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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2008 06 23 Consent 201 Requesting Approval Of The June 16, 2008 City Commission Workshop Minutes CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP JUNE 16, 2008 CALL TO ORDER The Workshop of Monday, June 16,2008 ofthe City Commission was called to Order by Mayor John F. Bush at 6:30 p.m. in the Commission Chambers of the Municipal Building (City Hall, 1126 East State Road 434, Winter Springs, Florida 32708). Roll Call: Mayor John F. Bush, present Deputy Mayor Donald A. Gilmore, present Commissioner Robert S. Miller, present Commissioner Rick Brown, absent Commissioner Sally McGinnis, present Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs, present City Manager Ronald W. McLemore, present City Attorney Anthony A. Garganese, present A moment of silence was followed by the Pledge of Allegiance. Mayor Bush recognized former Commissioners John Ferring, Michael S. Blake, and Larry Pellerin. Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Do you have any objection that we take the - Public Input?" Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs remarked, "I have no objection." No objections were voiced Mayor Bush opened "Public Input". Mr. Larry Pellerin, 116 South Moss Road, Winter Springs, Florida: spoke of the need for local Fire Department personnel; that time is of the essence for heart problems; of times he had called 9-1-1; and how one can't put a price on saving a life. Mayor Bush closed "Public Input". ~ ~ ~ ~ ~O ~ c:::'> ~""'>.1i ......-.'.'iJil ;!ft...",,,.,.,,., ..,.;j< ~,~:'..t\:;:.}f tf;':~.~~::~ CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JUNE 16,2008 PAGE 2 OF 9 INFORMATIONAL AGENDA INFORMATIONAL 100. Office Of The City Manager Requesting The City Commission To Discuss Fire Consolidation. A copy of a document entitled "Interlocal Agreement" was distributed and discussion ensued. City Manager Ronald W. McLemore explained, "I would need to point out to you that the instrument again, by which this would happen is a Contractual Agreement between us and the County. An Interlocal Agreement that sets out the expectations of the parties; what our specific requirements are on both sides; and this is a binding Agreement. It's not something that can be changed by the whim of the Commission at any point in time, and it requires mutual consent of both parties to change it and it is within this document that we talk about things like service levels, quality of service, and those kinds of things; so, it is clearly understood what the expectation is. It is also laid out in here that if these expectations are not met by either party, this Agreement can be undone with a two (2) year notice to the - two (2) Boards. With that in mind, let me mention that there are some issues - within the Fire Union that we are continuing to work with. The predominant issues have to be as we understand it - are with Pension issues; the process by which we would deal with that is we will - 1 already had one meeting with them. Weare required to meet with them at least once to talk about any concerns they have regarding the impact of Consolidation and to come back to you with our recommendations relative to that on matters of Pension. We'll meet agam. Then, those issues will be forwarded to the Pension Committee, according to your rules. It will go to them with our analysis of what's being requested. Then, they will come back to you with an Advisory Recommendation of what you should do with those issues. You, of course, are the final decision makers, and you will make those decisions at that point in time. Now 1 need to point out to you that those issues are going to be between us and the Union, not the County and the Union, nor us and the County. It's the entire points of the Interlocal Agreement contained within this Agreement. If there are other things that we want to do in addition to what's in this Agreement with our Fire people, that's between us and the Fire people. This is the full set of terms and conditions of this Agreement with the County." ~ ~ ~ ~ .~ ~." 1=::~~:;~:} CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JUNE 16,2008 PAGE30F9 Continuing, Manager McLemore noted, "There are a couple of changes which we'll talk about. The County will collect Fire Prevention Plan Review Fees established by the County and collected by the City for Plan Reviews. The Fire Marshall will go along to the County. He will though continue to review Plans and there is a Permit Fee for that. We will collect that for the County, and then remit that to them. The City will make space available in Community Development for the Plan Review by the County Fire Marshall, which we're already doing with the City Fire Marshall, so, really nothing changes there." Deputy Mayor Donald A. Gilmore commented, "When it comes to Plan Review, the County will review the Plans, but the City is responsible for the permitting process and the determination. Is this not correct or what? How are you going to work that?" Manager McLemore said, "We will be contracting with the County. There is an Agreement here - they are going to provide the service, just like we contract with other people now to provide Building Review services. They provide the service and we remit the Fee to them for that service. Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked, "Who will do the Inspections?" Manager McLemore responded, "On Fire Inspections? The County will." Deputy Mayor Gilmore then said, "The County will do all Fire Inspections?" Manager McLemore responded, "Correct. And we have an arrangement where with the County, some expectations about how quickly they will turn Plans around; and if they are unable to do that, then we can do that ourselves, if necessary. But, we've been assured that they really don't have any problems turning Plans around; but at least we have an Agreement to deal with a situation where they may have a real bubble in their Plan Review Process and just can't get to it; and we in that case, we can hire someone and provide that service." With further discussion, Manager McLemore explained, "All employees will be County employees, no joint employment positions will be allowed. Tenure and grade will be transferred as it relates to promotion and advancement. If they have ten (10) years here, they go to the County for the purposes of promotion and advancement, they will show ten (10) years of service, in competition with other people for that position. All employees will be placed on appropriate County pay ranges according to their rate of pay as of October 1 S\ 2008. Any employees' pay that needs to be increased to get to the minimum or the appropriate County range, will be increased to do so." 'L ~ ~ ~c; ;g c:::> ~ ~ t=~ CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JUNE 16,2008 PAGE 4 OF 9 Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked about employees being transferred according to their rate of pay. Manager McLemore pointed out, "The County has ranges established for all their positions, just like we do, and there are rates of pay established within those ranges. So, they have to go to at least the front of the range, if their range is ten percent (10%) higher than ours. Let's say a Fireman, their range was ten percent (10%) higher than our Fireman range; they are going to go to at least the front of that range. Now, if their current rate of pay is sufficient to put them on that range, without an increase in pay, then that's what will happen. Continuing, Manager McLemore noted, "Well, both ways, if they are a Fireman here, they are going to be a Fireman there. It's just they go on their Fireman range, rather than on our Fireman range, which could cause them to have an increase in pay to get them onto that range. If their current rate of pay is sufficient to put them on that range, without an increase, then that will be their rate of pay." Commissioner Krebs asked if there were any compression problems in Seminole County? Mr. Tad Stone, Department Director, Department of Public Safety, Seminole County, 150 Bush Boulevard, Sanford, Florida: responded by saying, "We have some compression - issues at the top end of our rank structure. But through the Firefighter ranks, it seems to be spread out fairly well." Discussion. Commissioner Krebs asked Manager McLemore if the current compression issues in our Fire Department were adjusted, would Fire personnel go to Seminole County at a different rate? Manager McLemore remarked, "Under our Contract - the pay range that they are receiving, is what they're going to take with them - is what they're going to be paid at the County unless they have to raise them to get them into that range." Continuing, Commissioner Krebs asked if the City could correct the issue before Fire personnel went to Seminole County? Manager McLemore said, "It's really a question for the County to answer. My understanding is that the County has costed out - this whole Agreement is based on a number of different costs. They have all been put together to come to a cost that the County could absorb. Now, whether they would be willing to absorb increases in our Pay Plan with this current year would be an interesting question - I don't know the answer to that. " ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ c::":;) ~ ~:I t:::J CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JUNE 16,2008 PAGE50F9 Commissioner Krebs added, "If we had an opportunity to correct the situation, if we could, and then how would that be taken care of through this Agreement?" Manager McLemore remarked, "The Agreement is set. They are going to get the pay that they are paying on October 2nd when they go. When they transfer, they are going to take what they are being paid with them." Commissioner Krebs added, "So, we have until October 2nd to change it?" Manager McLemore stated, "I am telling you that the County may want to reopen negotiations on that if it goes beyond the cost that they are able to absorb. I guess Tad (Stone) should respond to that again." Mr. Stone noted, "The numbers that I ran in developing the budget and the spending plan for this project were very tight to begin with, and if there is a large increase in any given area, that would change the entire numbers and the entire way that it works through the system. And, I would have to just report that to the Board and - let the Board of County Commissioners make that decision." Manager McLemore said, "I think the point here is they had the same Merit-based Plan that we have. It is not a longevity plan and you are not going to have that perfect longevity - in a Merit Plan." Continuing, Manager McLemore noted, "Beginning October 2nd, 2008, employees' Merit increases will be on the County Merit system obviously, and not on the City's Merit system." Further discussion ensued on Pension issues. Manager McLemore pointed out, "The employee has to make a decision whether he is going to go with the FRS (Florida Retirement System) plan or whether he is going to stay with our Plan. He cannot be in both. It is against the law. Now - if you choose to increase the benefits of those people who are remaining in our Plan, you're going to get the FRS (Florida Retirement System) rate from the County to pay for it. So, if your cost for that benefit you gave goes up and above the FRS (Florida Retirement System) rate, the City of Winter Springs is going to pay for it, not the County." With further comments, Deputy Mayor Gilmore inquired about employees who are not yet vested in our Plan? Manager McLemore answered, "If an employee is not vested in our Plan, and he elects to go to the County - no matter where he is in our Plan, he is going to have to work six (6) years to become vested in FRS (Florida Retirement System)." Further discussion. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ C~~ ~:i;;::.:-~ '.....~. ,,:L',,~:~~ ~7......';'''''')..:..a !'.'.::=, CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JUNE 16,2008 PAGE 6 OF 9 Mr. Stone explained further about the FRS (Florida Retirement System) Plan and remarked, "There is the ability for the employee to buy up to five (5) years of service. If they have not, they can take the money that they receive from the City if they move out with their contribution and then buy into the system, but the State does allow for you to buy five (5) years of service within a municipality or other agency or other State for that matter, and buying into the system." Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked what the vested period was? Mr. Stone said that the County is six (6) years. Manager McLemore noted, "Ours escalates with time. It's three (3), four (4), five (5), six (6), seven (7) and then you are fully vested - for vesting purposes at seven (7). Deputy Mayor Gilmore suggested the employees be assisted with getting them vested. Discussion continued. Manager McLemore noted that "A lot of this - will go to be played out in front of your Pension Board and - come back to you and circulate back to you with Advisory Recommendations. " Further discussion. Commissioner Krebs asked if this Agreement can be terminated by either party with or without reason? Manager McLemore responded, "I don't think any reason is required. If you don't want to do it anymore, you just give Notice." Manager McLemore said, "Whatever pay they have on October 1, they are going to transfer to the County on October 2. The only change is going to take place are those people that have to be bumped up in order to get them on to the range - on October 2nd, they no longer will have to deduct from their pay the three percent (3%) contribution to Retirement - so that in effect becomes - the effect of it is to be money in their pocket." Next, Manager McLemore noted, "There are going to be County employees, they will not have a Bargaining Unit in the City of Winter Springs." Manager McLemore explained that they will be represented by the Board of Trustees and the City Commission. Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked if an employee wanted to buy into the County's Florida Retirement System and had a few years to still become vested, could the City assist them, perhaps by - implementing some kind of a program? Deputy Mayor Gilmore added that he would be in favor of such a program. Manager McLemore said "The City has the right to provide to them whatever you want to provide to them." Deputy Mayor Gilmore then suggested a loan or something similar be considered. ~ ~ ~ ....~ I"""C:J :;:d c:> ~ ~ t::::..:t CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JUNE 16,2008 PAGE70F9 Furthermore, Manager McLemore said, "But just be aware that the County is not going to pay for it. They are going to pay only up to the FRS (Florida Retirement System) rate. And I've cautioned you about creating an on-going continuous burden on our - Retirement system, because of the fluctuation of that rate. Now, that doesn't mean it isn't something that can't be talked about, because you have that right." Manager McLemore commented, "I would suggest to you that it can be entertained before your Pension Board and you should get an Advisory recommendation from them. But, you can't be in two (2) Pension Plans at one (1) time - either you get a benefit from this Pension Plan or you get a benefit from that Pension Plan. It's not blended." Tape I/Side 8 On the subject of response times, Mr. Stone explained, "We strive to maintain a five (5) minute response time, county-wide. That's one of our goals, and one we try to maintain on a regular basis." Commissioner Sally McGinnis remarked that, "There seems to be a perception or a fear from people that they will 'Lose their local Fire personnel, our local'. Now, it is my understanding that the - personnel that are in Winter Springs will continue to be working in Winter Springs, probably..." Mr. Stone noted, "...Probably." Commissioner McGinnis continued, "I know that is no guarantee, but it is not going to be a massive pull-out and all these new people come in. Is that correct?" Mr. Stone responded by saying, "Probably. That's correct. Initially we will rotate some of our folks through; we'll rotate some of your - folks out, just to let them get a better feeling. You are going to have some of your younger, more aggressive Firefighters want to be in the very high activity stations - where the action is." Much discussion. Manager McLemore said, "What makes this situation unique, is that we're already integrated at the operational level - nothing is going to change relative to current deployment of apparatus and manpower." Further discussion followed on 9-1-1 and other services. Mr. Kevin Smith, Director, General Services Department reviewed related costs with the City Commission. . : ~ ~ !~ ~. ~ c:;;;;. ~;:;~ ~;;~ t,;::J CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JUNE 16,2008 PAGE80F9 Discussion. Manager McLemore summarized that "Your employees will be better off with the County in terms of the efficiency of utilization of resources that are available on our system as a much larger and more diversified tax base. Their pay scales are higher; their Retirement benefits are much better." In other City business, Mayor Bush recognized a Boy Scout who was in attendance. Commissioner Krebs mentioned a Town Hall Meeting she was holding on June 22nd, 2008 at the Highlands Clubhouse. Commissioner McGinnis noted, "When we went through this before, I thought we decided as a Commission, that when we had a Town Hall Meeting or something, a community meeting like that, if we did it as a Commission, Staff would be involved. If we did not do it as a Commission, then Staff would not be involved." Manager McLemore noted, "That is the way I remembered it." Commissioner Krebs explained, "It was an invitation. And, if Staff wanted to be there, that was great." Commissioner McGinnis added, "A Volunteer is a Volunteer though." Commissioner Krebs said, "Well, that is fine. And, as a matter of fact, at the last Town Hall style meeting, we will call it - I had noticed there were questions for Parks - and there were questions about Police, just general questions and I thought it would be nice to invite anybody who wished to come or could come for two (2) hours to talk to the residents." Furthermore, Manager McLemore remarked, "For me to direct Staff to be there, of course it would have to be a decision of the Commission. Now, people who want to volunteer to go there, that's another matter." Further discussion. In other City matters, Commissioner McGinnis ~tated, "I would like to revisit our Meeting time. We have tried the 5:15 [p.m.]." Mayor Bush suggested to Commissioner McGinnis, "Bring it up under your Seat." Commissioner McGinnis remarked, "I will." Commissioner Robert S. Miller recommended, "Put it on the Agenda." Manager McLemore then noted, "If it is the Consensus of the Commission, we can put it on an Agenda for action." Regarding a Consensus, Commissioner Miller said, "Aye." Commissioner Krebs suggested, "I say bring it up if you want to," Commissioner Miller added, "Put it on the Agenda." Deputy Mayor Gilmore nodded in agreement. e==: ~ ~ ~ ~~3 ~-=' ~, ~;~~:~ ~~:'.o;':.L!U~ !'ili.,~"!;~," *~:'~,~'.~;~:~~~ CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JUNE 16,2008 PAGE 9 OF 9 ADJOURNMENT Mayor Bush adjourned the Workshop at 7:47 p.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED: ANDREA LORENZO-LUACES, CMC CITY CLERK APPROVED: MAYORJOHNF. BUSH NOTE: These Minutes were approved at the Regular City Commission Meeting. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~::t ~ ~ ~ fl:::,l CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP JUNE 16, 2008 CALL TO ORDER The Workshop of Monday, June 16, 2008 of the City Commission was called to Order by Mayor John F. Bush at 6:30 p.m. in the Commission Chambers of the Municipal Building (City Hall, 1126 East State Road 434, Winter Springs, Florida 32708). Roll Call: Mayor John F. Bush, present Deputy Mayor Donald A. Gilmore, present Commissioner Robert S. Miller, present Commissioner Rick Brown, absent Commissioner Sally McGinnis, present Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs, present City Manager Ronald W. McLemore, present City Attorney Anthony A. Garganese, present A moment of silence was followed by the Pledge of Allegiance. Mayor Bush recognized former Commissioners John Ferring, Michael S. Blake, and Larry Pellerin. Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Do you have any objection that we take the - Public Input?" Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs remarked, "I have no objection." No objections were voiced Mayor Bush opened "Public Input" Mr. Larry Pellerin, 116 South Moss Road, Winter Springs, Florida: spoke of the need for local Fire Department personnel; that time is of the essence for heart problems; of times he had called 9-1-1; and how one can't put a price on saving a life. Mayor Bush closed "Public Input ". CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP -JUNE 16, 2008 PAGE 2 OF 9 INFORMATIONAL AGENDA INFORMATIONAL 100. Office Of The City Manager Requesting The City Commission To Discuss Fire Consolidation. A copy of a document entitled "Interlocal Agreement" was distributed and discussion ensued. City Manager Ronald W. McLemore explained, "I would need to point out to you that the instrument again, by which this would happen is a Contractual Agreement between us and the County. An Interlocal Agreement that sets out the expectations of the parties; what our specific requirements are on both sides; and this is a binding Agreement. It's not something that can be changed by the whim of the Commission at any point in time, and it requires mutual consent of both parties to change it and it is within this document that we talk about things like service levels, quality of service, and those kinds of things; so, it is clearly understood what the expectation is. It is also laid out in here that if these expectations are not met by either party, this Agreement can be undone with a two (2) year notice to the -two (2) Boards. With that in mind, let me mention that there are some issues -within the Fire Union that we are continuing to work with. The predominant issues have to be as we understand it - are with Pension issues; the process by which we would deal with that is we will - I already had one meeting with them. We are required to meet with them at least once to talk about any concerns they have regarding the impact of Consolidation and to come back to you with our recommendations relative to that on matters of Pension. We'll meet again. Then, those issues will be forwarded to the Pension Committee, according to your rules. It will go to them with our analysis of what's being requested. Then, they will come back to you with an Advisory Recommendation of what you should do with those issues. You, of course, are the final decision makers, and you will make those decisions at that point in time. Now I need to point out to you that those issues are going to be between us and the Union, not the County and the Union, nor us and the County. It's the entire points of the Interlocal Agreement contained within this Agreement. If there are other things that we want to do in addition to what's in this Agreement with our Fire people, that's between us and the Fire people. This is the full set of terms and conditions of this Agreement with the County." C[TY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP -JUNE l6, 2008 PAGE 3 OF 9 Continuing, Manager McLemore noted, "There are a couple of changes which we'll talk about. The County will collect Fire Prevention Plan Review Fees established by the County and collected by the City for Plan Reviews. The Fire Marshall will go along to the County. He will though continue to review Plans and there is a Permit Fee for that. We will collect that for the County, and then remit that to them. The City will make space available in Community Development for the Plan Review by the County Fire Marshall, which we're already doing with the City Fire Marshall, so, really nothing changes there." Deputy Mayor Donald A. Gilmore commented, "When it comes to Plan Review, the County will review the Plans, but the City is responsible for the permitting process and the determination. Is this not correct or what? How are you going to work that?" Manager McLemore said, "We will be contracting with the County. There is an Agreement here -they are going to provide the service, just like we contract with other people now to provide Building Review services. They provide the service and we remit the Fee to them for that service. Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked, "Who will do the Inspections?" Manager McLemore responded, "On Fire Inspections? The County will." Deputy Mayor Gilmore then said, "The County will do all Fire Inspections?" Manager McLemore responded, "Correct. And we have an arrangement where with the County, some expectations about how quickly they will turn Plans around; and if they are unable to do that, then we can do that ourselves, if necessary. But, we've been assured that they really don't have any problems turning Plans around; but at least we have an Agreement to deal with a situation where they may have a real bubble in their Plan Review Process and just can't get to it; and we in that case, we can hire someone and provide that service." With further discussion, Manager McLemore explained, "All employees will be County employees, no joint employment positions will be allowed. Tenure and grade will be transferred as it relates to promotion and advancement. If they have ten (10) years here, they go to the County for the purposes of promotion and advancement, they will show ten (10) years of service, in competition with other people for that position. All employees will be placed on appropriate County pay ranges according to their rate of pay as of October 1 S~, 2008. Any employees' pay that needs to be increased to get to the minimum or the appropriate County range, will be increased to do so." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP -JUNE 16, 2008 PAGE 4 OF 9 Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked about employees being transferred according to their rate of pay. Manager McLemore pointed out, "The County has ranges established for all their positions, just like we do, and there are rates of pay established within those ranges. So, they have to go to at least the front of the range, if their range is ten percent (10%) higher than ours. Let's say a Fireman, their range was ten percent (10%) higher than our Fireman range; they are going to go to at least the front of that range. Now, if their current rate of pay is sufficient to put them on that range, without an increase in pay, then that's what will happen. Continuing, Manager McLemore noted, "Well, both ways, if they are a Fireman here, they are going to be a Fireman there. It's just they go on their Fireman range, rather than on our Fireman range, which could cause them to have an increase in pay to get them onto that range. If their current rate of pay is sufficient to put them on that range, without an increase, then that will be their rate of pay." Commissioner Krebs asked if there were any compression problems in Seminole County? Mr. Tad Stone, Department Director, Department of Public Safety, Seminole County, 1 SO Bush Boulevard, Sanford, Florida: responded by saying, "We have some compression - issues at the top end of our rank structure. But through the Firefighter ranks, it seems to be spread out fairly well." Discussion. Commissioner Krebs asked Manager McLemore if the current compression issues in our Fire Department were adjusted, would Fire personnel go to Seminole County at a different rate? Manager McLemore remarked, "Under our Contract -the pay range that they are receiving, is what they're going to take with them - is what they're going to be paid at the County unless they have to raise them to get them into that range." Continuing, Commissioner Krebs asked if the City could correct the issue before Fire personnel went to Seminole County? Manager McLemore said, "It's really a question for the County to answer. My understanding is that the County has costed out -this whole Agreement is based on a number of different costs. They have all been put together to come to a cost that the County could absorb. Now, whether they would be willing to absorb increases in our Pay Plan with this current year would be an interesting question - I don't know the answer to that." C[TY OF WINTER SPRMGS, FLORIDA MMUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP -JUNE 16, 2008 PAGE 5 OF 9 Commissioner Krebs added, "If we had an opportunity to correct the situation, if we could, and then how would that be taken care of through this Agreement?" Manager McLemore remarked, "The Agreement is set. They are going to get the pay that they are paying on October 2"d when they go. When they transfer, they are going to take what they are being paid with them." Commissioner Krebs added, "So, we have until October 2"d to change it?" Manager McLemore stated, "I am telling you that the County may want to reopen negotiations on that if it goes beyond the cost that they are able to absorb. I guess Tad (Stone) should respond to that again." Mr. Stone noted, "The numbers that I ran in developing the budget and the spending plan for this project were very tight to begin with, and if there is a large increase in any given area, that would change the entire numbers and the entire way that it works through the system. And, I would have to just report that to the Board and -let the Board of County Commissioners make that decision." Manager McLemore said, "I think the point here is they had the same Merit-based Plan that we have. It is not a longevity plan and you are not going to have that perfect longevity - in a Merit Plan." Continuing, Manager McLemore noted, "Beginning October 2"d, 2008, employees' Merit increases will be on the County Merit system obviously, and not on the City's Merit system." Further discussion ensued on Pension issues. Manager McLemore pointed out, "The employee has to make a decision whether he is going to go with the FRS (Florida Retirement System) plan or whether he is going to stay with our Plan. He cannot be in both. It is against the law. Now - if you choose to increase the benefits of those people who are remaining in our Plan, you're going to get the FRS (Florida Retirement System) rate from the County to pay for it. So, if your cost for that benefit you gave goes up and above the FRS (Florida Retirement System) rate, the City of Winter Springs is going to pay for it, not the County." With further comments, Deputy Mayor Gilmore inquired about employees who are not yet vested in our Plan? Manager McLemore answered, "If an employee is not vested in our Plan, and he elects to go to the County - no matter where he is in our Plan, he is going to have to work six (6) years to become vested in FRS (Florida Retirement System)." Further discussion. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP -JUNE I6, 2008 PAGE 6 OF 9 Mr. Stone explained further about the FRS (Florida Retirement System) Plan and remarked, "There is the ability for the employee to buy up to five (5) years of service. If they have not, they can take the money that they receive from the City if they move out with their contribution and then buy into the system, but the State does allow for you to buy five (5) years of service within a municipality or other agency or other State for that matter, and buying into the system." Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked what the vested period was? Mr. Stone said that the County is six (6) years. Manager McLemore noted, "Ours escalates with time. It's three (3), four (4), five (5), six (6), seven (7) and then you are fully vested -for vesting purposes at seven (7). Deputy Mayor Gilmore suggested the employees be assisted with getting them vested. Discussion continued. Manager McLemore noted that "A lot of this -will go to be played out in front of your Pension Board and -come back to you and circulate back to you with Advisory Recommendations." Further discussion. Commissioner Krebs asked if this Agreement can be terminated by either party with or without reason? Manager McLemore responded, "I don't think any reason is required. If you don't want to do it anymore, you just give Notice." Manager McLemore said, "Whatever pay they have on October 1, they are going to transfer to the County on October 2. The only change is going to take place are those people that have to be bumped up in order to get them on to the range - on October 2nd they no longer will have to deduct from their pay the three percent (3%) contribution to Retirement - so that in effect becomes -the effect of it is to be money in their pocket." Next, Manager McLemore noted, "There are going to be County employees, they will not have a Bargaining Unit in the City of Winter Springs." Manager McLemore explained that they will be represented by the Board of Trustees and the City Commission. Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked if an employee wanted to buy into the County's Florida Retirement System and had a few years to still become vested, could the City assist them, perhaps by -implementing some kind of a program? Deputy Mayor Gilmore added that he would be in favor of such a program. Manager McLemore said "The City has the right to provide to them whatever you want to provide to them." Deputy Mayor Gilmore then suggested a loan or something similar be considered. CITY OF W[NTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP -JUNE 16, 2008 PAGE 7 OF 9 Furthermore, Manager McLemore said, "But just be aware that the County is not going to pay for it. They are going to pay only up to the FRS (Florida Retirement System) rate. And I've cautioned you about creating an on-going continuous burden on our - Retirement system, because of the fluctuation of that rate. Now, that doesn't mean it isn't something that can't be talked about, because you have that right." Manager McLemore commented, "I would suggest to you that it can be entertained before your Pension Board and you should get an Advisory recommendation from them. But, you can't be in two (2) Pension Plans at one (1) time -either you get a benefit from this Pension Plan or you get a benefit from that Pension Plan. It's not blended." Tape 1/Side B On the subject of response times, Mr. Stone explained, "We strive to maintain a five (5) minute response time, county-wide. That's one of our goals, and one we try to maintain on a regular basis." Commissioner Sally McGinnis remarked that, "There seems to be a perception or a fear from people that they will `Lose their local Fire personnel, our local'. Now, it is my understanding that the -personnel that are in Winter Springs will continue to be working in Winter Springs, probably..." Mr. Stone noted, "...Probably." Commissioner McGinnis continued, "I know that is no guarantee, but it is not going to be a massive pull-out and all these ne~~~ people come in. Is that correct?" Mr. Stone responded by saying, "Probably. That's correct. Initially we will rotate some of our folks through; we'll rotate some of your -folks out, just to let them get a better feeling. You are going to have some of your younger, more aggressive Firefighters want to be in the very high activity stations -where the action is." Much discussion. Manager McLemore said, "What makes this situation unique, is that we're already integrated at the operational level -nothing is going to change relative to current deployment of apparatus and manpower." Further discussion followed on 9-1-1 and other services. Mr. Kevin Smith, Director, General Services Department reviewed related costs with the City Commission. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP -JUNE 16, 2008 PAGE 8 OF 9 Discussion. Manager McLemore summarized that "Your employees will be better off with the County in terms of the efficiency of utilization of resources that are available on our system as a much larger and more diversified tax base. Their pay scales are higher; their Retirement benefits are much better." In other City business, Mayor Bush recognized a Boy Scout who was in attendance. Commissioner Krebs mentioned a Town Hall Meeting she was holding on June 22nd 2008 at the Highlands Clubhouse. Commissioner McGinnis noted, "When we went through this before, I thought we decided as a Commission, that when we had a Town Hall Meeting or something, a community meeting like that, if we did it as a Commission, Staff would be involved. If we did not do it as a Commission, then Staff would not be involved." Manager McLemore noted, "That is the way I remembered it." Commissioner Krebs explained, "It was an invitation. And, if Staff wanted to be there, that was great." Commissioner McGinnis added, "A Volunteer is a Volunteer though." Commissioner Krebs said, "Well, that is fine. And, as a matter of fact, at the last Town Hall style meeting, we will call it - I had noticed there were questions for Parks -and there were questions about Police, just general questions and I thought it would be nice to invite anybody who wished to come or could come for two (2) hours to talk to the residents." Furthermore, Manager McLemore remarked, "For me to direct Staff to be there, of course it would have to be a decision of the Commission. Now, people who want to volunteer to go there, that's another matter." Further discussion. In other City matters, Commissioner McGinnis stated, "I would like to revisit our Meeting time. We have tried the 5:15 [p.m.]." Mayor Bush suggested to Commissioner McGinnis, "Bring it up under your Seat." Commissioner McGinnis remarked, "I will." Commissioner Robert S. Miller recommended, "Put it on the Agenda." Manager McLemore then noted, "If it is the Consensus of the Commission, we can put it on an Agenda for action." Regarding a Consensus, Commissioner Miller said, "Aye." Commissioner Krebs suggested, "I say bring it up if you want to." Commissioner Miller added, "Put it on the Agenda." Deputy Mayor Gilmore nodded in agreement. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP -JUNE 16, 2008 PAGE 9 OF 9 ADJOURNMENT Mayor Bush adjourned the Workshop at 7:47 p.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED: r ORENZO-LUACES, CMC CITY LERK APPROVF, D: M OR JnHN P. BUSH NOTE: These Minutes were approved at the June 23, 2008 Regular City Commission Meeting.