program was one of the most outstand- ing conferences in the history of the FPZA. Nearly 20 sessions were held cov- ering a broad range of topics concerning tourism, school planning, economic de- velopment and transportation. The Planning Commissioner's Workshop was one of the most successful events during the conference, organized by Jay Marder of the City of Sanford. On Wednesday, 55 appointed and elected planning officials throughout the state attended the day-long event, which has become a conference tradition for the FPZA. Wednesday evening was topped off at the opening reception, with noted landscape architect Ian McHarg autographing copies of his latest book. Following the evening reception, die-hard veterans of the FPZA relocated to the Presidential Hospitality Suite on the hotel's 16th floor, overlooking downtown Disney. The Hospitality Room was at its best, with plenty of liquid refreshments and camaraderie available throughout the conference. Thursday's program in- Happy Hours: For the last several months, FPZA members and friends have been gathcring at a local wa- tering hole to unwind and exchange tales. Our next happy hour will be Friday, November 20th, at Jax's Deli on Central Avenue in downtown Orlando, beginning at5 PM. See you there. Planning ~ Central Florida Chapter. FPZA P.O. Box 1081 Orlando, Florida 32802-1081 ~~~~ ,1iii:!~U~:iiiiI '1II!!::iiij-,,~i:!!II W Planning Perspective is the newsletter of the Central Florida Chapter of the Florida Plaruting and Zoning Association. Please notify Andre Anderson (407/836-5600) of any address changes. Advertisements may be placed by contacting Whit Blanton at 422~8813. ext. 311. ~~POs"!<l. "* "* "* ~/lQ~~- n~ 1 6 1 5 ~ ===""'P'B9 0 3 5 3 1 4 4700500.320 NOV 04 98 38 1 3 MAILED FROM ZIP CODE 3280 1 1,011,,,1,11,,,111,,01,01,11,,,1 Tom Grimms City of Winter Springs 126 E. S.R.. 434 Winter Springs, FL 32708 http://www.fpza.org:/fpza BUILDING PARTNERSHIPS FOR A BETTER COMMUNITY c1uded mobile tours to Universal Stu- dios and the town of Celebration. The day's events concluded with the President's Reception, held at the House of Blues, one of Andre Anderson's favorite hangouts. Beginning with a welcome and in- troduction to the conference by Orlando Mayor Glenda Hood. the program fea- tured topics on such pressing issues as school concurrency. light rail transit, re- development initiatives and retrofitdng state roads for community objectives. The speakers were outstanding, and CONFERE1'/CE confined on page 3 FPZA Celebrates Fall with a Picnic at MClitland Community Park - Saturday, Nav. 14 Join FPZA members, families and friends for a day of fun, food and friendship. On Satur- day, November 14, from 10 AM to 2 PM, the Central Florida Chapter will celebrate the completion of a suc- cessful state conference ("whew! ") and a change in the weather with a free picnic at Maitland Community Park. FPZA will provid~ the picni.c basics -;\ . ..ii. .I burgers, dogs, buns and .'~' beverages,. along, with, , --~:.", i the necessarY-condiments; j If y{l4: c<;>me, please bring a, si<!-e dis~ l\nct{J1r dessert.: The picnic will felllurelLl\' . d'bsert' contest: '. Bripg somethipg ,ypu'iJlade and a oo!lar;lprizes will gq; 'tothe,top three<lesse~, '. .1 . Brlngithekids, spq~s or signifi-l ; .,...~, , '-"-' . - . - lit. /'~.:'I.. c. antothersforare lax.- .~ " ing day atthepark with , . _ . . ill. friends and their fami- . .' lies. Maitland Community Park is one of the region's nicest active parks, with tennis and raquetbaU courts, two play- grounds, a sand volleybaJl court and nature trails. A private sector vs. pub- lic sector volleyball match is planned. The parkis located on Mayo Drive, behind the Homebuilder's building, at U.S. 17-92.and Maitland Blvd. Fol, 10~the)'oa?~ghtPMlqo-. _ theparlC;;Dogs-are allow eo, ~. BUILDING PARTNERSHIPS FOR A BETTER COMMUNITY .. JOHN L. MICA SUBCOMMITTEE ON RAILROADS COMMITTEE ON HOUSE OVERSIGHT C!Congre~~ of tbe Wniteb ~tate~ 1t}ousc of l\cprcscntatibcs Das1Jington, jD(![ 20515-0907 November 12,1998 REPLY TO o 106 CANNON HOUSE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON, DC 20515 (202) 225-4035 o 1211 SEMOAAN BLVD. SUITE 117 CASSELBERRY, FL 32707 (4071 657-8080 o 840 CELlONA BLVD. SUITEG DELlONA,. Fl32725 (407) 860-1499 o 1000 CITY CENTER Circle 2ND FlOQR PORT ORANGE, Fl32119 (904) 756-9798 7TH DISTRICT. FLORIDA COMMITTEE ON GOVERNMENT REFORM AND OVEASIGHT CHAIAMAN, SUBCOMMITTEE ON CIVIL SERVICE SUBCOMMITTEE ON NATlONAL SECURITY, INTERNATIONAL AFfAIRS AND CRIMINAL JUSTICE COMMITTEE ON TRANSPORTATION ANDINFRASTAUCTUAE SUBCOMMITTEE ON SURFACE TRANSPORTATION Mr. Thomas Grimms 1126 E. SR 434 Winter Springs, FL 32708 email: john,mica@mail.house.gov http:.//WWW.house.gov/micaJmlca.hlm Dear Thomas: I am pleased to report to you on the progress we have made relating to meeting Central Florida's transportation needs during this past year in Congress. As Florida's senior member of the Transportation & Infrastructure Committee, this year presented me with an enormous challenge to change the inequitable funding formula which siphoned off our gas tax dollars to other states. With the passage of the Transportation Equity Act for the 21 st Century (TEA-2I), Florida will now receive an adllitiona/ $440 million per year for transportation needs, giving us an average of $1.2 billion annually. This will markedly improve the quality of our state's infrastructure and the safety of our roads. Florida is now guaranteed at least a 90.5 cent return on every $1.00 contributed in gasoline fund taxes, a substantial improvement over the 77 cents we had been getting back. This legislation also contained specific funding for high priority projects in Central Florida. 1 have enclosed a complete list of projects and funding for your review. My highest transportation priority is reducing the gridlock and improving safety on Interstate 4. TEA-2I contained $14 million toward much needed funding which will help replace the I-41St. Johns River Bridge. We have already had fatalities and the number of serious incidents caused by the substandard conditions of this bridge are deplorable.. The bridge was built in 1960 when the standard design did not require any emergency lane. Only 18 inches on either side separate the driver from the edge of the bridge. I am pleased that this bill will help jump start this much needed bridge replacement. In the coming months, I will be working with state and local officials. to develop a plan to complete the funding for this important project. Work is also scheduled to begin in fiscal year 2000 on constructing an additional lane on Interstate 4 from downtown Orlando to S.R. 436. This will provide much needed capacity on Interstate 4. It was also my pleasure to work with Representative Dave Weldon to secure almost $20 'million to 'address the widening of Highway 192 in Orange and Brevard counties This highw~y h~s earred the title of"[)eath Alley" and hopefully this action will speed up safety and widening improvements. We have also secured federal assistance to aid a number of other road and surface projects. These projects are shown in detail on the enclosed list. PRINTED ON RECYCLED PAPER Mr. Thomas Grimms November 12, 1998 Page 2 After several years of planning, We have also recently begun an express bus service from the Saxon Boulevard Park & Ride to downtown Orlando. To make this service more efficient, I have requested that the Florida Department of Transportation investigate allowing the bus to use the safety lane when traffic is congested. This practice is used safely in a variety of different parts of the country, and the service would benefit from being able to bypass traffic when necessary. If we can provide areliable and quick way f()r consumers to. get to ~ork, this project will bea huge ~ success. Another project which is critical to easing congestion in our community is light rail. As you may know, during the past several years, including the most recent federal transportation appropriations bill, I have secured almost $54 million for a commuter rail system in Central Florida. One premise of this funding is that this system serve the entire region of Central Florida, including Volusia county. I am committed to implementing a regional system. The first leg of the system will run from SeaWorld to Florida Hospital. The next leg of the system will serve the many commuters in Seminole county. TEA~21 also guaranteed that this project will receive a minimum of an additional $100 million during the next six years. However, the local community must make a solid commitment to this project. The TEA-2I bill authorized 172 rail projects for federal funding. If the local community is unable to achieve a consensus, these 172 communities will jump ahead of us in line for federal support. As you can see, we have made good progress in addressing many of our transportation problems. As always, these projects require continued monitoring and work to ensure their successful completion. I look forward to your continued interest and involvement as the community pulls together to build a better quality oflife in Central Florida. With my regards and best wishes, I remain . cerely, John . Member of Congress Congressman John L. Mica 1998 Transportation Projects St. Johns River Bridge Replacement - $14 million Bridge replacement will include six-Ianing on Interstate 4 from Lake Mary Interchange through U.S. 17/92 to Saxon Boulevard. This funding will complete the final design of the project and purchase needed right-of-way. This enables us to jump start this project and accelerate the schedule by about 2 years. Interstate 4 Extra Lane: $10 million Several years ago I proposed to the Florida Department of Transportation this additional lane through urban Orlando as an interim solution to provide needed capacity on 1-4. Currently proposed from north of 436 to South Street, this funding represents almost half of the cost of the entire project. 17/92 and SR 436 Overpass Preliminary Engineering & Final Design - $1 million The intersection of U.S. 17/92 and SR 436 carries more traffic than any other intersection in the Orange/Osceola/Seminole Tri-County region. This funding would provide for an environmental assessment, preliminary engineering and final design for a Grade Separation Structure at the intersection to relieve congestion, reduce accidents and enhance air quality. LYNX/Orlando Intermodal Center - $ 5 million This intermodal facility will house both buses and light rail. The bill also authorizes the entire LYNX rail project, which will hopefully one day provide service from International Drive up to Volusia County. Cross Seminole Trail Connection - $1.5 million The Cross Seminole Trail is a fully multi-use trail including all non-motorized user groups accommodating alternative transportation. This project would complete the "missing link" to the Florida National Scenic Trail by connecting Spring Hammock Preserve with the Econ River State Forest. This funding will provide a pedestrian overpass over State Road 434 and a 6 mile trail segment to make the critical link to Downtown Oviedo and Winter Springs. Design & Construction of Pedestrian Overpass over Interstate 4 for the Florida National Scenic Trail - $2.15 million The purpose of this project is to provide a safe pedestrian overpass of Interstate 4 for the connection of the Florida National Scenic Trail (FNST) and the Seminole Wekiva and Cross Seminole Trails. This bridge would connect multiple resource areas, providing for a recreational facility anticipated to have over 25,000 users per month. MetroPlan (MPO) has designated this a priority project for the region. I' .... ,!. ( 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 \. 25 1 1 ORIGINAL 2 3 IN RE: PLANNING & ZONING BOARD/LOCAL 4 PLANNING AGENCY, KASH n'KARRY/ 5 COURTNEY SPRINGS APARTMENTS 6 / 7 8 BEFORE THE PLANNING & ZONING BOARD 9 OF WINTER SPRINGS REPORTED BY: FRANCES R. DIRIENZO, CSR, CMR Winter Springs Municipal Building 1126 East State Road 434 Wednesday, October 28, 1998 APPEARANCES: MICHAEL D. JONES, P.A. 301 West State Road 434 Winter Springs, Florida Attorney for Kash n'Karry & Courtney Springs Apartments BY: MICHAEL D. JONES, ESQUIRE ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 il ,tI 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 2 I N D E X TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS Meeting held October 28, 1998 CALL TO ORDER Pledge of Allegiance Roll Call 3 3 3 4 12 48 55 61 Presentation of Mr. Jones Presentation of Mr. Kolb & Ms. Veaudry Presentation Of Lee Jensen Presentation of Lori Campbell Presentation of Romulo Castellano Presentation of Henry Goode 63 Presentation of David Owji 74 Motion By Mr. Brown 82 Roll Call 84 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 86 ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 tl .. ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 .12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 3 WHEREUPON: The following proceedings were had: THE CHAIRMAN: I'd like to call the meeting to order, Pledge Of Allegiance, please. everyone stand. Roll call. Would THE CLERK: Chairman, Tom Brown? THE CHAIRMAN: Present. THE CLERK: Vice-chairman, Carl Stephe~s, Jr.? MR. STEPHENS: Present. THE CLERK: Marc Lynch? THE CLERK: Bill Fernandez? MR. FERNANDEZ: Present. THE CLERK: Rosanne Karr? MS. KARR: Present. THE CHAIRMAN: Special meeting, Wednesday, October 28th, 1998 seven p.m.. The regular agenda item is the Kash n'Karry and the Courtney Springs Apartments preliminary engineering and final development plan. Mr. LE BLANC: Yes, sir, Mr. Chairman. You received the package and I would gladly turn it over to Mr. Mike Jones, Esquire. MR. JONES: Good evening. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( I '. . . 4 1 THE CHAIRMAN: Good evening, Mr. Jones. 2 I'll get my bottle out of here. MR. JONES: 3 I want to give this Board a little history on this 4 project because, quite frankly, I'm a little bit 5 proud about the way we've handled this matter. 6 This has been going on for sometime, but these 7 plans I'm going to give you bore you a little bit 8 so you understand what we have done and where we 9 stand with the City and with the citizens. 10 When this project was first conceived we had 11 the grocery store and apartment complex and we 12 decided that rather than waste our time going 13 through the normal process of coming to the City 14 and letting them beat us up and then letting the 15 citizens beat us up when we came to this Board and 16 we go to the Commission, that we reversed the 17 process and we met and presented to the citizens, 18 the neighbors our proposed plan and development. 19 The City I don't even believe ever got to see 20 our initial development, but I'm presenting it to 21 you here as the Master Plan as you can see on your 22 Board we initially took to the citizens. I want 23 you to pay particular attention to the number of 24 units that we have, the total number of units in 25 this -- in this whole site and the number of ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 I 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ., 5 buildings, note the configuration. You can see my figure here. We had a row or complex at this point and a complex at this point and we had some buildings that we were seeking setback requirements for in the front. We were seeking some parking space variances, parking size and we had a configuration for the grocery store that involved the -- as you can see outlined in the orange here -- the roadway that exited to the south on Vistawilla Drive with two exits and we took this to the -- to the neighbors and I want to add I think some of them are here. Yeah, there they are. And I want to tell you that they have been very helpful. We didn't do everything they wanted and I'm sure they want more and the City wants more, but we've come a long way because these people did work with us. The meeting that we had resulted in a complete new revision. We moved one of the buildings at this point, reduced the size of the building at this point. We changed the configuration on the building at this position and then we met with the -- we had Vistawilla lined up to meet with the entranceway across the street into the subdivision across the street. They suggested ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( ; 6 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 that that would cause a problem because this subdivision is a gated community and certain times of the day there would be problems with backup. So, we went back to the Board again. In fact, I think we probably went back to the Board three or four times and we revised this plan. We took the building out completely at this point further reducing the density by two and a half excuse me, by a building and a half. We then relocated the road, the roadway pursuant to their request and changed this out parcel and took the roadway out of that so that there would only be one entryway off of Vistawilla Drive. It's offset from the driveway across the street and we put a -- we moved our retention pond into that area. There were some other suggestions and I don't know if they show on this plan, but they suggested that we move the compactor. They had some questions about the playground. concerns about the landscaping. They had some We tried to address each of the concerns that the neighbors gave to us, especially those that lived right behind it. We went out and met with them. We were going to try to save the trees, but they didn't want the parking here. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 So, as you will see on the next plan -- where is the other plan? This is the plan that is up for you tonight for your consideration -- I got you we have now taken the parking spaces out. We have put in the retention pond to the rear to act as the buffer. We are asking for a variance from the landscape requirements to do a little bit more landscaping by putting in the Wax Myrtles which are faster growing, bushier and supposedly will hold ~- will have an effect also -- have some effect as a sound barrier. We've clustered the landscaping at the end of this building per their request and at this point we have agreed to put in the Wax Myrtles, some 22 of them across there. However, it has been suggested that they might want something else and we're agreeable to working within the same perimeters we have already changed it to and we are not going to close the door insofar as landscapihg it would be up to the neighbors and Commission. We have now agreed with the City then comes the City's requirements. We've made changes. We've got a different landscaping plan across the front and what we are going to do as far as our ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 agreement with the City, we're asking the City to assume ownership of the pond. That pond has been a big problem because it is owned by DOT and nobody wants the ugly pond with a chain link fence. We agreed that we will extend our landscaping from the entire length of this project and across and in front of the pond. We're putting in a a split rail you call it split rail plan -- not you call it a wrought iron fence, but it is actually made out of aluminum and it would have columns all the way across the front with landscaping. As we depicted here -- the City has agreed to work with us in the landscaping and the fencing around the edge. We're going to assume the responsibility for the maintenance of the landscaping. We're going to give the City a liability bond for up to a million dollars to cover the liability aspects and the City gets their pretty front across there and we get to go on with the project. There are only -- there is only one request for a variance on this project -- two. MR. LE BLANC: Three with the trees. MR. JONES: Okay. The change in the ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 (" , ( 24 i 9 1 shrubbery along the rear -- 2 That is not in your package, MR. LE BLANC: 3 that change in the shrubbery and park -- the 4 parking space size. 5 MR. JONES: Actually, there is one tree per 6 75 foot required along the back and we're putting 7 something like twenty-two across the one section 8 and then this cluster. And then there is a 9 variance, we've asked for a hundred fourteen 10 parking spaces for compact cars, parking spaces 11 from a hundred -- ten by twenty to nine by 20. And 12 we got a stucco entry wall here request, change 13 I don't remember what the requirement is -- split 14 faced. And we've asked for the stucco so it would 15 be in conformity with the rest of the building. 16 The buildings will be stucco so it keeps it in the 17 Other than that everything is either same scheme. 18 by the code or for the most part exceeds the code 19 under the revision Ordinance. 20 We have -- let me address the Kash n'Karry. 21 I don't have the last plans. 22 Don, can you give me -- I'm sorry. I left 23 the color plans there. The Kash n'Karry front part we've asked for 25 only one variance there and I believe that is the ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 10 signage and that signage is the signage on the building which is, as you know, these people have a building, they use the same cookie cut allover the country and this building is designed for this type sign and they've asked for variance to the signage. You'll see on one of your handouts -- I don't have the page on it, but they've have asked for an additional single tenant with a height of eight point nine feet which is nine inches in excess of the eight foot requirement. And they've asked for a height variance of all store front, the building manage size to exceed a height of 14 feet and then there are some other requests you will find on that page, a memo dated October 12th, 1998 and those are all to keep the building in compliance with the store and it's -- whatever they build and the type of store they build. I'm not asking for anything special. It's the same thing they are going to put up -- there's five of these Kash n'Karry stores right now going on in Central Florida. They will all be the same thing and that is by request to make it the same as the rest of them. We've changed the rear to allow the roadway that I pointed out to you awhile ago. We've moved the compactor. You can't see them now. Boy, we ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 11 really moved them. I don't even see them on here_ Where did they go? Yeah, okay. We put the compactors back in amongst the building to buffer the sound. I can't think of anything else. Is there anything else we talked to y'all about that you can remember? A VOICE: That's all. MR. JONES: What we have tried to do is to satisfy the neighbors and their concerns and make this as friendly a project as possible. We have certainly taken heed to what they have requested. As you understand we've started out with two hundred fifty plus units that we could build here under the code and given up 50 or 75 of those units. By reducing those units we've reduced the amount of monies that we can put on frilly-dillys that we would normally have to put in, but we've tried to comply with all of the requests of the neighbors and we've complied with all of the requests of the City. There is no requirement that we do any underground utilities on this project although we have agreed that we will work with the City subject to Mr. McLemore and the contributions are ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 12 relatively significant that we've agreed to make. Now, what I would like to do, we have the engineers and the architects here. I would like to turn the -- each parcel over and let them -- go over it with them, ask them any questions you have pertaining to the engineering or the architecture. Who wants to take it? You want to take Kash n'Karry? MR. KOLB: I'm Joe Kolb with Bowyer-Singleton. THE REPORTER: Please spell your name. MR. KOLB: Yeah, K-o-l-b. We're here to answer any questions you may have on the Kash n'Karry site. One clarification I would like to make on parking, actually there is a hundred and twelve required parking spaces that we would like to have as compact spaces. MR. JONES: On the apartment complex? MR. KOLB: There is hundred fifty-four total compact spaces we're requesting on that site. Also, if you have any questions about the apartment site we can talk about that, as well. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr. Fernandez has a question. MR. FERNANDEZ: Thank you, sir. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 13 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Mr. Kolb, I believe it is? Mr. Kolb, you are you said with Bowyer-Singleton & Associates? MR. KOLB: That's correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: The plans that I've got, I need your edification that on the Kash n'Karry Bowyer-Singleton is the landscape architect and it appears that on the Courtney Springs Apartments the landscape architect is Canin & Associates? MR. KOLB: Tha t' s correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: On page number eight of nine pages or it should be page number eight because it's really numbered sheet one of one. MR. KOLB: Correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: It says that this architect -- Courtney Springs ContraVest, that this is for bidding purposes only. What does that mean, over on the right-hand side? MR. KOLB: That is Canin's plan. That is not filed in. That is MS. VEAUDRY: just a spot we have. That is just a spot on our title blocks. That's just on our title blocks t~at when we eventually go out to bid we put a date in there and that is just for our in-house records. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. And in reviewing MS. VEAUDRY: It's not filed in. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 14 MR. FERNANDEZ: plans it indicates In reviewing some of the and the listing of plants ~nd so forth is window dressing and what really counts is the actual plans that are filed. Mr. Jones has made representation about a cluster of trees and there are about 22 Wax Myrtles and so forth, but the plans actually say that the side rear property lines, one canopy tree should be planted per one hundred lineal feet. MR. LE BLANC: Mr. Fernandez, this came under heavy discussion yesterday, this project as you're talking about just a second MR. JONES: Over here. MR. LE BLANC: This was just drawn up today and that was the result of the meeting that we had with the Courtney Springs Apartment ContraVest people yesterday so that, no, is not in your plans and that sheet you have. MR. FERNANDEZ: Is this that is now drawn up what we are calling the plans that are binding? MR. LE BLANC: That is the plans provided that all the agreements are reached in removing the telephone poles -- MR. FERNANDEZ: Are we going to have a Developer'S Agreement? ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 15 MR. LE BLANC: Yes, there will be. MR. JONES: That will be the exhibit to the Developer's Agreement and it will be maintained as that exhibit. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. MR. LE BLANC: Apologize for you not getting it, but, as I said, this is the first time we saw it tonight. MR. FERNANDEZ: There are 11 buildings. How many units, two hundred and fifty did you say? MR. KOLB: 242 There are three stories. MR. FERNANDEZ: MR. KOLB: 252. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. The six foot buffer wall that is on the -- what is the direction -- the southwest side of the property. MR. KOLB: Okay. The rear wall. MR. FERNANDEZ: I guess that is what you're calling it. Looks to be next to some sort of water treatment plant or something on these plans. I'm looking on -- MS. VEAUDRY: Are you looking at the retention plan right there? MR. FERNANDEZ: I'm looking at three of nine. Now, I'm looking -- all right. I got a dumpster ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 16 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 area. What am I looking at? This is three of nine which appears to be the Kash n'Karry and I have the dumpster area and I got to the left of the dumpster area behind a dry retention pond, behind Tract A, behind out parcel two commercial use, 1.6 acres. All right. It says six foot buffer wall. Keep coming towards me with your finger. What kind of wall is that? What's that made out of? MR. KOLB: It's a masonry wall. MR. FERNANDEZ: Masonry meaning some definition? give me MR. KOLB: Concrete block wall. MR. FERNANDEZ: With stucco? MR. KOLB: With stucco. MR. FERNANDEZ: To match the sides? MR. KOLB: Right. MR. FERNANDEZ: Some of these things say retention and detention. Is that the same thing? MR. KOLB: The dry detention areas are shown as dry retention and the other pond is a wet pond. So, the pond that shows in Karina's plans that are blue, those are wet ponds. MR. FERNANDEZ: I'm looking for a definition of terms. What is the difference between detention and retention? ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( , '. 17 1 Detention is when there's a MR. KOLB: 2 positive outfall. There is orifice that bleeds 3 Retention is there's -- you're down the pond. 4 depending on the pond to recover through the bottom 5 and the pond size. So, it is dry pond that has 6 under drains. That is what we have on Kash 7 The storm water gets in the pond and n'Karry. 8 recovers through the bottom side of the pond. The 9 other is a wet pond, has a positive outfall. 10 MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. What -- I know st. 11 John's Regional Water Management District, but 12 what's ACOE? 13 That's the Army Corp -- MR. KOLB: 14 Of Engineers, okay. MR. FERNANDEZ: 15 Okay. On that landscape architect's plan 16 again it has "For Bidding Purposes Only" on it, 17 Says "one canopy tree would be back to that one. 18 planted per island." 19 Now, I understand this new thing is just 20 fresh, hot off the presses on the color board. 21 Point out to me the islands. Where are these's 22 islands you're talking about? 23 MS. VEAUDRY: These are the landscape islands 24 we're talking about in the parking lot. They are 25 required to be every so many spaces and everywhere ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 18 there is a landscape island there is going to be a tree and that is what we are talking about in the parking lot. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. And where's -- the lake is over to the left of that, Florida Department of Transportation Pond? MS. VEAUDRY: The edge of the lake is right in there. MR. FERNANDEZ: You're off the camera. MS. VEAUDRY: It doesn't really show on this plan. Are you talking about the existing lake on the adjacent property? MR. FERNANDEZ: Correct. MR. KOLB: That is the edge of the pond or It wraps up like that. the lake is right here. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. Mr. Jones indicated that the City is going to own the -- where the Florida Department of Transportation is putting its retention pond. That is what he indicated? MS. VEAUDRY: The proposal for the City is to take ownership of this area. MR. FERNANDEZ: Who owns it now, you guys? MS. VEAUDRY: The Department of Transportation. MR. FERNANDEZ: And they're going to get it. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 19 MS. VEAUDRY: If the City doesn't own it what we will be left with is a chain link fence with no landscaping and that's the basic DOT pond and they really won't allow anything else and so the idea is to have more of a park like setting. k1 MR. FERNANDEZ: How are y'all involved with the city's negotiations with the Florida DOT. MS. VEAUDRY: I think Mike can address that. MR. JONES: We have met with the -- this DOT's pond has been a real pain. MR. FERNANDEZ: I imagine. MR. JONES: We at one point had the -- we were even going to do our drainage into this pond and they couldn't -- we couldn't do our drainage into this pond because it would have been a private use into a public facility. So, we decided to get the city to take the pond and we do the drain in there and we would in turn give the City the things we're giving it anyway, but it turned out DOT said no even if the private developer drains in the City pond and gives it to the City it has to be used for public use and you can't do that. So, we lost any and all benefit to the developer for the pond, but the idea stuck and initially the Commissioners and the City Manager ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 20 were opposed to the City taking over the pond, but after we proposed the landscaping -- which we can work a lot better with the City than we can with DOT -- the idea hung and we contacted DOT and they will, in a rather quick transaction, on a public service basis or public use basis for the pond transfer it to the City with an easement to continue to use it for retention. If we -- if it stays in the hands of DOT we have no control over the landscaping. They have indicated that they would allow us to landscape the front and to cover their little chain link fence with Jasmine vines or something like that, but we are going to have a chain link fence and there is not going to be any variation. So yesterday that's why we agreed with the City to go ahead and run the aluminum fencing all the way across which we initially proposed if the City had the pond and we could use it. Here, let me show you what we are talking about on the aluminum fence. And the City is going to require that we have a fence to make this private. It will not be used by -- accessed by this apartment complex. There will be entranceway for the City and for maintenance purposes and there ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 21 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 will be a fence around here. What we do with the City later -- we don't know, but on this plan there is no proposal for this facility to use this pond in any way so that it can completely be called a public use purpose for the City and making it esthetics is a public purpose. So, everything seems to be on line, but it is a two step process. First you have to have a buyer and that's the City and we will have to step forward and go to the DOT and get it approved. And the Developer Agreement will set that out. That's subject to the ownership. will do this landscaping. If the City owns it we If DOT owns it we will end up doing this landscaping they will allow us to do across 434. MR. FERNANDEZ: Then answer me a question. I'm going to hand you an extra copy of this old thing that I realize it's -- and make sure I understand what you just said. It shows a right-of-way line, fence line chain link fence type up here on that retention pond? MR. JONES: That's correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: Little section? MR. JONES: That's correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: Are you telling me if the ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 22 city owns it that chain link fence disappears and there's going to be this aluminum fence? MR. JONES: That's correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. MR. JONES: What I'm telling you is what you see on the color plan is what you would get attached to our developer's agreement. MR. FERNANDEZ: Yeah, but I don't see trees, other thing where that -- this thing shows a chain link fence. MR. JONES: Excuse me? MR. FERNANDEZ: Right back -- right in there. MR. JONES: Well, you can't see it from here. There's a stucco there and there and there and because this was done in hurry the little riffle is not -- you will see there is no barb wire hatching across here, column here and here and here. MR. FERNANDEZ: Well, it looks. like you got trees over there to where your finger just was, Mike. MR. JONES: Here? MR. FERNANDEZ: Yeah, those big blotches. Aren't they trees? MR. JONES: No, that was -- when we handed this plan in we were going to do the chain link ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 23 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 fence with Jasmine and you can see in this plan how it is a little rough around it, supposed to show the shrubbery and the shrubbery didn't come off of this when we put it out here we changed it from chain link fence to the MS. VEAUDRY: What this plan is proposing and what you're seeing here is addition of a palm tree cluster here. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. MS. VEAUDRY: And some medium sized trees because we are dealing with power poles and the suggestion would be medium sized trees or Elms, Crepe Myrtles or and we also have incorporated some large flowering shrubs. MR. FERNANDEZ: Why the gap? MS. VEAUDRY: That is where the large flowering shrub passing is going to be in that area, this area in question. Okay. I think that covered MR. FERNANDEZ: the plans, Mr. Kolb. Thank you. MR. KOLB: Thank you. MS. VEAUDRY: There is one other -- there was a question about the rear property line and a screening of that. This is a cross section showing the -- where the single family lot would be, the ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 24 six foot masonry wall, the proposed Crepe Myrtles, the approximate mature shape of the tree, the dry retention pond and the first thing over on the apartment complex will be a large live Oak tree ~~d the parking lot and this kind of gives you a typical cross-section of what that landscape buffer would look like. MR. FERNANDEZ: Thank you. MS. VEAUDRY: If you'd like to see the signage when we talk about the stucco sign out front, this is a conceptual plan of what the signage would look like. MR. FERNANDEZ: Why do you need an extra sign. MS. VEAUDRY: This is -- it's not an extra sign. This is this project signage for the Courtney Springs Apartment complex. MR. FERNANDEZ: I know, but you're asking for a variance for one additional sign. MR. JONES: No, no. MR. LE BLANC: No, Kash n'Karry. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. MS. VEAUDRY: Are there any other questions about the Courtney Springs Apartment complex? MR. FERNANDEZ: Masonry, I like brick. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 25 What's the matter with brick. MS. VEAUDRY: Well, our building, this is to match our building so that the project has a synonymous look and it matches. MR. FERNANDEZ: Long term maintenance, though, isn't brick better? MS. VEAUDRY: We've had a lot of success with stucco walls and the issue really is the architecture and the look of the project. Esthetically, you know, we just want everything to match so it looks synonymous when you drive through the complex. MR. FERNANDEZ: Thank you. THE CHAIRMAN: Mrs. Karr? MRS. KARR: So, you we're just representing Courtney Springs information. Who is going to be doing Kash n'Karry? MR. KOLB: I'll answer questions for Kash n'Karry? MS. KARR: Do you have a sign for the Kash n'Karry? MR. KOLB: MS. KARR: No, it's not in your package? I know, but I was hoping to see the colors and -- MR. KOLB: There should by a colored sheet. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 MR. LE BLANC: I don't have that. MS. KARR: That is the way the apartments are going to look? MR. JONES: Yes, ma'am. MS. KARR: Can we get that on the camera. MR. KOLB: I want to explain about the signage real quick on the Kash n'Karry. The additional sign that we are requesting, there is project identification sign here and here and that's going to have the Kash n'Karry and it is going to have the small retail store. And so the additional sign we are requesting -- I'm sorry -- it's here and here. MR. LE BLANC: No. MR. KOLB: Yes. MR. LE BLANC: The project is authorized No. two tenant identification signs and I looked at it a little better than Joe, here and here. This sign will come in once this property is developed. This sign will come in once this property is developed. They are asking for an additional identification sign for the west side, the west entry off of 434. MR. KOLB: Stand corrected. This is a single use sign here and here. are here and here. So, the multiple use signs ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 \ 27 THE CHAIRMAN: Mr. LeBlanc, the signs, is that a variance, you're giving them an extra sign? MR. LE BLANC: That would be a variance that the Commission would have to grant. MR. BROWN: That's because it's your procedure to do it that way, Kash n'Karry because that is the way the stores are set up. MR. KOLB: Well, they feel, yes, that they need, since they are on two street frontages that they would like to have that identification on each of the street frontages. THE CHAIRMAN: Just a point of interest the Board attended a state Planning And Zoning and different companies like McDonald's and so forth, they are breaking away from their variances to fit into the City codes and I want to get that back to our City manager, Mr. McLemore because more and more we are doing away with variance and staying within the variances and not giving variances as much as they were in the past just because it is a Hess gas station or something like that we are requesting that they bring it down to what we would want in the City to make it look uniform so MR. KOLB: Actually, the signage that we ar$ doing is a little above what they usually do, ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 28 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 though. is in keeping with the It's in keeping with the The architecture architecture in the area. building. I wish I had a plan. THE CHAIRMAN: No, I was talking about the number of them. I think that anybody in this area, if there is one sign there they will certainly know there is a Kash n'Karry, to have another on Vistawilla I don't think is necessary. Most people living there going in and out are going to know it is there, just a point of interest more or less. The city is giving a variance. We certainly under stand tha t. MR. LE BLANC: Mr. Chairman, let us not get confused. The variance sign they are requesting is here, the western end on 434. They are authorized two multi tenant signs by the new development guidelines. One of them would be on Vistawilla Drive at this point here and the other would be at this point here. THE CHAIRMAN: MR. LE BLANC: Okay. So, this is the sign that's in question. THE CHAIRMAN: That is just a Kash n'Karry sign. MR. LE BLANC: That would be just a Kash ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 29 n'Karry sign. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you. Mr. Fernandez? MR. FERNANDEZ: Mr. LeBlanc, I note in the chronology presented to us on page four this matt$~ went in front of the City Commission August 10th, 1998. MR. LE BLANC: That is correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: Has it ever gone before us on a conceptual plan? MR. LE BLANC: No it has not, conceptual plans are not required to go to anybody. MR. FERNANDEZ: Since we are only advisory to the City Commission and since the City Commission ultimately has the final say-so and since our function tonight is to determine whether or not this plan meets the technical requirements of our various codes, and if it does, to make findings of fact how it meets or does not meet those technical requirements. What did the City Commission think of the conceptual plan? It doesn't do us any good to make recommendations or approve if the City Commission is going to give us a thumb down. MR. LE BLANC: They thought of it in a ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( '. i 33 1 this settlement agreement and the question was 2 because it said commercial, was an apartment 3 complex commercial or was it residential? 4 MR. MALAVE: All of this is Tract l5 of which 5 the northern -- my name is Ray Malave, M-a-l-a-v-e, 6 Bowyer Singleton. 7 I'm involved with all Tuskawilla -- the 8 original parcel of Tract 15 includes everything 9 that abuts 434, includes Howell Creek Reserve and 10 Eagle Watch and also includes the commercial parcel 11 there where the Hess was developed. The southern 12 half has been developed into what is now Howell 13 Creek Reserve. The northern half, small portion of 14 it is single family located on the western side of 15 the conservation lake area where the fire 16 right in this Vicinity is where the fire station 17 station is going to be for the City. That was 18 parcel 1e-1A. This one right here is 1C and that's 19 the current designation of this parcel, Tract 15, 20 Parcel 1C if that helps any. 21 MR. FERNANDEZ: Don't have a 1C, but it says 22 15-1 is commercial. 23 MR. MALAVE: That is exactly what this one 24 is, 15-1. It has been divided up in A, Band C's. 25 MR. FERNANDEZ: Are you telling me that three ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 34 story, two hundred fifty apartments is commercial? MR. MALAVE: When we went to the city Commission which Mike I think explained a little bit one of the things we were asking is could we put in this commercial zone apartments. The ei ty Commission together with the legal staff indicated that was possible. Therefore, we proceeded in developing the things we have before you. MR. FERNANDEZ: I will leave that to those higher beings that know what they're doing. On the Settlement Agreement, Ordinance I should say under Section 4 it says that: "The maximum allowed number of dwelling units per gross residential acre for multifamily dwelling units within the Tuskawilla PUD is waived to the extent permitted under the agreement upon recommendations from the Planning and Zoning Board." Now, if I read that correctly then this Board has to make some recommendations to the City Commission and I think -- I don't know whether we got the cart before the horse or not. This agreement seems to indicate that they should have come to us. MR. JONES: Are you reading the Ordinance? ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 35 MR. FERNANDEZ: I'm reading the ordinance, Section 4, page four. MR. JONES: That ordinance is not applicable. MR. FERNANDEZ: Seems to incorporate adopting the settlement agreement between the city of Winter Springs and Winter Springs Development Joint Venture Providing for a development order and amending Annexation Ordinance 64 waiving multifamily dwelling unit density limits pursuant to our codes. MR. LE BLANC: Which ordinance is that? MR. FERNANDEZ: 489, page four, Roman Numeral IV. If I heard you correct the City Commission and City Attorney has already approved multifamily in this commercial area and we haven't had any recommendations from P & Z. out. I sort of feel left A VOICE: This was one done many years ago. The waiver was entered into it. MR. FERNANDEZ: The ordinance is done in '90. The Vested Rights Permit is '93. MR. LE BLANC: If I remember correctly the maximum number of units per acre probably was sixteen multifamily units and that is what ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 36 addresses it can have more. Because if you notice where st. John's Landing is if you look at the Marina site in the PUD it had where we now have 31 or 32 single family units it could have had 166 multifamily. Where the Reserve at Tuskawilla has 92 units they could have had 1,480. MR. FERNANDEZ: Maybe, I can short-circuit it. What recommendations do we need to make to comply with this settlement agreement section, Roman Numeral IV, page four of Ordinance 489. I don't believe you have to do MR. LE BLANC: anything. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. MR. JONES: At the very best, Bill, I think it would be that you agree with the City Attorney's -- what do you call it, I guess, legal opinion. MR. LE BLANC: What 489 does, basically, is adopts the settlement agreement. MR. FERNANDEZ: language. MR. LE BLANC: Put's it in superfluous Puts it in attorney language. You and Mike can talk about that. MR. FERNANDEZ: Right. MR. LE BLANe: That is what 489 does, adopts ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 37 the settlement agreement Court Order. I want somebody MR. FERNANDEZ: All right. to talk to me about Eagles. MR. KOLB: We requested a letter as Mr. LeBlanc asked us to get, a letter from the Florida Game And Fresh Water Commission. We spoke to them about the letter saying our project would have no impact. That letter has been written. It is on its way to you. You will get a copy within the week, says that this project would have no impact on the Eagle that is out there. THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Who is that coming from? MR. KOLB: Florida Game And Fresh Water Fishing Commission. MR. LE BLANC: Mr. Fernandez, most of the Eagles in that area are citified and they are accustomed to -- MR. FERNANDEZ: City Eagles and Country Eagles. MR. LE BLANC: That is right. There was an Eagle on the southeast corner of ParcellS when they where building Vistawilla Drive. His name was SE-04. The letter came back and said he was accustomed to urbanization, must be a City Eagle. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( / ... 38 1 Okay, thank you, Mr Chairman. MR. FERNANDEZ: 2 Is there any other comments by THE CHAIRMAN: 3 the Commission? Is there any other presentation on 4 Kash n'Karry? 5 If not -- Mr. Stephens? 6 MR. STEPHENS: Yeah, I do have -- I was going 7 to ask about the Eagles, as well. Just how far 8 away is this from the Eagle's nest? 9 The radius of a thousand MR. MALAVE: 10 miles -- thousand feet doesn't even come across 11 this area right here trying to point right there. 12 So, the radius of a thousand feet from the original 13 nest which was located in Vistawilla doesn't come 14 near Eagle Watch. Doesn't even come to 15 Vistawilla.' We're not even in -- so, the one 16 thousand feet influence that the Fish And Game 17 Commission puts on construction. 18 Okay. Now, but in Florida the THE eHAIRMAN: 19 secondary zone encompasses an extending seven 20 hundred fifty feet out from the primary zone, one 21 thousand five hundred feet from the nest. 22 If you're aware last year the MR. MALAVE: 23 secondary zone was eliminated from the federal 24 guidelines. 25 I'm reading this packet we MR. STEPHENS: ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( i t. 39 1 got. 2 That was eliminated last year. MR. MALAVE: 3 There is an abundance of Eagles now, that it is not 4 really an endangered species like we thought so 5 reduced some of the requirements. That is why the 6 letter coming from Jim Palmer, Fish and Game 7 Commission will indicate we are not having any 8 concerns or problems with building this project. 9 MR. STEPHENS: I have one more question. If 10 this deal falls through with the fence around the 11 retention pond and we have to go with the chain 12 link fence is there any thought given to maybe 13 making that a vinyl coated chain link fence, the 14 green type. 15 If the deal faIls through you got MR. JONES: 16 to deal with DOT, not us. So they are going to put 17 up what they put up. We are still trying to work ~ 18 deal with DOT that we will put in -- they will 19 allow us to put instead of green, black vinyl chain 20 link fence and allow us to do -- the plan you have 21 in front of you was really going to be a DOT fence 22 without aluminum in it, chain link with shrubbery 23 and Jasmine on it, but DOT insists that their 24 fencing, if they own it, has to be chain link. 25 MR. FERNANDEZ: Mr. Jones, while you are ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 40 there and with the Chairman's permission is this property located within the Tuskawilla Beautification Project area and does it meet its requirements? MR. JONES: I don't believe it is. It is outside of the -- THE CHAIRMAN: Is it part of the PUD? MR. JONES: Yes. THE CHAIRMAN: Well, then it is part of Tuskawilla -- MR. JONES: It is part of Tuskawilla. I don't think it is part of the beautification plan, isn't it? MR. BROWN: The homeowner's are here tonight. They are eligible to belong to the Tuskawilla Homeowner's Association, I'm sure. MR. LE BLANC: I think, possibly, Vistawilla Drive will be. I can't answer -- everything that's in PUD is not in the Beautification District. For instance st. John's landing is not in there. Arbor Glenn is not in there. It is very good possibility -- I have not attended the meetings. I do not know the District, but I would say, probably, Vistawilla Drive the entryway there is probably within the Beautification District. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( \ I. 41 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE CHAIRMAN: I guess for my own clarification I have to really rack my brains. I served on Planning and Zoning Boards back when Tuskawilla PUD and Tract 15 and all this was being shifted around from commercial to the single family to commercial family owned. This is the same area we are talking about that we went through in the 90's and back and forth is that true, Mr. Jones, when all of the discussions were about not putting Vistawilla through as I remember you were here at some of the meetings. I don't recall any of that. I MR. JONES: was not involved in that. THE eHAIRMAN: I know you were at some of the meetings. MR. JONES: Only time I came to the meetings, sir, is when I was involved in a lawsuit. The lawsuit had to do with development of Howell ereek Reserve and some of Eagle Watch into -- THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. You probable know as much as I do, you know, vaguely MR. JONES: Even that plan I was here on which involved the 52 acre burrow pit we were going to dig. THE eHAIRMAN: That is where I know you from, ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( \. 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 42 1 the burrow pit. 2 MR. JONES: Vistawilla Drive was still shown 3 on that plan and also still residential development 4 on that plan. 5 Yeah. THE eHAIRMAN: 6 MR. JONES: Matter of fact, it was built. 7 That's right. 8 That's correct. THE eHAIRMAN: 9 No, I'm trying to you know get my time -- 10 MR. JONES: Yeah, it is kind of 11 interesting we would be back here -- 12 THE CHAIRMAN: It's ten years. 13 These people here they just moved MR. JONES: into this area, Howell ereek and Eagle Watch. They weren't aware we had this low, low density project with 50 acres of public lakes for everybody and we lost that. THE eHAIRMAN: I know it is -- I was telling Mr. Fernandez earlier it is a come down on where we were at that time. There was going to be thousands of apartments going all the way up to Tuskawilla. If I remember correctly we did a lot of jumping and screaming and carrying on. Okay. MR. FERNANDEZ: Need to get public input. THE CHAIRMAN: I'm still trying to think what ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 43 else is -- Miss Karr? MS. KARR: I have just a few questions. Is there any reason why the developer chose Kash n'Karry to pair with this apartment complex? MR. JONES: Yes ma'am. contract first and the money. They come up with the MS. KARR: How does it -- I mean I don't know how this is going to sound but what type of clientele MR. JONES: That is a good question. I'm glad you asked that. This is a prototype of store. Kash n'Karry moved into this area -- they had moved into Tampa. I don't know if you have been to Tampa lately. They have a number of stores and their stores compete with Publix and the larger units you see .here with a pharmacy. It has a deli. It has a liquor store -- it has this facility has would have all of the things you have at the large It is a large store. They are Publix stores. building five. How does it rank? I don't know where you shop. It ranks right up with Publix, Winn Dixie and Albertson's. MS. KARR: Okay. What about Food Lion? MR. JONES: Well, Food Lion owns Kash ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( , ( 20 21 22 23 24 25 44 1 n'Karry. 2 Oh, what a surprise. MS. KARR: 3 MR. JONES: You don't shop at Food Lion? 4 Okay. 5 Well, everything changes, but the store 6 itself and the location and they chose to put a 7 nice facility in a nice neighborhood. So, I would 8 expect that they expect to draw the clientele from 9 that neighborhood. 10 MS. KARR: My other question has to do with 11 traffic flow and has there been any traffic study 12 done on how the traffic from Vistawilla going into 13 434 is going to be impacted by the customers and 14 the residents of the apartment complex. 15 There have been. MR. JONES: Yes, ma'am. 16 Traffic studies have been done and the studies and 17 the City engineers have worked with our engineers 18 on that traffic study. And that is why we 19 initially had concern -- the city had concern about the removal of the driveway on Vistawilla. They wanted to line it up which made sense to us anyway, but they acquiesced and allowed us to move it to keep the neighbors happy and they, likewise, recognized as we did there was a traffic problem created at this point caused by the -- yes, the ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 45 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 traffic flows internally and traffic flows on 434 and Vistawilla have been studied and those have been submitted to the City. MS. KARR: Has the City considered the mix of the residents that are in the gated community and the type of store Kash n'Karry is? MR. LE BLANC: Uh, that if you would look at 489, Ordinance 489 if you would go into the back and it tells you by Court Order all of the uses allowed. We stopped at -- I think we almost go through the alphabet twice. We stop at CV and those stores are allowed use through the court ordered settlement agreement. We basically don't have very much chose because this is in the document that was approved by the City Father's at the time and the judge and what have you so it is 17 an authorized use. 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE CHAIRMAN: I have a -- MS. KARR. Go ahead. THE CHAIRMAN: I have a generic question. MR. LE BLANe: For who? THE CHAIRMAN: For you, Don. MR. LE BLANC: Okay. THE CHAIRMAN: We have dqne a lot of work on the 434 corridor and we keep hearing about the ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 46 retention pond and chain link fence and other things. Do you know Mr. McLemore's feeling on this? I know how strong he is about keeping the 434 corridor with eye level beautification. MR. LE BLANC: The plans you saw drafted up was a result of Mr. McLemore meeting with ContraVest people and Mr. Yeager and Mr. Jones yesterday and his intent if at all possible is that the city would take over the pond to prevent DOT from putting its monstrosity there along 434 with green vinyl fence and nothing in front of it. THE CHAIRMAN: I wouldn't think -- and I know it is a little larger, but it seems to me and if I remember correctly that Hess also has made some arrangements to keep that beautification. So, I would think this would be able to work out. MR. LE BLANC: If we get control of the pond it will work out. If we don't get control of the pond DOT does what it wants as it usually does. THE CHAIRMAN: Yeah, I see most of the Commission -- in the minutes you gave us, most of the decision was on the pond and that area. You know, they seem to be pretty highly concerned about it, also. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 47 MR. JONES: This is a little off the subject addressed, something you mentioned about the legislation. You recall we agreed in the Development Agreement that we would make the sidewalk meander? THE CHAIRMAN: Ri gh t. MR. JONES: Well, that got to DeLand and it will be a straight sidewalk. THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. MR. JONES: And there is nothing you can do about it. That's what McLemore brought up yesterday. He asked us would you rather deal with the eity or DOT because you can't this is kind of a mutual agreement here that is a marriage that You want it and we will be good for both of us. would like to have it, too. THE CHAIRMAN: I know he was certainly working in that area, you know and like you say we can't tell them. Nobody is going to tell them what to do. Anything else? If not I will go into the public input. I would like for you to give your name and address for the record. Mr. Jensen first, please. MR. JENSEN: My name is Lee Jensen. I live ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 48 at 134 Nandina Terrace in Howell Creek Reserve. I'm the Vice-president of the Board of Howell ereek Reserve Association. We're still under builder control, but I'm on the Board with the builder. We have worked with Mr. Jones for several months. He has made many concession to the plans, no doubt about that. He's met with the homeowner's once prior to the initial meeting with the Commissioners and on October 5th the homeowner's met one last time to go over the plans and some of the issues. We have basically five issues, probably, four issues after today. The first one is we are still concerned with the building located 39 feet within the property line. That is pretty close to the homes that are there and while the landscaping is supposed to be mature landscaping we don't know -- and it's supposed to be clustered we still cannot visually tell how we would be blocked from that building. Thirty-nine feet is not far from the residents that back up along there. There is no trees or anything. Right now it is clear, open between the backyards and that building. So that was still a concern. The landscaping was a concern. We said we ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 49 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 would agree with Wax Myrtles. We talked to a landscaping professional and he thought, maybe, there was an alternative and Mike I think is Possibly we could still discus keeping that open. with him. We had asked for the residents, there's about five or six lots that backup to the complex. We asked for an eight foot wall in a letter -- this is all in a letter to Mr. Jones, our concerns. We were hoping to, maybe, go from six a foot wall to eight foot wall, possibly. Of course the wall will be stucco. That won't match with the red brick in front of Eagle's Watch. The new wall that we are building along Howell Creek Reserve, our entrances probably will not match with that wall that wall that will be going up on the beautification. there is a difference there. There was discussion with the Commissioners So and we just put in the letter they had asked they had asked if it's going to be a gated community and we were hoping ourselves that. Yes, it is upscale. There is supposed to be police officers living in there once it is occupied but we are wondering if it is really to going to be upscale, if it could be a gated community. So, it ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 50 is residents only and we are a gated community where we live, too. And the last one I can't get an answer is the lighting. We don't know the lighting in the parking 10ts, how that will affect us. Supposed to be shoebox type lighting. I don't know how much lighting is going to come over into the community. And those are basically the concerns that we addressed with Mr. Jones and he wrote us back whether he can or can't do it. We just want to make it known. THE eHAIRMAN: Is that the lighting in the apartment complex or lighting in the Kash n'Karry parking lot? MR. JENSEN: Yeah, the parking lot lighting. THE CHAIRMAN: In the apartment -- MR. JENSEN: Yeah, the parking lot light, yes, on the other side of the retention pond. It is that shoebox style lighting. I don't know if that is down lighting. We still don't know what kind of effect that is going to have. THE eHAIRMAN: Okay. Anything else, sir? MR. JENSEN: No, that is it. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much, appreciate you coming forward. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( , 51 1 MR. JONES: May I address some of those 2 things? 3 Certainly, sure, certainly you THE CHAIRMAN: 4 can. 5 In the tree he is talking, about MR. JONES: 6 and I didn't tell you, number one, the City doesn't 7 allow an eight foot wall. We litigated that 8 already. You remember. So, we can't do an eight 9 foot wall. That is also against code and it costs 10 the City a couple hundred thousand dollars the last 11 time we got into that little deal if you remember 12 over Dunbar. 13 Secondly, the architect probably didn't take 14 into consideration this is fully, weekly maintained 15 area, the lawn maintenance crew which we agreed to 16 do the maintenance in the eity bond and, obviously, 17 we would be doing the maintenance. So, you're 18 architects concern that the Wax Myrtles would die 19 out and thin out may be correct. They may die out, 20 but because of the landscaping program we have, the 21 maintenance program we have they will be replaced. 22 That is part of keeping your business going. You 23 just don't let them die and not replace them. 24 He wasn't saying dying out. He MR. JENSEN: 25 said -- what he said is that at five years old, six ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( \ 52 1 years old then it gets thin and there would be less 2 dense and that's what he was saying. Well, it will 3 be dense for, maybe, four or five years as time 4 goes on it's less dense. 5 MR. JONES: Well and that is -- that's 6 correct if they are not maintained. I mean I've 7 got two on my back porch. They are pretty dense 8 because I maintain them, fertilize them. The point 9 is that it's a maintained area and if a tree dies 10 in your backyard or thins out it's going to be 11 replaced. We don't want an ugly tree there 12 either and we want something that serves the 13 purpose. 14 MR. JENSEN: It's going to be a commercial 15 association would be maintained by -- 16 It's not an association. It is MR. JONES: 17 maintained by the apartment complex and the people. 18 The security part of it there was some 19 concern voiced by the Commission and we don't want 20 a gated community. I mean your community is gated 21 and it is open all the time. So, we don't want a 22 gated community there. It doesn't serve in the 23 apartment complex, but we have committed to putting 24 in uniform police officers. We provided them a 25 place to live and they provided us security. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 53 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 And on the lighting that was brought up, too, before the Commission and I can't tell you anymore than what we told them. Again, I sent you copy of the type lighting and you're telling me it is down lighting, but if you can go to one of these complexes we have around town and check it. I invite you to do that. Where is the one we just had up here the other -- down south -- which one? A VOICE: Waterford Lakes. MR. JONES: Did you go by and look at that? MS. eAMPBELL: It is huge. It is three stories. It is big. MR. JONES: Okay. I am just addressing those particular points. THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you. Mr. Jones, while you are there where is this -- maybe, we -- you can help me out. Where is this 39B? MR. JONES: This unit right here, sir. This unit here. I want to show you -- well, we -- THE CHAIRMAN: I know you mentioned that you moved one. I didn't want you to have it resolved before I asked you about it. MR. JONES: Oh, I don't have the initial one's. That is here, but on the first plan that we ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 54 had there was a pond here. It is -- you see this building here, that building is considerably more than 39 feet and that was the way we planned it, designed it. You look up here at the pond, point one nine acres is the size of that retention pond which allowed us to move that building away from the baseline. You look at the plan we have today, size of the pond, it is twice that that's required by your code and your Water Management District in necessitating because we couldn't deal with DOT oh, we considered this concern of these people early on and would have left if there, but we -- you can't have everything. It is their request that we move the retention area back to this point and we did move the retention area back where they wanted and this retention area had to stay bigger which necessitated the move of the lake. There is certain setback on the retention. So, we considered that and we set up the way they wanted and we had to change it. That was not our doing. That building is actually 39 THE CHAIRMAN: feet way from the MR. JONES: Yes, sir. And I think their concern -- and certainly appreciate it. All we can ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( ( 55 1 tell you is we are going to give you 12 foot high 2 Wax Myrtles. If you have seen 12 foot high Wax 3 Myrtles they put out a pretty good bush. I can't 4 tell you what we will -- are going to do at the end 5 of this building because we don't know what you can 6 buy, how fast you can get it in and how fast you're 7 going to grow, but I told them we will work with 8 them on the type trees they wanted there. I don't 9 know what they want. We offered to give them fast 10 growing trees. Now, we can put the type called for 11 under the code. They don't grown very fast and 12 they don't give much cover, or we can give them 13 we know the Wax Myrtles and also point out that at 14 the end of this complex -- on the end of the 15 complex which would be this end would be facing 16 their property it is only two stories. So, we've 17 accommodated that concern. We have a window on 18 this side, one on the other side but we have 19 accommodated the two story on this end. 20 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you. Okay. 21 Lori eampbell, please. 22 MS. CAMPBELL: I'm Lori Campbell. I live at 23 118 Nandina Terrace and I'm a resident of Howell 24 Creek Reserve. First, I would like say I 25 appreciate Mike Jones and the developer bringing ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ~..-, 56 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 these plans initially to the commu~ity and givin~ us the opportunity to give some input. However, some of the concessions that were made were not because the community asked for it. They were forced because DOT didn't allow them to use a public retention pond. It only made good business sense to put a retention pond to buffer us, otherwise he would have our whole neighborhood here complaining about this. This is my first experience with City government. I do feel like you have been left out of the loop if I might say that. I'm a little disappointed that things aren't complete in the plans they brought before you. I fee 1 like it -- they kind of wasted your time. THE eHAIRMAN: It is preliminary engineering. We get an a lot of preliminary engineering. to go through again. I t has MR. CAMPBELL: Oh, it will come through you again? THE CHAIRMAN: Doesn't come through us again. It goes to the City Commission, but they are a little more stringent than we are because we are we follow the eity recommendations. We have to follow -- we cannot -- we certainly understand the ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 57 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 input by the public, but we can't let those feelings emotionally change us. We have to go on what the law of the City is for Land Development Codes and restrictions, you know signs and variances. They're the things that we look at. MS. CAMPBELL: Well, I have some concern I wanted to point out which our Vice-president already mentioned the one 39 feet from the property line. It is a three story building. Our community, our houses range from 175 even up to 300 plus and we're putting in what is called a luxury apartment complex, but the market will demand what is considered luxury. The rentals they are asking is not what I consider luxury. I do hope all of you would go down to Waterford Lakes and look at this apartment complex and think about it seriously before you make approval for it to go on to the Commissioner and if this is actually something that we want in Tuskawilla which is an upscale community and we are going to put in apartments that are going to bring down property values not only in Howell Creek Reserve, but in Chelsea Woods, all the homeowners along Vistawilla. but -- I can get off my soapbox on that ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( / 58 1 THE CHAIRMAN: You could ventilate. That is 2 why we are here. 3 I do have some direct MS. CAMPBELL: 4 questions for Mike Jones or the architect I do want 5 The stucco wallar masonry them to the answer. 6 type wall that they have planned along the 7 residential property which is the back end of 8 Courtney Springs. Right now they are saying masonry. Will it be finished on both sides? MS. VEAUDRY: Yes, it will. MS. CAMPBELL: And the masonry wall near the pool will be finished on both sides? MR. KOLB: Yes, it will be. 9 10 11 12 13 14 I would hope that the Planning MS. CAMPBELL: 15 and Zoning Board would make a recommendation that 16 those two areas are brick rather than stucco. They 17 are areas that do not -- aren't apparent I guess to 18 the apartment resident, but it does have impact on 19 our community. Our community has a brick wall in 20 the front and as we finish it out it will be brick 21 all the way around to our pool where right now we 22 have planned a stucco wall. To make it more 23 uniform on our benefit that wall should also be 24 brick and it will be esthetically pleasing to 25 anyone driving down Vistawilla brick waIl verses a ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 59 stucco wall. I am concerned about the apartment lighting and the overflow that was already brought up. If that -- I don't know how -- if that will be addressed here or not, but I would like you to know that our community, especially the seven homeowners that actually are adjacent to some of this property. And I also just wanted to bring to your attention that the plat of land that has the four apartment buildings closest to the Howell Creek Reserve eommunity is only like 340 feet wide; is that correct, Mr. Kolb? Mr. Kolb: (Nods head.) MS. CAMPBELL: And if you can visualize putting four three story apartment buildings in that smaIl piece of property I mean that is a lot to put in that area and have it adjacent to the residential community that is upscale and gated and it will have a direct impact on our community. Did they actually tell you the rent on the apartments? Did they give you the information? MR. STEPHENS: No. MS. CAMPBELL: I do have that information if you would be interested in knowing it just to let you know what an upscale apartment or what they are ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 60 calling upscale luxury apartment is. MR. FERNANDEZ: MS. CAMPBELL: Three hundred fifty a month? That's luxury to you? ut oh, we are in trouble here. MR. FERNANDEZ: A little humor there. MS. CAMPBELL: I'm trying to think what else. I want to answer you're question with regard to Kash n'Karry. I think it is a concern of the whole community that Kash n'Karry is not one of your better grocery stores. It is owned by Food Lion. I suggest that you do your research on Food Lion. It was rumored that they were trying to get rid of Kash n'Karry and I'd really be concerned that, maybe, it won't last very 10ng, maybe not. Do your research. Thank you for giving me your time, appreciate it. THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you very much and again, like I said, where we are tied into would be looking at a 10t of the technical issues. A lot of your concerns as I know -- I was highly involved with Tuskawilla many years ago and the Homeowners Association. I can understand the upscale neighborhood, a lot of things that can happen and, of course, I see this a 10t different in the fact that what it was going to be ten years ago and when ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( / \ 20 21 24 61 1 you move into a development, gated community you 2 don't realize apartments or other things are going 3 to go into those areas. There are a lot of 4 concerns you certainly ought to bring forth to the 5 eommission and make sure they are well aware of it 6 and I think they are well aware and like you heard 7 Mr. Jones say early between single and eight foot 8 walls there is requirements that we know and if 9 they meet those requirements as recommended by the 10 city to us, we look for other issues to further the 11 city to look into, but as far as the wall I'm sure 12 that whether it is brick or stucco as 10ng as it 13 meets the wind requirements and it is proper height 14 and so forth -- I remember those are things we look 15 I want you to understand that we are not at a lot. 16 not hearing. We certainly are hearing you. We 17 want you to know that. 18 Mr. Romulo eastellano, please. 19 MR. CASTELLANO: My name is Romulo, R-o-m-u-l-o, eastellano C-a-s-t-e-l-l-a-n-o. I live in 113 Nandina Terrace, Howell Creek Reserve. 22 I want to bring to your attention, obviously, you 23 have seen the plans, all the plans are very flat and it's difficult to picture for people how it is 25 going to look from the outside. There is a very ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 62 good example not far from here on 417, toll road, if you go down Red Bug you will see a mammoth size apartment complex, three store building next to a one story building which I don't know what it is doing next to it, but I hear about esthetics when they were looking for variance on the signage and my question would be what about esthetics concerning one story building against a three story building which is mammoth in size. I think if you have a chance please take your time, take a look over there. It has been said before and I want to bring this again for the most part all of the residents that live in Tuskawilla have chosen this community as a place of residency. They have investment of their life investment is going to be their home and they want to protect their prices somehow. This community that is going to be developed, this apartment complex plan is going to drop down the prices as Lori Campbell said before and something we will be interested to look something that nobody has mentioned is how's the apartment complex going to maintain their upscale look. Usually, as an apartment complex around the eity with competitive price that attraction of ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 63 apartment complexes will start decaying, soon prices will fall and that type of people that would be moving into the area would be decaying, as well. I just want to finish saying that the city of Winter Springs should belong to the residents and that development should be according to what the people want to see of their eity and it is up to you, basically, to decide what is the best for us. We hope we were not mistaken when we decided to move here. Thank you for your time. Thank you, sir very much, THE CHAIRMAN: appreciate that. Mr. Henry Goode. MR. GOODE: Good evening, my name is Henry Goode. I live at 120 Nandina Terrace and I have one of the properties adjacent to the apartment complex. And what I'd like to bring up, once again, I would like to reiterate our concerns for the esthetics of the project to make sure that -- not only for the houses that are adjacent to the property, but everyone who has to go by the properties will benefit by the landscaping that has been proposed. One of the things that we, unfortunately, don't get to look at too much is -- I'd love to see ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 64 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the size of the apartment complex here. We get a nice view you can see the approximate size of the car, but I would expect the apartment complex This is many things we are would be rather large. concerned with. As Romulo mentioned these are large . f! buildings, large buildings that's probably about six feet in height. That is about 12 feet in height so we're starting off with 12 foot shrubs. We have the majority of the building still sticking up. So, we want to be sure when we're addressing the landscape architecture that we're truly addressing the full esthetics, not only that it is pleasing and it is very well done. However, we would also like to know what will be clustered next to the building, how much of the building will be visible from adjacent streets. Those are the esthetic questions that trouble us continually and even though we are very grateful they worked with us, come to us and they have been working with us all along still have a few of those issues to address. One, for example, is the fence along the back, talk about a six foot masonry fence, but there is currently a six foot wood fence back ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 65 there. I've heard that, well, perhaps, this would be in place of that. Well, I'm not sure all of the people along the fence would go along with that and it certainly hasn't been discussed with all of the property owners. So, we do need to set their fence back. You have to maintain it. If you are going to have two fences parallel it has to be maintained. So how is that going to be addressed. Again, I want to consider the esthetics. Today is an auspicious day. As many of us know we got our tax assessment for our property today and so this esthetics is what we are paying for in Tuskawilla. We don't pay the cheapest taxes. We have great schools and great city of Winter Springs I'm contributing five hundred something dollars to this year. I want to make sure the City of Winter Springs does take into consideration the esthetics of my home directly behind one of these monsters as one of my neighbors calls them. So, let's take a look at the whole issue before we do anything. Thank you for your time. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir, appreciate that very much. I would like to repeat for the people that gave public input because it is very ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 66 important. You people you want to express your views. We hear them. We certainly understand and that is what we are going to hear in the next few minutes is what would or would not fall under the city code and the rules and regulations, but I think it is very important that you express your concerns. I know from the minutes some of you did and some did not to the City Commission, but these are elected officials. We are volunteers, appointed officials up here and we work with the City and eity's recommendations. We get into discussions with the eity on many occasions, but the eity keeps us in line with what the regulations are and we know the codes of the eity. As you heard Mr. Fernandez -- he is an attorney by trade and he certainly does a good and a fine job going through all the issues that go before us and very few things do slide by us that is in the code, but I would recommend very highly that you make it visible to the eity Commission when it goes back to the eity eommission your circumstances. I certainly feel what they are and I know what they are and basically that is my little scenario to you from the experience that I've had ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 67 with issues -- have had to take on hand and Mr. Stephen's is the President of the Association on the Ranchland area. So, he is familiar with a lot of things that you people are and we are all past Presidents of some type of homeowner's association. We know these feelings and again we want to express to you we highly understand what the City brings to us and we look to the eity to bring us the proper recommendation and we worked with Mr. LeBlanc many years and he has done an outstanding job working with us when we are favorable and unfavorable to some of his requests. Is there anything else from the Board you would like to bring up at this time now that you heard the public input? Mr. Stephens? MR. STEPHENS: I have a question about the concern about the fence making the part -- the fence that is adjacent to Howell ereek Reserve if they would consider making it brick to please you people living in that area. Is that a possibility? MR. JONES: Well, as Mr. Goode said he put five hundred dollars in the City last year. I'm proud of him for doing that. We are fixing to put a quarter of million in there. Why have some ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 , 68 rights, too. Give us back the buildings we will put a complete brick fence around the whole thing. You could only just squeeze so much blood out of this turnip. You got it all. It is economically impossible for us to put a brick wall, just impossible and maintain the other things you require us to do and we -- if we had back that other building and a half we have another story to talk about. We have more money that we can play and do. We don't have that building. We would like to do it, too. You know, as a homeowner involved with Homeowner's Association I've been through this just like you have many times and as you keep trying to point out and these people don't understand it. Some are new homes, first time home buyers, but I like to tell a story and Bill and I used to live in Altamonte Springs. We fought many battles together. City Commission, we would run around fighting developers coming in wanting to put in eight or ten units per acre, apartment complexes. We all showed up at city hall and raised so much cane and wasn't a lot of those buildings, you ride by the same place and there are 24 units sitting there instead of the eight or ten we beat down. We ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 c 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 69 have been there. We are -- we know what we are talking about. We are trying to offer you something here that we think is good for the community. It is a high level apartment complex. I'm sorry these people don't like Kash n'Karry and Food Lion. We didn't pick our buyer. I guess they all sell Heinz Ketchup and Merida bread. So it doesn't make a difference what brand it is to me. We are going to do the best we can and that is we agreed and Mr. McLemore insisted everything we see on the site plan will be put in the ground. Every tree you count on there will be put in the ground and that is what we will put on the Developer's Agreement and we committed to that. MR. STEPHENS: I have another question about the maintenance of -- Mr. Goode was concerned about maintenance of the fence and since it's parallel with some other fences that are there is that going to be a problem? MR. JONES: Not for us, we are going to put a wall up on our property. MR. STEPHENS: Maintaining both sides of it, will that be a problem? MR. JONES: No, that is not a problem. That is done all the time and I don't know about Mr. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 70 Goode, but if I were one of those property owners back there I would take down my wood fence that is going to rot down and take advantage of having a block wall there, but that is up to them. MR. FERNANDEZ: Mr. Chairman? THE eHAIRMAN: Mr. Fernandez? MR. FERNANDEZ: Mr. Jones, in the minutes I'm now reviewing from the City Commission meeting you made certain representations into your presentation and I just want to get on the record, I don't know if all these people were there or not. It is my understanding if you get your development order that the parcel to the rear behind the supermarket will be limited to professional offioe development? MR. JONES: That's correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: Are you proposing landscaping around the pond and putting in the fountain. MR. JONES: That went out the door. This is a new plan. That is not to say we won't put in the fountain and it is just not included in the plan. MR. FERNANDEZ: Okay. And you're going to work with Tuskawilla Homeowner's Association as to the reference, the location of the signage? MR. JONES: Nobody reminded me about that. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 71 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Who was with your -- I told you -- forgot that. Who was the former president. I talked to him. We agreed to work out a piece of property. THE CHAIRMAN: He has moved. He is gone. MR. JONES: Yeah, that's why I forgot this. We did make that commitment and we would also and I don't remember -- it would be the Eagle Watch side and we were going to try to work -- He probably wanted it down the THE eHAIRMAN: middle. MR. JONES: What did we tell you? Come on up. MR. WORLEY: Greg Worley, W-o-r-l-e-y. What they are talking about, Eagles Watch comes into play and, correct me if I'm wrong, there were two sets of brick walls and we talked about with Hess Mart. There's a -- either dry or wet retention pond here. We were discussing whether the wing wall was going to go before that pond and then you were. talking about bringing it in to behind the wing wall to be behind MR. JONES: MR. WORLEY: Okay. Behind the variance of where you were going to jockey trying to work esthetically between the parcel here and our parcel and then ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 / 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 72 working within your guidelines between the wetlands and Eagles Watch over here. MR. JONES: We agreed to put in two wing walls and you mentioned that awhile ago and it didn't dawn on me. That was part of the -- that was brought up as part of that beautification for their benefit. THE eHAIRMAN: Vistawilla would be considered under the beautification area. MR. LE BLANe: Hess would be building a wall. There is a retention pond. I don't remember if it's wet or dry. They are building a six foot masonry wall behind the pond. MR. MALAVE: Let's make it a little more clear. Right here is the -- if the end of the lot -- this is empty space right in this area that there is nothing there, right now in this area. We were going to get the property for the wall. We're not building the wall. We're giving the property, the property to locate the wall here and give them the easement to locate the second wing wall in this location. We were giving them the location, property and easements for that wall to be placed. Hess is building the wall. You're talking about the other wall, not the sign wall. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE eHAIRMAN: 73 How do they get that in there? Do they talk to Mr. Morris from Tuskawilla Homeowners? He is the president now. Discussion like this is not going to go anywhere into the record. MR. LE BLANC: The Commissioners would have it, these minutes -- by the way -- I should be getting a copy Friday, right, Mike? MR. JONES: Yes. MR. LE BLANC: And the eommission would be getting exactly what the young lady is doing, the other young lady. She is going to type up everything today, tonight, tomorrow night to have it here Friday morning so we can present it to the Commission with their package, verbatim minutes. THE CHAIRMAN: You want to go right up with this. You want to the move this right on in? MR. LE BLANC: That is provided you people approve it. I'm going to tell you what the CClmmission said. We used to move it without a copy of the minutes and now they want a copy of the minutes and that is why they will have that prior. THE eHAIRMAN: So, she is going to do it verbatim? MR. LE BLANe: She is doing it. Andrea got ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 .( 76 maybe; Omaybe I should, but in our -- I live in the Tuskawilla area. I live in a villa so it's a lot tighter. I don't live in one of these three hundred fifty thousand dollar homes. I live in the tennis villas which isn't too far from Vistawilla. It's about three minutes to get to the icecream place when they build it in the Hess. I have already driven it a few times so it's not my area. I live in a very tight community. And we have Castle Park which is in the Tuskawilla area. We had a lot of concerns about Castle Park and they have kept upscale communities in Tuskawilla with eastle Park so that is something to look at. They look like beautiful apartments. I don't know all the full details and, of course, I don't live 39 feet away from them either. I want you to understand that, but I also know it certainly looks like they put a lot of effort and time and looks like they are trying to negotiate with the public. And I can tell you one thing ten years ago it was a different story and Mr. Jones and Mr. McLemore, the City Manager at the present time had has strong feeling for the people and City of Winter Springs and he certainly does everything in ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 77 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the city's behalf to help the people. So, your concerns should go to th people and go to this C'::lmmission whether you have to meet with Mr. Jones and the eity for all these different types of i~:&sues . It can be resolved, not 100% for everybody. We all know that. I think there are things we have to do and I think that is the direction I would give you. What I look at is the variances that come up, myself personally and so does our Board and the gentlemen up here, I can tell you everyone of us are volunteers. We were appointed to these jobs by the eity eommission and we try to do the best we can and so we certainly have you people in heart and we certainly know what we are supposed to do and try to work with the developers because we want what we have here. is an upscale community. Mr. Fernandez? It MR. FERNANDEZ: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. THE CHAIRMAN: Yes, sir. MR. FERNANDEZ: I would like the ask of our staff representatives here insofar as any variances are concerned is this a matter that the P and Z Board or the Local Planning Agency should be making reGommendation to the City Commissioner, or is this ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 78 a matter that should be addressed to the Variance Board? Do why have a Variance Board? MR. LE BLANC: No, it's -- if you look at your development agreements on Section 2458 of the New Development Guidelines it talks about may vary standards -- Commission may vary standards of this Ordinance including building perimeter setbacks, parking standards, signs and other standards. MR. FERNANDEZ: All right. Where I'm sorry. was that? MR. LE BLANe: Section 20-458 and page 20. MR. FERNANDEZ: Mr. LeBlanc, are you, in fact, asking this Board to make recommendations? MR. LE BLANC: NO, sir. I just I'm not. brought it to your attention. MR. FERNANDEZ: I would note for the record after having had a chance to review the eity Co,mmission meeting after two unsuccessful motions that a consensus of the Commission was to move this project forward. So, the eity Commission who has more latitude and more discretion. As a matter of fact, our minutes even indicate that the City Attorney indicated that the eommission has -- does have some ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 79 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 discretion in looking at the development order, but at least the city Attorney at that point considered it to be a conditional use under Chapter 20 which needs to be applied for and brought before the City Commission and as I see it our function being less general and more restrictive with less discretion to determine whether or not it meets the Settleme~t Agreement as a result of a Court order, the Vested Rights Agreement, the Technical Review Committee or staff recommendation saying that it does at least insofar as certain changes to be presented in the final engineering plan, that it does meet the technical requirements of our City codes. I think that a representative from the Tuskawilla area ought to have the right to make the initial motion to address this matter to pass it on to the City Commission either with or without our rl~commendation and since we have two members from Tuskawilla I think they ought to make the motion, take the heat, too. She said that ain't going to THE CHAIRMAN: be her. Again, like I say I certainly spent a lot of time on this. I did not just come here. I know Mr. Fernandez spends an awful lot of time. I had ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 80 these things laying all over the garage. I retired from Westinghouse six months about six months ago so I have had a lot of time to look at this. I can be a real stickler. I went through the retention pond and had concerns about 434 and tell you the truth that -- there is only two or three places when you go to get down to it that you find out there was a community tucked in back in there. I wasn't aware of it that well until this afternoon. I saw it and I really got concerned and I thought, oh, boy, we're going to have a packed house tonight because it is a concern of many people. Mr. Goode mentioned about the trees and you're going to still see these apartments and I understand that and again to do our job and do it properly I don't see issues that we could turn it down on, basically. I think that it is the old story again. You have a torch to carry. You have to carry it. You have to carry it to the Commissioners. I think the city has done an outstanding job and it sounds like they are still de,ing a job. It rattles you at first think until you get used to it, but as Mr. LeBlanc said today we went ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( 81 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 through this last one. I spent the whole day. We had these over a week and a half, the information Mr. LeBlanc has gotten to us. We reviewed it. You've seen us shifting papers around. We looked through the old Tuskawilla PUD agreements. We looked at minutes and we didn't just come in here and just do this and we do this. Based on what has been presented to us by the City, if I can find your page, Mr. LeBlanc MR. LE BLANC: I just have one thing to add to that recommendation. THE CHAIRMAN: I didn't recommend anything. MR. LE BLANe: You said that's what you're looking for, the recommendation. I have one thing to add to that and that is contingent upon the City engineer's letter of October 20th where he says it can proceed forward, but the corrections have to be done on the final engineering, just the one page letter memo from the City. THE CHAIRMAN: You have all the attachments, you mean the October 20th, October 12th, 24th? MR. LE BLANe: This memo here. October 20th. From the City engineer. THE CHAIRMAN: MR. LE BLANe: Okay, right. Just add that one to the recommendation if you're going to use ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 82 it. THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. I will make a motion that the Planning Zoning Board accept the Staff R'Elview Board recommending that we favorably forward these plans to the City Commission for their action and included in that would be the October 20th, 1998 City Engineering memo to the land developin~ coordinator. Do I hear a second? They are going to dump this on Tuskawilla all the way and these people can come after us. Try it again, do I hear a second? MR. STEPHENS: Could you repeat the motion, please. THE CHAIRMAN: Make a motion that the Planning and Zoning Board favorably forward the plans to the City Commission for their action ana included MR. FERNANDEZ: Contingent upon -- THE CHAIRMAN: And in compliance with the October 20th, 1998 City Engineering memo to the Land Development Coordinator. MR. STEPHENS: I second. THE CHAIRMAN: Did Mr. Stephens second that? MR. FERNANDEZ: Yes, he did. ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 2 '. 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 83 THE CHAIRMAN: Roll call. MR. FERNANDEZ: Could we get some discussion? THE CHAIRMAN: Discussion, go ahead. MR. FERNANDEZ: As far as specific findings of fact to support this motion I think the Chair has indicated that we have reviewed the Settlement Agreement, the Vested Rights Permit, the reports from staff, the finding of the City Attorney that apartments are compatible and, apparently, discretionary within the eity Commission's viewpoint and that this project does meet the technical requirements for design of our current codes with the understanding that part of the settlement agreement indicated that since that settlement agreement occurred in 1990 and since the owner of this property had applied for certain rights to develop it before -- before we developed our comprehensive code and adopted it in 1992, that none of the changes after the 1990 Agreement would apply to this property other than the current d'9sign standards which we have already received input from staff have been met and based on those findings of fact and without any recommendations on variances and I'll leave that up to the City Commission to address in the Developer Order that I ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 . ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( . 84 would be in favor of recommending that this favorably be approved contingent upon the developer complying with the requirements of the city Engineer's letter of October 20th, '98. THE CHAIRMAN: Any other questions or ceJmmen ts? MR. FERNANDEZ: I believe this encompasses both parcels, Kash n'Karry and the apartment complex? MR. LE BLANC: Correct. MR. FERNANDEZ: We don't need to address them separately. THE CHAIRMAN: Roll call, Rosanne? MS. KARR: Pass. THE CHAIRMAN: You're present. Are you going to decline voting? She is going to really play it safe. You're present you got to vote. MS. KARR: Aye. THE eLERK: Carl Stephens, Jr? MR. STEPHENS: Aye. THE CLERK: Tom Brown. THE eHAIRMAN: Aye. THE CLERK: Bill Fernandez? MR. FERNANDEZ: Very affirmative, yes. THE CHAIRMAN: I would like to thank the ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 . ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 85 public this evening. I hope you pursue -- pursue your issues. And I would I would like to thank the gentlemen, Mr. Jones. I thank you for your time. Mr. LeBlanc, I would like to thank you and everyone else. (Whereupon, the meeting was concluded at 9:00 0' clock. ) ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 ( ( \ " . . 10 86 1 eERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 2 STATE OF FLORIDA 3 COUNTY OF SEMINOLE 4 I, Frances R. Dirienzo, Certified Shorthand 5 Reporter, CMR, certify that I was authorized to and did 6 stenographically report the foregoing proceedings and 7 that the transcript is a true and complete record of my 8 stenographic notes. 9 I further certify that I am not a relative, 11 employee, attorney, or counsel of any of the parties, 12 nor am I a relative or employee of any of the parties' 13 attorney or counsel connected 14 with the action, nor am I financially interested in the 15 action. 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Dated this the 29th day of October, 1998. FRANCES R. DIRIENZO, CSR, ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ,. 2 '. 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 74 a'~ay this time. THE CHAIRMAN: Is there anything else by the B()ard to bring up at this time. Is there anyone that would like to make a comment? My name is David Owji, O-w-j-i. I live in 104 Shellflower Cove and I'm a new resident. During the discussion there was a question toward Mr. Jones, someone asking if he would be able to helve a gated communi ty for the apartment complex and Mr. Jones answered that it wouldn't be pJ:actical. practical? I would like to elaborate why it is not MR. JONES: Well, it is not a residential unit like yours. We have 200 people going and cClming. It is just not practical to have a gated cc,mmunity in an apartment complex that size, number one. And, number two, there is one -- only one entrance to this community and so not like you have three or four entrances and trying to we have internal security and we don't feel like the gate is a practical thing to put up. Therefore, the residents MR. OWJI: Well, contrary to what you're saying I come from Virginia. ga. ted apartmen t communi ties. We see more and more I'm not sure if your ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 75 reason is a good reason. MR. JONES: Well, I'm sorry. you a better reason. MR. OWJI: Well, it is something up to the I can't give Commission. THE CHAIRMAN: For what it is worth Tuscany Place, they probably have two hundred and some and of course they are an older development and they put up gated communities. They did that on their own later on, ten years later, but they have gated communities. MR. JONES: Now, we have lot of gated communities. It also depends on the character and quality of the community, itself. THE CHAIRMAN: sUlggesting that. He is not out of line in MR. JONES: It was suggested before and you're not the first time it has come up, just something we are not agreeable to doing. THE CHAIRMAN: But I understand your point, too, take a dollar from here and have to -- I understand that. The people that actually live in there have done that, have put up their own gate. And one of the other things I have strong feelings for the public, I shouldn't have that ASSOCIATED COURT REPORTERS (407) 323-0808