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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2008 02 11 Consent 206 Approval of the City Commission Special Meeting Minutes of January 17, 2008 CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING JANUARY 17,2008 CALL TO ORDER The Special Meeting of Thursday, January 17, 2008 of the City Commission was called to Order by Mayor John F. Bush at 6:30 p.m. in the Commission Chambers of the Municipal Building (City Hall, 1126 East State Road 434, Winter Springs, Florida 32708). Roll Call: Mayor John F. Bush, present Deputy Mayor Donald A. Gilmore, present Commissioner Robert S. Miller, present Commissioner Rick Brown, present Commissioner Sally McGinnis, present Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs, present City Manager Ronald W. McLemore, arrived at 8:53 p.m. City Attorney Anthony A. Garganese, arrived at 6:37 p.m. A moment of silence was followed by the Pledge of Allegiance. REGULAR AGENDA REGULAR 600. Community Development Department - Planning Division Requests That The City Commission Remove The Draft Evaluation And Appraisal Report (EAR) From The Table, And Hear The Recommendations Of The Local Planning Agency, Related To The City's List Of Major Issues In The Draft EAR (Evaluation And Appraisal Report). Discussion. City Attorney Anthony A. Garganese arrived at 6:37 p.m. ~ r-r;' ::- - 11II[" .. n~ ,..... . ,..... . ~M~ :.-~ : 1II CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 2 OF 13 Local Planning Agency Roll Call: Chairman Robert L. Heatwole, present Vice Chairman Charles Lacey, present Board Member Tom Brown, present Board Member Rosanne Karr, present Board Member William H. Poe, present Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member William H. Poe said, "The first one, 'Population, Housing Density and Greenspace' , number [Recommendations] 1. originally, it read 7 stories in the Town Center. After we discussed that, number 7. was removed and it was replaced with 6. When we go back to review what the Zoning laws are and what the Comprehensive Plan indicates, 6 has always been the stories that has been written. Why 7 was there, I am not sure. But, 7 has been removed. The only way that they can even come up to 6 is if they give us some conservation lands back." Discussion continued on building heights in the Town Center. Ms. Eloise Sahlstrom, AICP, ASLA, Senior Planner, Community Development Department addressed the City Commission and stated, "We are talking about the revised recommendations for the Board, which now says 6." Discussion. Continuing, Ms. Sahlstrom stated, "The Code for the Town Center allows a maximum of 4 stories. The Comprehensive Plan allows a maximum of 6 stories. What that means is that you have discretion if you want to, in a Development Agreement, allow more than 4 stories. You can't allow it without some kind of Development Agreement. But, through a Development Agreement, you can allow up to 6 stories in certain instances. What this recommendation is saying, however, is that to go between 4 stories and 6 stories, one of the Criteria would be preservation of significant greenspace, whatever that means. That hasn't been defined." Discussion. Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs said, "My answer is 'Yes'." Commissioner Sally McGinnis said, "The rationale for height would be the trade off to preserve greenspace." Commissioner McGinnis added, "We have talked about that before. That is exactly what we are working towards, so 'Yes', absolutely." Discussion on greenspace continued. ~ r-;' ~ - ..-- ~ ~ o II r"" . ~G :,.--: ~ CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 3 OF 13 Ms Sahlstrom noted, "After tonight would you want this to come back as a Public Hearings before it goes to DCA (Department for Community Affairs) for a courtesy review? You don't have to answer that now." Commissioner Krebs said, "I am 'okay' with leaving it at the height at 4 [stories], but the ability to go to 6 depending on credits earned for something; using those as credits earned for those 2 stories." Further discussion. Deputy Mayor Donald A. Gilmore said, "Wetlands, I do not believe are allowed to be used for any recreational. In fact, you will fight the environmental people in the St. Johns [River Water Management District] even cutting a trail through them." Mr. Brian Fields, P.E., City Engineer, Public Works Department said, "To add greenspace outside the Town Center would set a maximum allowable impervious area. And what that would do is set aside certain parts of sites as greenspace. It also provides an incentive for developers to do some more innovative environmentally friendly development things like green roofs and things like that. There are different ways to achieve that greenspace and it's also very stormwater conscious. So, you could look at that outside the Town Center, say maybe sixty percent (60%) maximum impervious unless otherwise approved by the Commission and that would be one step, I think to balance that." Mayor Bush asked, "What do you think of that?" Commissioner Krebs said, "I like that idea." Commissioner McGinnis noted, "Yes." Further discussion. Mayor Bush said, On [Recommendations] 1., I think there is Consensus between the - Committee and the Commission, that at some point, somehow we want to get the greenspace issue into the Comp[rehensive] Plan. Now maybe this is the right place to do it or maybe it isn't and I think maybe the Staff can work on with Brian's (Fields) suggestion to accomplish what everybody wants here." With further discussion on building heights, Mayor Bush said, "Okay - change from 7 to 6." Commissioner McGinnis noted, "Okay." Local Planning Agency Chairman Robert L. Heatwole remarked, "Right, we did do that." Regarding [Recommendations] 2., Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole remarked, "Initially in the book, just says 'CRA' (Community Redevelopment Area) and we have asked that that 'CRA' - they put beside it, 'Community Redevelopment Area', so somebody reading the book that is not familiar with the abbreviation, would know what we are talking about in the development." t~ r--~ ~ - ...-- ~ ~ ,..... . c-" . ~r: :,--; : ~ CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 4 OF 13 Mayor Bush said, "Good idea." Commissioner Krebs commented, "Okay." Commissioner McGinnis said, "Good." Mayor Bush stated, "I think everybody agrees with that." Commissioner Krebs added, "Yes." Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole said, "[Recommendations] 3., there were no changes from what was in the book." Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole then suggested, "This [Recommendations] 3. may help a little bit with [Recommendations] 1.; I think - add a Policy that would allow multi-family housing in commercially zoned areas contingent upon the provision of greenspace mitigation elsewhere and that would be similar to transfer of the development rights program - that would still help us get greenspace. " Mayor Bush asked, "Commissioners, is everybody okay with that one?" Commissioner McGinnis commented, "Yes." There were no objections voiced. Mayor Bush then inquired, "Any questions on [Recommendations] 4., Commissioners?" Commissioner McGinnis responded, "No." There were no objections. With discussion of [Recommendations] 5., Commissioner McGinnis said, "Looks good. Fine." Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole said, "That's wildlife protection, and that calls for the City to coordinate further with the Florida Department of Environmental Protection to enhance wildlife protection efforts." Mayor Bush asked, "Is that stated strong enough?" Discussion. Commissioner McGinnis remarked, "I am comfortable with that." Mayor Bush asked, "Commissioners, okay with that one?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "Yes." There were no objections voiced. Ms. Sahlstrom then spoke of the Evaluation and Appraisal Report and stated, "Once it is approved the DCA (Department Community Affairs), the process is to amend the Comp[rehensive] Plan." Ms. Sahlstrom added, "But certainly when we're amending the Comp[rehensive] Plan, which we have eighteen (18) months after the State finds the EAR (Evaluation And Appraisal Report) to be in Compliance, to go through and do all the word smithing. So, we don't have to do word smithing to the detail that we will need to do two (2) years from now." Deputy Mayor Gilmore spoke of "Greens" and "LEED (Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design) Certified" and noted, "I just want to make sure we put that in that we would encourage people to do that. But when we start taking requirements, that would be a precautionary thing at that point." ~ r~' ::..-~ ~ ---1/1 p~ t::'"' a r" a ~d ~ ;;:'--.:A CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 5 OF 13 Ms. Sahlstrom commented, "The first submittal is just a courtesy review - of the EAR (Evaluation and Appraisal Report). And then - we will have our actual Transmittal Hearings and submit our final EAR (Evaluation and Appraisal Report) for a First Reading and then they review and then we do that for our Second Reading and Adoption. Then we go through the Comp[ rehensive] Plan based Amendments - we will have an eighteen (IS) month cycle." With further discussion on 'Green roofs', Ms. Sahlstrom asked, "Do you want Policies relating to these things... Deputy Mayor Gilmore noted, ".. .My suggestion would be that you use the term 'Green Buildings'." Commissioner McGinnis said, "I would like that...." Deputy Mayor Gilmore stated, "... Not green roofs?" Ms. Sahlstrom inquired, "What about LEED (Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design) Certified?" Deputy Mayor Gilmore said, "I have no problem with LEED (Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design) Certified, because 1 have seen some of it." Further discussion followed on the definitions. Tape IISide B Mayor Bush said, "The Commission feels at this point, as written is okay?" Commissioner McGinnis stated, "I do." Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Rosanne Karr asked, "With the spelling out?" Commissioner Krebs remarked, "Yes." Mayor Bush responded, "Yes." No objections were voiced. Discussion ensued on urban sprawl and density. Commissioner Rick Brown noted, "I have reached out to [Seminole County] Commissioner [Bob] Dallari a couple of weeks ago and we were successful in getting him to agree to come to a presentation on the SEED (Seminole Enhanced Economic District) program at the next Commission Meeting; he is on the Regular Agenda and he will be talking about the SEED (Seminole Enhanced Economic District) program which is their revised version of what used to be called the Brownfield." Commissioner Brown added, "He has even suggested putting the whole Town Center Phase II under a SEED (Seminole Enhanced Economic District) and Brownfield designation just so we can give the economic incentives to these folks through no cost of ours to come in and be able to start developing that. So, we should have some good information on that on the 2Sth (January 200S)." Mayor Bush asked Ms. Sahlstrom, "All this discussion that we have had - where are you going to put that?" Ms. Sahlstrom said, "We will keep your comments in mind and see if something needs to be changed, and as it comes back again before you, we will make sure it meets your qualifications." Mayor Bush said, "Okay. Your Committee - okay with that?" Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole responded, "Yes." ~ r-,r;-' ::--- -= ::II ~~ ("'"' I r" . ---L:: :-~ :_11 CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 6 OF 13 Next, Deputy Mayor Gilmore mentioned the issue of Accessory Dwelling Units; Commissioner McGinnis commented on the need to address Housing diversity; and Commissioner Krebs suggested the need for a Policy. Commissioner Robert S. Miller stated, "Is there a similar Policy that will be introduced for the rest of the City? Will it approve these units also on a conditional basis in Tuscawilla?" Commissioner Brown stated, "I would like to see it City-wide." Commissioner McGinnis noted, "Yes." Commissioner Miller remarked, "If it is not City-wide, I would like to see it changed." Furthermore, Commissioner Miller noted, "This is on the west side." Mayor Bush asked, "What are we going to do with [Recommendations] 7.? Leave it the way it is?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "Leave it like it is," Commissioner Brown stated, "Leave it as it is." Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Charles Lacey stated, "[Recommendations] 8., we just cleaned up the language. If you look at the original language, it was a case of excess verbiage causing confusion rather than clarifying the issue." Next, Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey remarked, "We didn't have any further changes to the rest of this - on Major Issue 2." On Major Issue 3, Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey said, "I don't think we had significant changes to anything. We had a typographical correction on number [Recommendations] 6., where it said' Density' and meant to say' Intensity'." Regarding Major Issue 4, Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey stated that regarding [Recommendations] 1. and "'Level of Service', we just asked for some clarifying language on that to talk about what was intended." Mr. Fields remarked, "I recommend changing not the intent but the way it's worded and what I have on the board here is what I would recommend." Mr. Fields said, "There are two (2) different Elements here. One is the 'Level of Service' which is the measure of the quality of service on [State Road] 434 - 'A' through 'F'. 'A' being free flow - 'F' is total gridlock. We don't want to ask to change the Level of Service that's adopted on [State Road] 434. It's 'D' now. It's State policy. It's in our Comp[rehensive] Plan Policy. I don't think we want to ask for an 'E'." c-t r--., := ~ K- ~ 0~ ,-.. . ~ . - .~ :--~ ; ~ CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 7 OF 13 Continuing, Mr. Fields then said, "What we do want to ask for is to change the roadway 'Class'. 'Class' is based on the density of traffic signals. In the Town Center, we have three (3) signals in less than a mile. By increasing the 'Class' on [State Road] 434, it gets us to where there is typically a lower posted speed in the higher the class. More signals, generally lead to lower speeds. So, our Policy Recommendation is to recommend changing the 'Class' based on the existing conditions that are really out there today, to add to what is a long term effort to lower the speed on [State Road] 434 and this is just one more component of that." Mayor Bush asked, "Do you agree with Brian (Fields)?" Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey said, "We have only had a chance to review it since we came in this evening so 1 don't know if we have a Consensus. But, I will voice my opinion that I do." Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole stated, "I do." Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Poe commented, "I do as well." No objections were noted. Mayor Bush said, "Brian's Recommendation on number [Recommendations] I.?" Local Planning Agency Member Tom Brown noted, "I agree with it." There was no objections voiced. Mayor Bush then asked, "Commissioners, you are okay with that - Brian's (Fields) Recommendation?" No objections were noted. Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey remarked, "We had no suggested changes to items [Recommendations] 2. through [Recommendations] 4." Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Questions on [Recommendations] 2. through [Recommendations] 4.?" No comments were voiced. Referring to Recommendations 5., Local Planning Agency Chairman Lacey said, "We took out some language that seemed to be a little bit too constraining. The general goal here was to provide a non-motorized vehicle path from the Town Center to the SeminoleW A Y GreeneWay Interchange District. And, there is language in the old one that talked about a specific route that would go along the north side of [State Road] 434 to facilitate that and we agreed with the goals but we didn't think we should specify that particular approach as one contemplated scenario even though it might not seem cost effective, it might be a reasonable alternative to have a bridge going over [State Road] 434] that would connect the work area in the SeminoleW A Y, the GID (GreeneWay Interchange District) back to the neighborhoods in Tuscawilla to provide an easy access for commutes. So we wanted to open up the possibilities down the road as that gets developed and we're not constrained to a specific answer." Mayor Bush asked, "It is a good idea - Commissioners, are you okay with that one?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "Yes. " ~ r--:1 ~- -- ... r-V; c-" I (""" I ~G :--~ :.- :a CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 8 OF 13 Local Planning Agency Chairman Lacey said, "On [Recommendations] 6., we just struck some language that talked about some jurisdictional transfer of State Road 434 to the City. No one thought that was a good idea. And number [Recommendations] 7. deals with four (4) laning or widening of [State Road] 434 beyond where it is and what constraints we would want to put on where that widening would take place." With discussion, Mayor Bush asked, "And where would you say widening would be appropriate?" Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey said, "From Vistawilla [Road] east to [State Road] 417, and then I believe there is another item down the road that talks about widening further east of [State Road] 417 towards Oviedo." Mr. Fields spoke of concerns with a two (2) lane segment and suggested, "My opinion long-term, is they should four (4) lane the segment from [State Road] 417 to [State Road] 426." With further comments, Mr. Fields noted, "It's a problem today - we probably need to get with the City of Oviedo and see where they are on it." Mayor Bush suggested, "Maybe this just - needs to be brought to the attention of the MetroPlan Advisory [Committee] and the Board itself. I am on that Board, so I'll bring it up next time we have a Meeting." Further discussion. Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey said, "The remainder of this section, we did not make any changes to the rest of the items except to add a new bullet number [Recommendations] 10., which is referring what we talked to and that is the widening east of [State Road] 417 through the GID (Greene Way Interchange District)." Additionally, Local Planning Agency Chairman Lacey said, "Under Major Issue 5, other than in the original document there was a skipped number, so we went back to sequential numbering. We didn't make any other changes to Major Issue 5." Mayor Bush asked, "Questions on [Major Issue] 5 Commissioners?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "No." Deputy Mayor Gilmore said, "We are encouraging housing in these areas and I am not sure we want to do that. I have a concern, a major concern about it. " Discussion ensued on Recommendations 3. Tape 2/Side A Commissioner Miller left the Commission Chambers at 8:14 p.m. Discussion Commissioner Miller returned to the Commission Chambers at 8: 17 p. m. ~ r.......' :: - -=- J n-~ ~ " r' I .- ..~ :--: ;.....:::;. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 9 OF I3 Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey remarked, "We are on to Major Issue 6 and we made no changes to items [Recommendations] 1. through [Recommendations] 4. and just some minor expansion of terms on number [Recommendations] 5." Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Any questions on [Recommendations] 1. through [Recommendations] 4.?" Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Poe said, "We wanted to provide Staff an opportunity to clean up the language on [Recommendations] 6., and you might note that there are still some question marks there because we have not had an opportunity to meet with it." With further discussion, Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Poe stated, "I tried to determine since we had our Meeting, what the percentage is normally granted either in square footage or number of units for Affordable Housing and I can find no consistent number that is used anywhere." Mayor Bush asked Ms. Sahlstrom, "Do you have any insight into that particular item?" Ms. Sahlstrom said, "I looked up to see if there were some examples and it ranged in percentage with kind of an average range being ten to twenty-five percent (10-25%). So, in some cases, maybe as low as five percent (5%), but ten to twenty-five [percent] (10- 25%) was the more common of the ranges and whether this is written in a way that - you would like to see, but we felt that rather than making it fairly open and general as it had been, that it would be better to put some numbers with it and depending on whether we can get Consensus from everybody on those numbers. If not, then maybe we'll go back to just saying a certain number and leave it to further discussion - until we can put something that people do have Consensus on." Commissioner McGinnis asked, "When you tried to get standards of percent - where did you go to look for that?" Ms. Sahlstrom said, "I looked in a document that Randy (Stevenson, AICP, ASLA, Director, Community Development Department) had gotten from one of his workshops that he attended and it was talking about inclusionary Zoning. " Discussion. Commissioner McGinnis said, "I think ten percent (10%) is low." Commissioner Brown noted, "My concern was that we were looking at Commercial and not Mixed Use. I fully support it in Mixed Use..." Ms. Sahlstrom remarked, ".. . And it could be changed to say Mixed Use, if you feel that that's not the appropriate wording." Deputy Mayor Gilmore commented, "I think Commissioner Brown brought the subject up and it is good." a--'l (":--.r-;' :: ~ .:: .. ~ r" . r" . ---L: :.-~ :...--. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 10 OF 13 Mayor Bush asked, "Does the Commission have a recommendation on the percentage?" Additionally, Mayor Bush inquired, "Would you want to just put a range in there?" Commissioner McGinnis stated, "No lower than ten (10) but not to exceed twenty-five (25)." Mayor Bush asked, "Everybody in agreement with that?" Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey stated, "I am speaking for myself. I am not. I think that is too high a number." Discussion ensued on Affordable Housing and a gated community that the City of St. Cloud is building for their teachers. On the issue of Workforce Housing, Mayor Bush spoke on some partially completed projects such as Harbor Winds and suggested that the City could step in and help with such. Commissioner Miller recommended that Mayor Bush assist with this effort. Further discussion. Mayor Bush said, "I would recommend Commissioners - [Recommendations] 6. be looked at and maybe - a little differently than what we have just said because I think that there are some good points all the way around and we do need to do something about it." Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Karr said, "Maybe we should leave [Recommendations] 6. in, but took out the specifics, like' With more than 200 units' and just say 'Requires residential projects to include a certain percentage of workforce housing units' and encourage Developers of large projects in the Town Center." Mayor Bush said, "I think that is a good idea because - the density is always an issue with Developers." Mayor Bush added, "So - that can be done now and I think what Rosanne (Karr) is recommending would cover that. What do you think?" Discussion. Ms. Sahlstrom asked, "Do you want to have this as a Public Hearing Item before it goes to DCA (Department of Community Affairs) for a courtesy review?" Mayor Bush said, "I don't see any reason not to have it." Ms. Sahlstrom then said, "So, we will have a Public Hearings Agenda Item on January 2Sth [200S]." Mayor Bush asked, "Is everybody happy with that?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "That is fine." Commissioner Brown said, "Nice job, Eloise [Sahlsrom]." Mayor Bush added, "Thank you Committee." Commissioner McGinnis added, "Good job." This portion of the Agenda Item was adjourned. Mayor Bush called a Recess at 8:37 p.m. The Special Meeting was called back to Order at 8:53 p.m. City Manager Ronald W McLemore arrived at 8:53 p.m. r--l r--' ;= - K" ". ~~ I'""' .. ~ I ---C ~ ;;:~.~~;:, I ~; CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE II OF 13 In other City business, Manager McLemore commented on the upcoming Scottish Highland Games and the possible inclement weather. With discussion, Mayor Bush stated, "I think we should go ahead with it." Next, Manager McLemore commented that he would be out of town on Saturday. REGULAR 601. Office Of The City Manager ADD-ON Discussion On Fire Assessment Fees. Manager McLemore introduced this Agenda Item for discussion on proposed Fire Assessment Fees. Discussion. Tape 2/Side B On the issue of mobile homes and Fire Assessment Fees, Manager McLemore said, "I can even email it to you as soon as we get it." Further discussion continued. Commissioner Brown asked Manager McLemore about buying a Fire Truck as a one (1) time expense as opposed to a lease? Manager McLemore explained, "There is nothing being assessed for that truck in this scheme - other than just buying it out of reserves and cash. You could assign that cost - you could buy it over time and assign that debt flow back to the assessment side if you wanted to. It will pop that number up a little bit." Mayor Bush added, "I think what the Commissioner was saying is that the two hundred and eight thousand [dollars] ($208,000.00) doesn't have to be a one (1) time cost, it could be spread out over as a lease payment - but it would be two hundred and eight thousand [dollars] ($208,000.00)7" Manager McLemore stated, "No." Further discussion. Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked, "I was wondering - the term 'Mobile home' versus 'Manufactured home'. Is there a difference?" Deputy Mayor Gilmore added, "A pure 'Mobile home' is a lot smaller in size than a 'Manufactured home'. Some of these manufactured homes are the equivalent of a good residential unit or even apartments." Manager McLemore said, "I can ask that question. I don't know if that's been looked at; if they treat them the same way. We will ask that question." Discussion continued. ~~ [:"7' ;::~ ... ~ ~ r"-.. r" . ~C :.--~ ~ ~ CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE 12 OF 13 Commissioner Brown asked, "What do you need to do to put some hard numbers around this?" Manager McLemore stated, "Weare already doing it." Commissioner Brown then said, "By what Meeting or before the Second Reading?" Manager McLemore said, "As soon as we get those numbers down, we'll email them to you." Commissioner Krebs asked, "We don't have to set a Fee right now anyway?" Manager McLemore said, "No. You don't have to set a Fee until your Final Rate Resolution - you have to set it, but the Final one is going to be the one." Mayor Bush said, "That is on the 28th [January 2008]." Mr. Kevin Smith, Director, General Services Department noted, "The 28th of January is your initial Resolution. February 25th [2008] after notices go out to property owners that's the Final, February 25th [2008] - as it stands right now." With further discussion, Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Do you want to provide direction to the Manager on this?" Commissioner Brown said, "Proceed." Mayor Bush asked, "Do you think it is a good plan?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "Yes." Further discussion. Commissioner Krebs asked if the Tax Assessment is tax-deductible? Manager McLemore responded, "The simple answer is talk to your Tax Consultant." Discussion ensued on other City business. Mayor Bush congratulated the City Commission on being awarded the attendance trophy for at the Tri-County League of Cities monthly luncheon. Manager McLemore brought up possible dates for the Dedication Ceremony for the Fire Station in memory of former Fire Chief Timothy J. Lallathin. Manager McLemore stated that Pam Lallathin wanted to stay with Saturday, February 2nd, 2008 for this Ceremony. Commissioner Krebs mentioned, "I will send her my apologies that I can't be there." Mayor Bush added, "We need to accommodate her on this." Discussion followed on having coffee for the City Commission, to which Commissioner McGinnis remarked, "Why can't we have our City Clerk make a big pot of coffee in the back, not fill the carafes, just make a pot of coffee and if we want it, we just go back and get it." Commissioner Krebs added, "I am fine with it." Commissioner Krebs said, "I won't be here on the 28th [January 2008] - it has been a long-planned family Christmas present." Commissioner Krebs added, "I just wanted the Commission to know that that is why I am not here." ~ r.....-;' ==- - .---- ~ C"~ r" I ('"" . ~~ ~ ;"""".J CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - JANUARY 17,2008 PAGE I3 OF 13 With further comments on the Fire Station Dedication Ceremony, Manager McLemore suggested the Ceremony may need to be held in the morning. Mayor Bush added, "Whenever she wants to do it, is when we will do it." Commissioner McGinnis noted, "We will work around her schedule." Mayor Bush then said, "We had two (2) Commissioners say to have the Clerk make a pot of coffee in the back. Mr. Gilmore, where do you stand on this?" Deputy Mayor Gilmore said, "Go ahead." Commissioner Miller stated, "Aye." No objections were noted. Mayor Bush added, "And make it regular coffee, not decaf." Commissioner Krebs noted, "Stryofoam" cups. ADJOURNMENT Mayor Bush adjourned the Special Meeting at 9:44 p.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED: JOAN 1. BROWN, DEPUTY CITY CLERK AND ANDREA LORENZO-LUACES, CMC CITY CLERK APPROVED: MAYOR JOHN F. BUSH NOTE: These Minutes were approved at the , 2008 Regular City Commission Meeting. r-l r--, ;: - II::. . n~ ,..... I ('" I ~C :--; ;..,~~;. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING JANUARY 17, 2008 CALL TO ORDER The Special Meeting of Thursday, January 17, 2008 of the City Commission was called to Order by Mayor John F. Bush at 6:30 p.m. in the Commission Chambers of the Municipal Building (City Hall, 1126 East State Road 434, Winter Springs, Florida 32708). Roll Call: Mayor John F. Bush, present Deputy Mayor Donald A. Gilmore, present Commissioner Robert S. Miller, present Commissioner Rick Brown, present Commissioner Sally McGinnis, present Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs, present City Manager Ronald W. McLemore, arrived at 8:53 p.m. City Attorney Anthony A. Garganese, arrived at 6:37 p.m. A moment of silence was followed by the Pledge of Allegiance. REGULAR AGENDA REGULAR 600. Community Development Department -Planning Division Requests That The City Commission Remove The Draft Evaluation And Appraisal Report (EAR) From The Table, And Hear The Recommendations Of The Local Planning Agency, Related To The City's List Of Major Issues In The Draft EAR (Evaluation And Appraisal Report). Discussion. Ciry Attorney Anthony A. Garganese arrived at 6: 37 p. m. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 2 OF 13 Local Planning Agency Roll Call: Chairman Robert L. Heatwole, present Vice Chairman Charles Lacey, present Board Member Tom Brown, present Board Member Rosanne Karr, present Board Member William H. Poe, present Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member William H. Poe said, "The first one, `Population, Housing Density and Greenspace', number [Recommendations] 1. originally, it read 7 stories in the Town Center. After we discussed that, number 7. was removed and it was replaced with 6. When we go back to review what the Zoning laws are and what the Comprehensive Plan indicates, 6 has always been the stories that has been written. Why 7 was there, I am not sure. But, 7 has been removed. The only way that they can even come up to 6 is if they give us some conservation lands back." Discussion continued on building heights in the Town Center. Ms. Eloise Sahlstrom, AICP, ASLA, Senior Planner, Community Development Department addressed the City Commission and stated, "We are talking about the revised recommendations for the Board, which now says 6." Discussion. Continuing, Ms. Sahlstrom stated, "The Code for the Town Center allows a maximum of 4 stories. The Comprehensive Plan allows a maximum of 6 stories. What that means is that you have discretion if you want to, in a Development Agreement, allow more than 4 stories. You can't allow it without some kind of Development Agreement. But, through a Development Agreement, you can allow up to 6 stories in certain instances. What this recommendation is saying, however, is that to go between 4 stories and 6 stories, one of the Criteria would be preservation of significant greenspace, whatever that means. That hasn't been defined." Discussion. Commissioner Joanne M. Krebs said, "My answer is `Yes'." Commissioner Sally McGinnis said, "The rationale for height would be the trade off to preserve greenspace." Commissioner McGinnis added, "We have talked about that before. That is exactly what we are working towards, so `Yes', absolutely." Discussion on greenspace continued. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 3 OF 13 Ms Sahlstrom noted, "After tonight would you want this to come back as a Public Hearings before it goes to DCA (Department for Community Affairs) for a courtesy review? You don't have to answer that now." Commissioner Krebs said, "I am `okay' with leaving it at the height at 4 [stories], but the ability to go to 6 depending on credits earned for something; using those as credits earned for those 2 stories." Further discussion. Deputy Mayor Donald A. Gilmore said, "Wetlands, I do not believe are allowed to be used for any recreational. In fact, you will fight the environmental people in the St. Johns [River Water Management District] even cutting a trail through them." Mr. Brian Fields, P.E., City Engineer, Public Works Department said, "To add greenspace outside the Town Center would set a maximum allowable impervious area. And what that would do is set aside certain parts of sites as greenspace. It also provides an incentive for developers to do some more innovative environmentally friendly development things like green roofs and things like that. There are different ways to achieve that greenspace and it's also very stormwater conscious. So, you could look at that outside the Town Center, say maybe sixty percent (60%) maximum impervious unless otherwise approved by the Commission and that would be one step, I think to balance that." Mayor Bush asked, "What do you think of that?" Commissioner Krebs said, "I like that idea." Commissioner McGinnis noted, "Yes." Further discussion. Mayor Bush said, On [Recommendations] 1., I think there is Consensus between the - Committee and the Commission, that at some point, somehow we want to get the greenspace issue into the Comp[rehensive] Plan. Now maybe this is the right place to do it or maybe it isn't and I think maybe the Staff can work on with Brian's (Fields) suggestion to accomplish what everybody wants here." With further discussion on building heights, Mayor Bush said, "Okay -change from 7 to 6." Commissioner McGinnis noted, "Okay." Local Planning Agency Chairman Robert L. Heatwole remarked, "Right, we did do that." Regarding [Recommendations] 2., Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole remarked, "Initially in the book, just says `CRA' (Community Redevelopment Area) and we have asked that that `CRA' -they put beside it, `Community Redevelopment Area', so somebody reading the book that is not familiar with the abbreviation, would know what we are talking about in the development." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 4 OF 13 Mayor Bush said, "Good idea." Commissioner Krebs commented, "Okay." Commissioner McGinnis said, "Good." Mayor Bush stated, "I think everybody agrees with that." Commissioner Krebs added, "Yes." Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole said, "[Recommendations] 3., there were no changes from what was in the book." Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole then suggested, "This [Recommendations] 3. may help a little bit with [Recommendations] 1.; I think - add a Policy that would allow multi-family housing in commercially zoned areas contingent upon the provision of greenspace mitigation elsewhere and that would be similar to transfer of the development rights program -that would still help us get greenspace." Mayor Bush asked, "Commissioners, is everybody okay with that one?" Commissioner McGinnis commented, "Yes." There were no objections voiced. Mayor Bush then inquired, "Any questions on [Recommendations] 4., Commissioners?" Commissioner McGinnis responded, "No." There were no objections. With discussion of [Recommendations] 5., Commissioner McGinnis said, "Looks good. Fine." Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole said, "That's wildlife protection, and that calls for the City to coordinate further with the Florida Department of Environmental Protection to enhance wildlife protection efforts." Mayor Bush asked, "Is that stated strong enough?" Discussion. Commissioner McGinnis remarked, "I am comfortable with that." Mayor Bush asked, "Commissioners, okay with that one?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "Yes." There were no objections voiced. Ms. Sahlstrom then spoke of the Evaluation and Appraisal Report and stated, "Once it is approved the DCA (Department Community Affairs), the process is to amend the Comp[rehensive] Plan." Ms. Sahlstrom added, "But certainly when we're amending the Comp[rehensive] Plan, which we have eighteen (18) months after the State finds the EAR (Evaluation And Appraisal Report) to be in Compliance, to go through and do all the word smithing. So, we don't have to do word smithing to the detail that we will need to do two (2) years from now." Deputy Mayor Gilmore spoke of "Greens" and "LEED (Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design) Certified" and noted, "I just want to make sure we put that in that we would encourage people to do that. But when we start taking requirements, that would be a precautionary thing at that point." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY l7, 2008 PAGE 5 OF 13 Ms. Sahlstrom commented, "The first submittal is just a courtesy review - of the EAR (Evaluation and Appraisal Report). And then - we will have our actual Transmittal Hearings and submit our final EAR (Evaluation and Appraisal Report) for a First Reading and then they review and then we do that for our Second Reading and Adoption. Then we go through the Comp[rehensive] Plan based Amendments - we will have an eighteen (18) month cycle." With further discussion on `Green roofs', Ms. Sahlstrom asked, "Do you want Policies relating to these things... Deputy Mayor Gilmore noted, "...My suggestion would be that you use the term `Green Buildings'." Commissioner McGinnis said, "I would like that...." Deputy Mayor Gilmore stated, "...Not green roofs?" Ms. Sahlstrom inquired, "What about LEED (Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design) Certified?" Deputy Mayor Gilmore said, "I have no problem with LEED (Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design) Certified, because I have seen some of it." Further discussion followed on the definitions. Tape 1/Side B Mayor Bush said, "The Commission feels at this point, as written is okay?" Commissioner McGinnis stated, "I do." Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Rosanne Karr asked, "With the spelling out?" Commissioner Krebs remarked, "Yes." Mayor Bush responded, "Yes." No objections were voiced. Discussion ensued on urban sprawl and density. Commissioner Rick Brown noted, "I have reached out to [Seminole County] Commissioner [Bob] Dallari a couple of weeks ago and we were successful in getting him to agree to come to a presentation on the SEED (Seminole Enhanced Economic District) program at the next Commission Meeting; he is on the Regular Agenda and he will be talking about the SEED (Seminole Enhanced Economic District) program which is their revised version of what used to be called the Brownfield." Commissioner Brown added, "He has even suggested putting the whole Town Center Phase II under a SEED (Seminole Enhanced Economic District) and Brownfield designation just so we can give the economic incentives to these folks through no cost of ours to come in and be able to start developing that. So, we should have some good information on that on the 28th (January 2008)." Mayor Bush asked Ms. Sahlstrom, "All this discussion that we have had -where are you going to put that?" Ms. Sahlstrom said, "We will keep your comments in mind and see if something needs to be changed, and as it comes back again before you, we will make sure it meets your qualifications." Mayor Bush said, "Okay. Your Committee -okay with that?" Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole responded, "Yes." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 6 OF l3 Next, Deputy Mayor Gilmore mentioned the issue of Accessory Dwelling Units; Commissioner McGinnis commented on the need to address Housing diversity; and Commissioner Krebs suggested the need for a Policy. Commissioner Robert S. Miller stated, "Is there a similar Policy that will be introduced for the rest of the City? Will it approve these units also on a conditional basis in Tuscawilla?" Commissioner Brown stated, "I would like to see it City-wide." Commissioner McGinnis noted, "Yes." Commissioner Miller remarked, "If it is not City-wide, I would like to see it changed." Furthermore, Commissioner Miller noted, "This is on the west side." Mayor Bush asked, "What are we going to do with [Recommendations] 7.? Leave it the way it is?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "Leave it like it is." Commissioner Brown stated, "Leave it as it is." Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Charles Lacey stated, "[Recommendations] 8., we just cleaned up the language. If you look at the original language, it was a case of excess verbiage causing confusion rather than clarifying the issue." Next, Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey remarked, "We didn't have any further changes to the rest of this - on Major Issue 2." On Major Issue 3, Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey said, "I don't think we had significant changes to anything. We had a typographical correction on number [Recommendations] 6., where it said `Density' and meant to say `Intensity'." Regarding Major Issue 4, Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey stated that regarding [Recommendations] 1. and "`Level of Service', we just asked for some clarifying language on that to talk about what was intended." Mr. Fields remarked, "I recommend changing not the intent but the way it's worded and what I have on the board here is what I would recommend." Mr. Fields said, "There are two (2) different Elements here. One is the `Level of Service' which is the measure of the quality of service on [State Road] 434 - `A' through `F'. `A' being free flow - `F' is total gridlock. We don't want to ask to change the Level of Service that's adopted on [State Road] 434. It's `D' now. It's State policy. It's in our Comp[rehensive] Plan Policy. I don't think we want to ask for an `E'." C[TY OF W[NTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 7 OF 13 Continuing, Mr. Fields then said, "What we do want to ask for is to change the roadway `Class'. `Class' is based on the density of traffic signals. In the Town Center, we have three (3) signals in less than a mile. By increasing the `Class' on [State Road] 434, it gets us to where there is typically a lower posted speed in the higher the class. More signals, generally lead to lower speeds. So, our Policy Recommendation is to recommend changing the `Class' based on the existing conditions that are really out there today, to add to what is a long term effort to lower the speed on [State Road] 434 and this is just one more component of that." Mayor Bush asked, "Do you agree with Brian (Fields)?" Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey said, "We have only had a chance to review it since we came in this evening so I don't know if we have a Consensus. But, I will voice my opinion that I do." Local Planning Agency Chairman Heatwole stated, "I do." Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Poe commented, "I do as well." No objections were noted. Mayor Bush said, "Brian's Recommendation on number [Recommendations] 1.?" Local Planning Agency Member Tom Brown noted, "I agree with it." There was no objections voiced. Mayor Bush then asked, "Commissioners, you are okay with that -Brian's (Fields) Recommendation?" No objections were noted. Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey remarked, "We had no suggested changes to items [Recommendations] 2. through [Recommendations] 4." Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Questions on [Recommendations] 2. through [Recommendations] 4.?" No comments were voiced. Referring to Recommendations 5., Local Planning Agency Chairman Lacey said, "We took out some language that seemed to be a little bit too constraining. The general goal here was to provide anon-motorized vehicle path from the Town Center to the SeminoleWAY GreeneWay Interchange District. And, there is language in the old one that talked about a specific route that would go along the north side of [State Road] 434 to facilitate that and we agreed with the goals but we didn't think we should specify that particular approach as one contemplated scenario even though it might not seem cost effective, it might be a reasonable alternative to have a bridge going over [State Road] 434] that would connect the work area in the SeminoleWAY, the GID (GreeneWay Interchange District) back to the neighborhoods in Tuscawilla to provide an easy access for commutes. So we wanted to open up the possibilities down the road as that gets developed and we're not constrained to a specific answer." Mayor Bush asked, "It is a good idea -Commissioners, are you okay with that one?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "Yes." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 8 OF 13 Local Planning Agency Chairman Lacey said, "On [Recommendations] 6., we just struck some language that talked about some jurisdictional transfer of State Road 434 to the City. No one thought that was a good idea. And number [Recommendations] 7. deals with four (4) laning or widening of [State Road] 434 beyond where it is and what constraints we would want to put on where that widening would take place." With discussion, Mayor Bush asked, "And where would you say widening would be appropriate?" Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey said, "From Vistawilla [Road] east to [State Road] 417, and then I believe there is another item down the road that talks about widening further east of [State Road] 417 towards Oviedo." Mr. Fields spoke of concerns with a two (2) lane segment and suggested, "My opinion long-term, is they should four (4) lane the segment from [State Road] 417 to [State Road] 426." With further comments, Mr. Fields noted, "It's a problem today - we probably need to get with the City of Oviedo and see where they are on it." Mayor Bush suggested, "Maybe this just needs to be brought to the attention of the MetroPlan Advisory [Committee] and the Board itself. I am on that Board, so I'll bring it up next time we have a Meeting." Further discussion. Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey said, "The remainder of this section, we did not make any changes to the rest of the items except to add a new bullet number [Recommendations] 10., which is referring what we talked to and that is the widening east of [State Road] 417 through the GID (GreeneWay Interchange District)." Additionally, Local Planning Agency Chairman Lacey said, "Under Major Issue 5, other than in the original document there was a skipped number, so we went back to sequential numbering. We didn't make any other changes to Major Issue 5." Mayor Bush asked, "Questions on [Major Issue] 5 Commissioners?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "No." Deputy Mayor Gilmore said, "We are encouraging housing in these areas and I am not sure we want to do that. I have a concern, a major concern about it." Discussion ensued on Recommendations 3. Tape 2/Side A Commissioner Miller left the Commission Chambers at 8:14 p. m. Discussion Commissioner Miller returned to the Commission Chambers at 8:17 p.m. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 9 OF 13 Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey remarked, "We are on to Major Issue 6 and we made no changes to items [Recommendations] I. through [Recommendations] 4. and just some minor expansion of terms on number [Recommendations] 5." Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Any questions on [Recommendations] 1. through [Recommendations] 4.?" Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Poe said, "We wanted to provide Staff an opportunity to clean up the language on [Recommendations] 6., and you might note that there are still some question marks there because we have not had an opportunity to meet with it." With further discussion, Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Poe stated, "I tried to determine since we had our Meeting, what the percentage is normally granted either in square footage or number of units for Affordable Housing and I can find no consistent number that is used anywhere." Mayor Bush asked Ms. Sahlstrom, "Do you have any insight into that particular item?" Ms. Sahlstrom said, "I looked up to see if there were some examples and it ranged in percentage with kind of an average range being ten to twenty-five percent (10-25%). So, in some cases, maybe as low as five percent (5%), but ten to twenty-five [percent] (10- 25%) was the more common of the ranges and whether this is written in a way that -you would like to see, but we felt that rather than making it fairly open and general as it had been, that it would be better to put some numbers with it and depending on whether we can get Consensus from everybody on those numbers. If not, then maybe we'll go back to just saying a certain number and leave it to further discussion -until we can put something that people do have Consensus on." Commissioner McGinnis asked, "When you tried to get standards of percent -where did you go to look for that?" Ms. Sahlstrom said, "I looked in a document that Randy (Stevenson, AICP, ASLA, Director, Community Development Department) had gotten from one of his workshops that he attended and it was talking about inclusionary Zoning." Discussion. Commissioner McGinnis said, "I think ten percent (10%) is low." Commissioner Brown noted, "My concern was that we were looking at Commercial and not Mixed Use. I fully support it in Mixed Use..." Ms. Sahlstrom remarked, "...And it could be changed to say Mixed Use, if you feel that that's not the appropriate wording." Deputy Mayor Gilmore commented, "I think Commissioner Brown brought the subject up and it is good." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 10 OF 13 Mayor Bush asked, "Does the Commission have a recommendation on the percentage?" Additionally, Mayor Bush inquired, "Would you want to just put a range in there?" Commissioner McGinnis stated, "No lower than ten (10) but not to exceed twenty-five (25)." Mayor Bush asked, "Everybody in agreement with that?" Local Planning Agency Vice Chairman Lacey stated, "I am speaking for myself. I am not. I think that is too high a number." Discussion ensued on Affordable Housing and a gated community that the City of St. Cloud is building for their teachers. On the issue of Workforce Housing, Mayor Bush spoke on some partially completed projects such as Harbor Winds and suggested that the City could step in and help with such. Commissioner Miller recommended that Mayor Bush assist with this effort. Further discussion. Mayor Bush said, "I would recommend Commissioners - [Recommendations] 6. be looked at and maybe - a little differently than what we have just said because I think that there are some good points all the way around and we do need to do something about it." Local Planning Agency Advisory Board Member Karr said, "Maybe we should leave [Recommendations] 6. in, but took out the specifics, like `With more than 200 units' and just say `Requires residential projects to include a certain percentage of workforce housing units' and encourage Developers of large projects in the Town Center." Mayor Bush said, "I think that is a good idea because -the density is always an issue with Developers." Mayor Bush added, "So -that can be done now and I think what Rosanne (Karr) is recommending would cover that. What do you think?" Discussion. Ms. Sahlstrom asked, "Do you want to have this as a Public Hearing Item before it goes to DCA (Department of Community Affairs) for a courtesy review?" Mayor Bush said, "I don't see any reason not to have it." Ms. Sahlstrom then said, "So, we will have a Public Hearings Agenda Item on January 28'h [2008]." Mayor Bush asked, "Is everybody happy with that?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "That is fine." Commissioner Brown said, "Nice job, Eloise [Sahlsrom]." Mayor Bush added, "Thank you Committee." Commissioner McGinnis added, "Good job." This portion of the Agenda Item was adjourned. Mayor Bush called a Recess at 8: 37 p. m. The Special Meeting was called back to Order at 8:53 p. m. City Manager Ronald W. McLemore arrived at 8:53 p. m. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 11 OF 13 In other City business, Manager McLemore commented on the upcoming Scottish Highland Games and the possible inclement weather. With discussion, Mayor Bush stated, "I think we should go ahead with it." Next, Manager McLemore commented that he would be out of town on Saturday. REGULAR 601. Office Of The City Manager ADD-ON Discussion On Fire Assessment Fees. Manager McLemore introduced this Agenda Item for discussion on proposed Fire Assessment Fees. Discussion. Tape 2/Side B On the issue of mobile homes and Fire Assessment Fees, Manager McLemore said, "I can even email it to you as soon as we get it." Further discussion continued. Commissioner Brown asked Manager McLemore about buying a Fire Truck as a one (1) time expense as opposed to a lease? Manager McLemore explained, "There is nothing being assessed for that truck in this scheme -other than just buying it out of reserves and cash. You could assign that cost -you could buy it over time and assign that debt flow back to the assessment side if you wanted to. It will pop that number up a little bit." Mayor Bush added, "I think what the Commissioner was saying is that the two hundred and eight thousand [dollars] ($208,000.00) doesn't have to be a one (1) time cost, it could be spread out over as a lease payment -but it would be two hundred and eight thousand [dollars] ($208,000.00)?" Manager McLemore stated, "No." Further discussion. Deputy Mayor Gilmore asked, "I was wondering -the term `Mobile home' versus `Manufactured home'. Is there a difference?" Deputy Mayor Gilmore added, "A pure `Mobile home' is a lot smaller in size than a `Manufactured home'. Some of these manufactured homes are the equivalent of a good residential unit or even apartments." Manager McLemore said, "I can ask that question. I don't know if that's been looked at; if they treat them the same way. We will ask that question." Discussion continued. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 12 OF 13 Commissioner Brown asked, "What do you need to do to put some hard numbers around this?" Manager McLemore stated, "We are already doing it." Commissioner Brown then said, "By what Meeting or before the Second Reading?" Manager McLemore said, "As soon as we get those numbers down, we'll email them to you." Commissioner Krebs asked, "We don't have to set a Fee right now anyway?" Manager McLemore said, "No. You don't have to set a Fee until your Final Rate Resolution -you have to set it, but the Final one is going to be the one." Mayor Bush said, "That is on the 28th [January 2008]." Mr. Kevin Smith, Director, General Services Department noted, "The 28th of January is your initial Resolution. February 25th [2008] after notices go out to property owners that's the Final, February 25th [2008] - as it stands right now." With further discussion, Mayor Bush asked the City Commission, "Do you want to provide direction to the Manager on this?" Commissioner Brown said, "Proceed." Mayor Bush asked, "Do you think it is a good plan?" Commissioner McGinnis said, "Yes." Further discussion. Commissioner Krebs asked if the Tax Assessment is tax-deductible? Manager McLemore responded, "The simple answer is talk to your Tax Consultant." Discussion ensued on other City business. Mayor Bush congratulated the City Commission on being awarded the attendance trophy for at the Tri-County League of Cities monthly luncheon. Manager McLemore brought up possible dates for the Dedication Ceremony for the Fire Station in memory of former Fire Chief Timothy J. Lallathin. Manager McLemore stated that Pam Lallathin wanted to stay with Saturday, February 2°d, 2008 for this Ceremony. Commissioner Krebs mentioned, "I will send her my apologies that I can't be there." Mayor Bush added, "We need to accommodate her on this." Discussion followed on having coffee for the City Commission, to which Commissioner McGinnis remarked, "Why can't we have our City Clerk make a big pot of coffee in the back, not fill the carafes, just make a pot of coffee and if we want it, we just go back and get it." Commissioner Krebs added, "I am fine with it." Commissioner Krebs said, "I won't be here on the 28th [January 2008] - it has been a long-planned family Christmas present." Commissioner Krebs added, "I just wanted the Commission to know that that is why I am not here." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS, FLORIDA MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING -JANUARY 17, 2008 PAGE 13 OF 13 With further comments on the Fire Station Dedication Ceremony, Manager McLemore suggested the Ceremony may need to be held in the morning. Mayor Bush added, "Whenever she wants to do it, is when we will do it." Commissioner McGinnis noted, "We will work around her schedule." Mayor Bush then said, "We had two (2) Commissioners say to have the Clerk make a pot of coffee in the back. Mr. Gilmore, where do you stand on this?" Deputy Mayor Gilmore said, "Go ahead." Commissioner Miller stated, "Aye." No objections were noted. Mayor Bush added, "And make it regular coffee, not deca£" Commissioner Krebs noted, "Stryofoam" cups. ADJOURNMENT Mayor Bush adjourned the Special Meeting at 9:44 p.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED: JOAN L. BROWN, DEPUTY CITY CLERK AND AN A LORENZO-LUACES, CMC C Y CLERK ~PI'ROVEL~.• ` - OR J~fiN l~'.' BUSH NOTE: These Minutes were approved at the February 1 1, 2008 Regular City Commission Meeting.