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HomeMy WebLinkAbout_2006 07 17 City Commission Workshop Minutes CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP JULY 17,2006 CALL TO ORDER The Workshop of Monday, July 17,2006 of the City Commission was called to order by Mayor John F. Bush at 6:04 p.m. in the Commission Chambers of the Municipal Building (City Hall, 1126 East State Road 434, Winter Springs, Florida 32708). Roll Call: Mayor John F. Bush, present Deputy Mayor Michael S. Blake, arrived at 6:25 p.m. Commissioner Robert S. Miller, present Commissioner Donald A. Gilmore, present Commissioner Sally McGinnis, present Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs, arrived at 6: 17 p.m. City Manager Ronald W. McLemore, present City Attorney Anthony A. Garganese, absent A moment of silence was followed by the Pledge of Allegiance. Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Did you see the letter from Diane Parker, the President of the Seminole County Regional Chamber, about the - Seminole HobNob." Mayor Bush continued, "They are asking if we want to set up a table?" Commissioner Sally McGinnis stated, "I haven't seen the letter, but I think we should definitely have a table." Mayor Bush then said, "We've got Commissioner Gilmore, "Okay?" No objections were voiced. Mayor Bush stated, "Andrea (Lorenzo-Luaces, City Clerk), do you want to respond to this? Tell them we'll be there. See that they get a one hundred dollar ($100.00) deposit- check. " Mr. Jim Brown introduced the Winter Springs Girls' Softball Team and stated, "Yesterday we beat a team from Jacksonville in the State Championship and we'll be traveling next week to Richmond, Virginia to play in the Southeast Regional Final which we'll meet up with other State champions. So, Winter Springs, this is the first girl's championship team from Winter Springs, so we're very proud of them." Mayor Bush stated, "Also, they're here to ask for some support to help fund the trip to Virginia." Mayor Bush then asked, "And whom do we make out the check? Mr. Brown stated, "Winter Springs Youth Sports." Mayor Bush then suggested that the Commissioners also support this team. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17, 2006 PAGE 2 OF 15 Commissioner Joanne M Krebs arrived at 6: 17 p.m. Discussion ensued on whether the City had a Flag, to which Mayor Bush stated, "We need to get a flag." Deputy Mayor Michael S. Blake arrived at 6:25 p.m. INFORMATIONAL AGENDA INFORMATIONAL 500. Office Of The City Manager Budget Review. City Manager Ronald W. McLemore began the Budget discussion. Discussion then ensued on the Cody Study. Mayor Bush stated, "Commissioner Miller, Commissioner Gilmore, nor I, have copies of it." Discussion. Manager McLemore said, "Let's talk about Saturday, is everybody going to be here?" Commissioner Blake, or do you want to reschedule that?" Mayor Bush said, "I think we all agreed to be here." Commissioner Krebs inquired, "What was the date we needed to set our Tentative Millage?" Manager McLemore stated, "We'll actually have it to you at your next Meeting. " Discussion. Tape lIS ide B Further discussion ensued on salary ranges. Manager McLemore explained, "The rules of the plan are that once you reach the top of your range, let's say - the range furlS from forty thousand dollars to seventy thousand dollars ($40,000.00 - $70,000.00), once you reach the top of that range, then at that point in time, you don't get a percentage increase anymore, unless it's a really unusual situation." Commissioner Krebs said, "Until the next Cody Study?" Manager McLemore stated, "Yes, but you will get a bonus. It will come to you as a bonus and not as a percent increase in your base." Commissioner Krebs then asked, "Do we know the percentage of employees that are mid-point, or lower mid-point, or higher, or at top pay? Do we know that percentage?" Manager McLemore replied, "I do have a list of those. And I sent those to your Consultant this year to try to get rid of most of those, as we could. And I think we probably have taken care of most of them this time." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17, 2006 PAGE 3 OF 15 Discussion. Regarding "Compression", Manager McLemore said to Commissioner Krebs, "If you could come in and spend some time with me, I will show you some examples of all these things." Commissioner Krebs stated, "I did try and call your office." Manager McLemore noted, "We have plenty of time - I have got some good material." Discussion continued on the competitiveness of salaries, other municipalities, and jurisdictions. Commissioner Krebs said, "And your question, and just for the Record, you know I understand that I have this big pot of money that I am partially responsible, I am one fifth of making sure, budgeting out. But I also have that same responsibility to my employer - the citizens of the City of Winter Springs, to keep our employees here with fairness and the experience that I think they deserve also." Discussion. Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "When we do the annual Merit evaluation, have you ever broken down the percentage either by Department or by the City overall as to what portion of the employees have been here longer than a year - received the two percent (2%), or the four percent (4%) or the six percent (6%) merit increase?" Manager McLemore asked, "Let me see if I understand your question, what percentage by experience, by getting what percent increase?" Deputy Mayor Blake stated, "Yes." Manager McLemore replied, "We've done that analysis several times. And I can't tell you that it relates to tenure, how long you've been here. I don't think you'd find a real correlation there. By and large, most people tend to get the thought, we funded it, if you recall, the last two (2) years, everything's totally funded." Deputy Mayor Blake stated, "No. That's not correct." Manager McLemore replied, "Yes. We're fully funded last year." Deputy Mayor Blake said, "We funded at four percent (4%)." Manager McLemore said, "We fully funded at four percent (4%) so everybody could get four percent (4%)." Deputy Mayor Blake said, "But everybody can't get six percent (6%)." Manager McLemore said, "We don't have six percent (6%) anymore." Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "When did we stop having six percent (6%)? Last two (2) years when we were - using it to fund the additional contributions of the Pension Plan, but that was for a two (2) year time frame." Manager McLemore said, "We have two (2) more years in that Pension funding Plan." Deputy Mayor Blake said, "My recollection is that we were only doing that for two (2) years in terms of the reduction in the top merit increase that was available. I could be wrong on that, but that's my memory." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17.2006 PAGE 4 OF 15 Manager McLemore said, "For the - time until we could implement that full half percent (1/2%) three (3) years in a row." Deputy Mayor Blake said, "I remember in terms of the contribution, the additional level of contributions that we were putting in taking four (4) years, but in terms of the employees share on that, in other words, the reduction of the top raise that was available, 1 thought that was only two (2) years that we were not giving that Plan. The record will show whatever it is. That's what 1 remember, if we could check on that please." Furthermore, Manager McLemore noted, "That is a question, if you want to go back to that six percent (6%) or not, that is a Policy decision I'd have to know." Deputy Mayor Blake stated, "Just get us the record on it please." Deputy Mayor Blake continued, "And if we could figure out, or take a look at, what you've done, what kind of work has been done in the past, to determine what share of the employees, and again, either by Department or City-wide, are getting what types of raises. What does that bell curve look like?" Manager McLemore said, "I'll see if 1 can find that data. 1 haven't done it in the last two (2) years because it was fully funded, but I'll try to get something on that." With further comments, Deputy Mayor Blake stated, "I didn't see any indication that they looked at things such as the distribution within the ranges and these other locations and what the demographics would look like from within each range, qualifications, how long has an employee been there - how much experience do they have in the line of work, whether or not they have only been there two (2) years or - they have ten (10) years of experience. Any kind of formulation from that, because 1 don't see it in the report and 1 don't really see it in the discussion of it." Manager McLemore replied, "No that is not done - I'll have to ask whether they have it in their database. 1 don't think they would have it to that extent." Continuing, Deputy Mayor Blake said, "Range distribution is part of it but it is also an understanding why that distribution is as it is, because if we are competing out there, the reality is that we're competing for an individual with a certain set of experience, certain skill set, a certain history versus what that would be worth in the marketplace elsewhere - either in market or out of market; these are all predominantly in-market jobs so we are not looking outside. And 1 think that is a really important piece of data and part of, 1 think, from what 1 hear the argument is. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17,2006 PAGE 5 OF 15 We can build a range and we can certainly say that looking at a distribution of communities similar to ours, in our area, that a position starts at some level - let me rephrase that, that salary ranges that exist, start at a certain level and then end at a certain level, whether or not there are any actual employees within that range or where they are within that range is not data that we're looking at. So really what we're doing is a salary range study to see where we fit in. But in actuality some of these ranges are narrower than others, but some are just extraordinarily broad - here's one that's fifty percent (50%) and I think I saw some that were greater up to seventy percent (70%) or seventy five, approaching seventy-five percent (75%) - you know there some going from forty to seventy (40-70), which would be a pretty big number. But it doesn't tell us anything about where in that range because where somebody, whether somebody's at the twentieth percentile within the range, or the twenty-fifth percentile range, can be a huge difference in terms of our competitive stance in the marketplace. And also, ultimately has a real difference in our bottom line budget. What we're spending also. So what work are we doing there to determine not just what the range should be, but how we should implement the range with the employees that we have?" With further discussion, Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "What portion of our employees with ten (l0) years or more experience are at or above the mid range?" Manager McLemore remarked, "I'd have to find out for you." Discussion. Deputy Mayor Blake said, "And where did those numbers come from? Where did that salary schedule of ranges come from?" Manager McLemore said, "That comes from Cody [& Associates] and normally starts at minimum wage or right around it. The lowest, it normally will reflect the lowest pay grade, the lowest job classification which normally will tend to be somewhere around minimum wage. In other words, if you take the lowest, I go out and look at all these jobs and the one that's the lowest one rated in the market place is going to become the bottom. And then you start building on top of that." Deputy Mayor Blake remarked, "So what happens is we don't actually adjust the ranges, we just assign new pay grades per position." Manager McLemore said, "Right. Now they will go up sometimes when the bottom range job goes up, when that bottom goes up; or if your minimum wage goes up. The bottom of that range has got to go up to reflect minimum wage." Deputy Mayor Blake noted, U] would really like to see the break down distribution of where folks are within ranges." Commissioner Krebs said, "Me too." Commissioner McGinnis stated, "Yes." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17, 2006 PAGE 6 OF 15 Tape 2/Side A Deputy Mayor Blake said, "Hopefully we have a benefits package that helps to retain people and entice people and attract them here as well. I understand that." In asking for "real data", Deputy Mayor Blake added, "And the real key is the amount of experience that people have and where they fall in the range. I think that data helps to understand what the real 'Compression' issue might be and put us in a position to make some Policy decisions that can help to fix that." Commissioner Krebs said, "I agree." Furthermore, Deputy Mayor Blake said, "I am asking for information for myself. If any other Commissioner would like to have it, they can certainly ask as well. Or they can ask to be copied on whatever I get." Commissioner McGinnis said, "I think we all ought to get a copy." Manager McLemore said, "If I understand, you want to know where each employee falls on the range relative to his tenure in that range." Deputy Mayor Blake said, "Correct." Discussion ensued on "Compression" issues. Commissioner Donald A. Gilmore said, "If they are fifteen percent (15%) into the grade at a 22 and that job is moved to a 23, why doesn't the person move fifteen percent (15%) into the 23. This is why we're getting this 'Compression'. We are moving the jobs, but we're not moving their penetration into that job." Further discussion. Continuing, Commissioner Gilmore said, "If I move the range ten percent (10%) and I have a person that is five percent (5%) into the old range and I move him five percent (5%) into the new range, they have moved accordingly on the same percentage basis. I have not penalized the individual. And that I think that is where we are getting into this salary 'Compression'." Manager McLemore said, "There is no question about it, that has led to salary 'Compression', but what happens is, if you do that, let's say you've got a guy who's seventy-five percent (75%) through his range, and the market place goes up for that job ten percent (10%). So are you going to give him a ten percent (10%) increase - the question is are you going to give him a ten percent (10%) increase?" Commissioner Gilmore said, "Yes. If the area survey shows that that job has, that value for that job has increased that percentage, I would certainly think that that person should be likewise increased percentage wise to where they were. If not, we are going to lose the employee." Commissioner McGinnis said, "Yes." Manager McLemore noted, "If you were willing to pay for it, it would.be a great thing." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17, 2006 PAGE 7 OF 15 Commissioner Gilmore said, "If everybody performed exactly as they were and everything went up four percent (4%), everybody would get a four percent (4%) pay raise. I mean, that is the way it would be. Some guy may not be as good, he's slacked off, by Merit Plan they would not get a four percent (4%), they may get a three percent (3%). And the person that's improved, gone to school, and done things like that, may get a five percent (5%). But that's where the Merit Plan and the control of the Merit Plan comes in. And that's where the management must be responsible for properly evaluating the performance of people." Manager McLemore asked, "Do you want to see what that number looks like?" Commissioner Gilmore said, "Yes." Manager McLemore remarked, "I am totally, one hundred percent (100%) in favor of what you are recommending. I don't think you're going to write the check." Commissioner Gilmore suggested, "Why don't we leave the pay grades and move the range?" Discussion. Deputy Mayor Blake said, "Point of Order " and spoke of the Millage Rate. Commissioner McGinnis said, "One of the things that has made Winter Springs special is the caliber and the quality of our employees. I am just always real proud of all of our Departments and all of our employees, and I want to keep those people. And I want to continue to attract that level. So maybe we need to look at our system, a little bit. I was concerned with the demographics also, and I had asked Kevin (Smith, Director, General Services Department) if perhaps we could have the person who wrote the Cody Study- come and sit there and answer some of our concerns and questions; go through this with us because I don't think that has ever happened, been available to us." Manager McLemore noted, "It's available any time you want it." Additionally, Commissioner McGinnis said, "And your comment may be that no government does a system like Commissioner Gilmore had - brought forth, and - maybe you are right; but I think we can look, we can do what we want, I think we need to look at it. There might be a combination of systems between the steps and the Merit and all these other systems that would, that maybe we can bring out the best of several and apply it. If that is possible, I would like for us to look at that." Commissioner McGinnis then said, "And I would like to know if anybody else IS interested in having the person who wrote the Study meet with us?" Commissioner Robert S. Miller said, "I would rather get the mid-point stuff that - Commissioner Blake - asked for." Commissioner Miller noted, "You are asking for the people that actually wrote this study to come and give us a presentation. I guess? I don't think they can answer these questions that Commissioner Blake asked - that has to be done by Staff." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17,2006 PAGE 8 OF 15 Deputy Mayor Blake remarked, "What concerns me is the quality of the data, and exactly what data is being used to consider this." Deputy Mayor Blake suggested, "I would like to use agencies that are near us, agencies that have similar work type conditions which means it may be different for Firefighters, than it is for Police, than it is for Utility workers, than it is for Parks employees. You might even use different cities to an extent." Deputy Mayor Blake added, "I question somewhat the validity of the data that we are using to make these decisions as well." Commissioner Krebs said, "One thing I didn't notice was anything like hazard payor risk pay, I guess some places call it. Do we not have that for our Fire and Police?" Manager McLemore said, "It's all hazard pay. Who would not have hazard pay in the Fire Department or Police Department?" Commissioner Krebs said, "Well, I don't know because I was just looking at the pay grade and I see a 29 is a Fire Lieutenant and 29 is also a Building, Inspector, a Planner, a Plans Examiner, a Human Resources Board Leader, and a Utility Billing Services Manager, and they all start, and they all have the minimum and max[imum]. And I noticed asterisks on this Cody Study and I saw that there were seven thousand [dollars] ($7,000.00) added for Paramedic Certifications, etc., but I didn't see anything that was added for risk payor hazard pay and I was wondering, do we also supplement their salaries with that? That's what I was wondering." Manager McLemore said, "No. We take the marketplace figures in their job." Mayor Bush stated, "I think Commissioner Blake asked for some information; Commissioner Gilmore asked for some." Commissioner Krebs added, "I want the same information - I had asked for similar information." Mayor Bush said, "Well, everybody's going to get it, yes, everybody will get the same thing." Manager McLemore noted, "I would like to simply understand what Commissioner Gilmore is asking for." Deputy Mayor Blake added, "I would like to see the two percent (2%) numbers." Mayor Bush added, 'Yes, the two percent (2%)." Next, Commissioner Gilmore said, "What I wanted to see was, what would it cost us if we, when we move the range, we move the person to the same penetration within that range. Again, based on merit, not an automatic, but based on Merit. Supervisor/Manager sits down and says your performance; if the performance is the same they get it. If the performance is better, they should go up. If it is worse, they go down. But that's the merit system, it's based on performance; not an automatic move." With further discussion, Manager McLemore said, "You and I'll talk so we can clarify it. " CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17, 2006 PAGE 9 OF IS Tape 2/Side B Mayor Bush called a Recess at 8:24 p.m. Mayor Bush called the Workshop back to Order at 8:47 p.m. Manager McLemore said, "So you need to tell me what you want to do. Do you want to go back to an average of four percent (4%) or everybody gets funded fully for four percent (4%)?" Deputy Mayor Blake said, "August 30, [20]04." Manager McLemore said, "It is in the following year that you - instead of doing it three percent (3%) is when you decided this funded fully at four percent (4%)." Public WorkslUtility Department: With discussion on funds for replacement of Holiday Decorations, Commissioner McGinnis stated, "Something really classy might be nice." Discussion. Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "Is there money here to fix the sink hole on Seneca [Boulevard]?" Mr. Lockcuffnoted, "I am not even aware of it." Discussion. Traffic Calming was brought up next by Commissioner Miller who commented, "I am really concerned about Edgemon [Road] and Murphy [Road]. So, do we need more money for those two (2) roadways between now and October of 2007?" Mr. Lockcuff spoke of an Informational Agenda Item for the next City Commission Meeting. Commissioner Miller inquired, "So the Informational item is going to layout the approximate where, when, why, what, and how, and the potential costs?" Mr. Lockcuff stated, "Not quite that far yet." Commissioner Miller then stated, "I would like you to watch this." Further discussion. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17,2006 PAGE 10 OF 15 On the subject of Deceleration Lanes, Mayor Bush mentioned the need at Hayes Road. Mr. Lockcuff said, "It's in Legal right now, so we don't even have the ability to move forward if we wanted to at this point. Maybe that is something - another Agenda Item could be - from Anthony [Garganese]." Mr. Lockcuff added, "I suppose if the Commission wanted to, we could get a Letter of Credit." Further discussion. Regarding Town Center/Blumberg items (as noted on page C-38), Deputy Mayor Blake asked about the three hundred seventy-three, [zero] ninety-seven thousand dollars ($373,097.00) number. Mr. Lockcuffnoted, "I'd have to check on that." Next discussed was the City Hall expansion and the current projected costs. Commissioner Miller said, "The building [David W.] McLeod is building - near the Greene W ay, what does that come to per square foot?" Commissioner Miller then asked, "I would really like to see some alternate data on what it is costing to build buildings." Discussion. Manager McLemore said, "We can look at some recent bid data and see what is going on." Next, Commissioner Miller noted, "I would like to see some data on what square footage is costing for functional buildings." Deputy Mayor Blake suggested, "I think we need to look at alternatives including the refitting of how City Hall is laid out. The square foot per employee is just way out of line." Deputy Mayor Blake added, "There is a lot of space here that we can use much more efficiently, and with these kind of numbers, 1 think we have to look at that." Additionally, Deputy Mayor Blake said, "Everything should be on the table." Discussion. Tape 3/Side A Further discussion ensued with Mr. Lockcuff. Benefits: Regarding Sick Leave, Commissioner Miller said, "Do all cities in Florida have a buy back? Manager McLemore said, "No, not all." Commissioner Miller said, "So that's something that we do, that not all cities do?" Manager McLemore stated, "That's correct." Commissioner Miller said, "I would like to see some information on that. 1 mean, does Florida League of Cities provide that kind of data?" CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17,2006 PAGE 11 OF 15 Commissioner Miller asked, "How many days of sick leave does the average person get to buy back?" Manager McLemore said, "There's a chart. There's a scale." Commissioner Miller said, "I would like to see that then." Discussion. Commissioner Krebs said, "I remember a couple of years ago, a conversation that took place with a previous Commissioner - do any of these improvements have anything to do with improving the pressure, the water pressure on the Unit One Oak Forest site? Do you remember that conversation at all?" Mr. Lockcuff stated, "Yes, and the Southern water interconnect through Dunmar [Estates] was, helped that out a lot as far as I know." Commissioner Krebs asked, "It did? How do you test that?" Mr. Lockcuff said, "We have gauges. If you don't mind, we can hook up to your hose bid outside your house and kind of monitor it." In discussing whether Mr. Lockcuff knew of other affected neighborhoods, Commissioner Krebs suggested, "I think you should check into it." Fire Department: Discussion ensued with Fire Chief, Timothy J. Lallathin on Fire Department vehicles. Deputy Mayor Blake asked Chief Lallathin, "Do you have any idea what current maintenance costs are running on that [Engine 26] for the year?" Chief Lallathin said, "I don't have those numbers." Deputy Mayor Blake said, "My main concern is to make sure that we have got something that's going there. Looking at the numbers here, if it is being maintained and it is operating up to standards of whatever those certification standards are, by being maintained, I would like to see the numbers on what maintenance costs are; what kind of differential there would be. And if we traded it in, then it is not going to be here for a reserve." Further discussion. Deputy Mayor Blake said, "I would like some information on current maintenance status and cost estimates of what it is going to cost if we wait a year, or if wait two (2) years." Discussion Deputy Mayor Blake said, "That refurbishment option to me does not sound to be, at least from what I understand, something I would be interested in." Chief Lallathin said, "And I agree." Deputy Mayor Blake continued, "If we can through careful maintenance, make it last another year or two (2), if that number's not too high and if it can provide the service, I would tend to lean towards that." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17, 2006 PAGE 12 OF 15 Mayor Bush asked, "What's the anticipated increase of cost of this truck over another year?" Commissioner McGinnis noted, "I don't need any additional information." Chief Lallathin said, "We'll bring back - the information, in regards to the maintenance status, the down-time, as well as the annual maintenance costs on that current unit." Tape 3/Side B The Medical Transport Fund was discussed next. Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "How are we doing on collections? That's actual collections, that's not billed right?" Chief Lallathin said, "That is actual collections. That's correct." Deputy Mayor Blake again asked, "How are we doing on collections?" Chief Lallathin said, "We are maintaining, you know, in the sixty to seventy percent (60-70%) on our collections..." Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "Sixty-Seventy percent (60-70%) of the private or total bill?" Chief Lallathin said, "The total bill." Chief Lallathin next mentioned a new Rescue Unit for Rescue 26, to which Deputy Mayor Blake said, "I think it would be appropriate to look forward to that expenditure and make sure that we can fund it from Fund Balance in the year that we replace it. So that might help you to get to the other number that you're looking for." Chief Lallathin said, "But the only expenditure requested is actually to do the pre-design studies in regards to the engineering and possible preliminary architectural for Fire Station 28." Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "And what all can we use this fund to pay for?" Manager McLemore remarked, "Capital Improvement Items." Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "Does that include, the truck?" Manager McLemore stated, "Yes - it can pay for new capacity." Deputy Mayor Blake asked, "It can't pay for humans or training or even what about the non-durables to outfit a truck?" Manager McLemore said, "The equipment items? I'd have to go and check our list..." Chief Lallathin noted, "... When we did the Impact Fee projection, this included not only building of the Fire Station 28, but also the - unit and down the road, if it, you know, expands to that type of level of service, an engine in that house as well as a rescue unit." With further discussion, Chief Lallathin said, "You talked about it a little bit earlier, about City Hall and everything; I think, that this is just a little bit of my opinion right now, is that maybe we ought to master plan this whole site, to look how we could typically fit the Fire Station into it, as well as the expansion to City Hall. I know there have been - talk about a possible Community Building or something right here at this level; and maybe this all needs to be looked at jointly." Commissioner Miller said, "Good idea." Commissioner McGinnis added, "Good idea! CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17,2006 PAGE 13 OF 15 Concluding his Budget discussion, Chief Lallathin remarked, "I'll come back with the answers to questions in regards to the maintenance status. I believe that was the only question that I need to answer." Commissioner McGinnis said, "Yes." Police Department: Chief of Police, Daniel J. Kerr addressed the City Commission on his Budget. Mayor Bush said, "Chief (Kerr), the next Commission Meeting, the Commission is going to hear a presentation from Robin Butler of Seminole County - basically it is about driver's education. And - they are looking to the Cities as well as the County to put Driver's Ed back into the schools - is there anyway that we could, when we recycle these cars, or whatever you trade them in?" Mayor Bush added, "What kind of value do they have?" Chief Kerr said, "Generally about two thousand [dollars] ($2,000.00) a car for a full size Crown Vics[Victorias]. Some of them will be a little bit less than that, the ones that are quite a few years older." Mayor Bush continued, "That's what Robin [Butler] will eventually ask for is some - commitment from the City to partner with the school on this." Mayor Bush added, "I did talk to the Manager a little bit about the cars because that's one of their big costs, is cars - just something to be thinking about, 1 guess. If we could possibly give them some cars, some of these older cars?" Chief Kerr said, "Well, being that money doesn't come back into a replacement vehicle fund or anything like that, that would be something I am sure Ron [McLemore] and I can work out." Commissioner Miller said, "We were going to get something from you last year, Ron [McLemore], on some scientific way to analyze what it was that we needed. And we never heard from you on it. And the only reason I raise it here, it is probably the most appropriate time. Last Sunday's - paper, it had the crime statistics for Orange and Seminole County and I was really surprised that Winter Springs was up there with everybody else." Commissioner Miller added, "I am wondering if this is not something that we really need to seriously look at again?" Commissioner Miller said, "If it is one of those issues that is going to come up where we think we need to look at the manpower issue again? The manpower issue, I am raising right now because I think you all need to think about it. And I am not really comfortable with what is going on around us." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17,2006 PAGE 14 OF 15 Continuing, Chief Kerr addressed the City Commission on this issue and noted, "I think what we've done this past year and the fact that we haven't grown as fast as what Ron [McLemore] and I have sat down and talked about, that we could maintain what we have right now and look as we grow to see if in fact, we do have to add more people and when. " Commissioner Miller said, "I am going to remind you next year because I just, I really have a bad feeling about what is going on and I don't have the solution." Furthermore, Commissioner McGinnis commented, "Well, I agree with Commissioner Miller." Additionally, Commissioner McGinnis noted, "Well, I can assure you, when you feel you need more people, come to us, we will listen to you." Discussion. Commissioner Krebs remarked, "I am with Commissioner Miller on this that as long as we stay ahead of it, and you feel like you can just come and tell us - feel comfortable to do that." Chief Kerr stated, "Yes." Regarding staffing levels, Chief Kerr said, "Adding a few at a time is much better than, you know, the quality of people and being able to retain good people so we have experience and we're not constantly in a training mode like some of the other jurisdictions around us." Further discussion. In other business, Commissioner Krebs stated, "I have something here that came across from Leadership Seminole. I would just like to pass it out - and if they could just look at it maybe for the next Budget Meeting." Brief discussion ensued on the next Budget Meeting scheduled for Saturday, July 22, 2006. Deputy Mayor Blake stated, "You can email me Saturday if you want. I will be able to respond." Commissioner Krebs then said to Mayor Bush, "Are you going to be going to the Florida League of Cities Meeting?" Mayor Bush stated, "Yes." Commissioner Krebs added, "I wasn't sure whether you were going or not and I wanted to remind you that you were nominated" for the Florida League of Cities' Cities of Excellence A wards Program." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION WORKSHOP - JULY 17,2006 PAGE 15 OF 15 City Clerk Lorenzo-Luaces said, "We're just passing this document out from the Florida League of Cities. If Mayor, you could ask for a Consensus of the Commission as to who they would like to be their Voting Delegate, that information's got to be sent to the [Florida) League [Of Cities) by the 2ffh [of July, 2006). We can fax that over tomorrow and then we could confirm it in an Agenda Item at next Monday's meeting; if that would please the Commission." Commissioner Miller said, "I will nominate Mayor Bush." Commissioner Krebs said, ttMy Consensus would be with Mayor Bush." Commissioner McGinnis stated, "Yes." Mayor Bush said, ttI will do it." ADJOURNMENT Mayor Bush Adjourned the Workshop at 1 0:59 p.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED: DANIELLE HARKER, ASSISTANT TO THE CITY CLERK ,- I