HomeMy WebLinkAbout1993 03 15 City Commission Workshop Minutes
.
WORKSHOP MEETING
CITY COMMISSION
CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS
MARCH 15, 1993
The Workshop Meeting of the City Commission of the City of Winter Springs, Florida,
was called to order by Mayor Philip A. Kulbes at 7:00 p.m.
Roll Call:
Mayor Philip A. Kulbes, present
Deputy Mayor John V. Torcaso, present
City Manager John Govoruhk, present
City Attorney Frank Kruppenbacher, present
Also present Attorney Keith Bricklemyer
Commissioners:
Don Jonas, present
John Langellotti, present
Terri Donnelly, present
Cindy Kaehler, absent
Discussion of Tuscawilla Maintenance Issue:
Mayor Kulbes said we are here this evening to discuss the ordinance that will govern
the maintenance of the Tuscawilla areas.
Mrs. Katherine Reischmann, attorney for the Tuscawilla Homeowners Association, spoke
to the Commission. She said the Tuscawilla Board of Directors has asked that the
importance of having a Citizen Advisory Board which is made a part of this ordinance
be elected by the Tuscawilla property owners as opposed to simply being appointed by
the Commission. This was a part of what was understood by the Tuscawilla Board of
Directors and the homeowners prior to this when the poll was sent out to see if the
homeowners were in favor of an assessment.
.
Mayor Kulbes explained that during the entire period of discussion, it was very
clearly stated by this Commission that the Commission would select the people who
would govern those funds, not be elected by somebody in Tuscawilla.
Mrs. Reischmann said, "we would just ask that the Commission would have the final say
in terms who would be appointed, but that the homeowners would have the right to advise
the Commission of their wishes so that the Tuscawilla Homeowners Association would have
the right to send out a poll recommending four names, and then have the Commission have
the final say in terms of the appointment.
The Commission would of course govern and have the final say over how the whole
special assessment is determined, but by all previous discussions that the Board
members are aware of, there was the understanding that the Advisory Board would be
elected, and I believe the City has every right to allow such an election, and I'm
just simply stating that the Board, very strong feeling that this would be in the
benefit of the homeowners of Tuscawilla as well as the City that it would not detract
from the City's powers, the City would have the ultimate authority on how these
special assessments are made."
Mayor Kulbes stated that we have already been receiving names from people in
Tuscawilla who have indicated a desire to serve on that Board without any connection
with the Homeowners Association. He said if you people want to have an election and
submit names to this City Commission for consideration, this Commission will consider
it but we are not going to be dictated to by any homeowners association, or who is
going to be on that board. He said if we do not like the five or six names you
submit, this Commission does not have to select any of those.
.
.'
Workshop Meeting, City Commission, March 15, 1993
Page 2
Mrs. Reischmann said they understand that it is the City's ultimate right; that
when creating a citizens advisory board the City does not have to accept every
particular dictate, that is certainly understood. She said they are just asking
that they be allowed to elect and advise the City of what the homeowners wishes
are in that regard.
Mayor Kulbes said the City is not going to stop anyone in Tuscawilla or Oak Forest
in holding an election to submit names to this Commission; they can do that.
Mrs. Reischmann said then they would just ask that that time period be allowed for
them to go ahead and send out a poll to the property owners.
Commissioner Jonas said one of the problems that is existing here is that we are
taking too much time in this. He said it has almost been a year since we have
started this process. Now we finally got to the point we have a ballot and a vote
and now we are going to wait another month or longer before the next newsletter comes
out with the names that have been selected, and as the Mayor has stated, there were
other names that were submitted to both the Commission and the Tuscawilla Homeowners
Association who are not on that list. Commissioner Jonas said if you are going to
make a good ballot, make the ballot to those people who applied that want to serve on
that committee. He said the Tuscawilla Homeowners Association has taken upon them-
selves to take those names and then from those names elect eight people; now they
are going to send out a ballot for the community to vote on four of those eight and
there are people who are missing off that ballot who requested permission to be put
on that ballot to have an opportunity to be able to serve on that committee.
.
He said he thought the Tuscawilla Homeowners Association wanted to get this thing
underway, and now it will be another 30 to 45 days for those ballots to come in and
be counted. He said that committee should have already been selected, and doing all
the ground work that is necessary so that when the money does come in for the mainten-
ance, we are ready to move.
Mrs. Reischmann explained that some of the ground work has been done but it was felt
that this extra lag time is vital to protect the property owners so that they have
some say in terms of who is selected.
Commissioner Torcaso said he has been against this project since the beginning. He
said if the people want to put in flowers and take care of the fountains that is great;
the City will take care of the roads like they have been doing.
Commissioner Langellotti said when it was first announced that RTC would be taking
over, it was the previous city manager and a group of homeowner members that agreed
to this project.
Isabelle Laub, Blue Spruce Court, said the residents of Tuscawilla did something un-
precedented, they taxed themselves. She said they voted to be taxed and the tax is
to be used for the maintenance of Tuscawilla. Since the people of Tuscawilla were
brave enough to take the unprecedented action they did, they feel they have a duty
and a commitment to oversee the spending of these monies. She said it is the wishes
of the people of Tuscawilla to choose members from among the homeowners association
and with the help of the City Manager to oversee that these monies are properly spent.
.
.
.
.
Workshop Meeting, City Commission, March 15, 1993
Page 3
Mrs. Laub said she did not have the names with her, but they have been chosen and
are ready to go on a ballot, and in two weeks this will be done. She said "under no
circumstances do we wish to be dictated to as to who will serve; we voted to tax
and we are planning to vote again to choose the committee. Please take this very
strong statement under advisement in your consideration because originally it was
asked that members from Tuscawilla Homeowners Association or members of communities
were to be used on the board; they would have to meet with the Commission's approval,
but we are adamant in wanting members from our community and we have very talented
members".
Attorney Kruppenbacher asked for direction. He said "do you want the Board as is
presently written, to be that as nominated by the Tuscawilla Homeowners or as
selected by the Commission?" He said that is not saying that Tuscawilla can not
nominate people. He said originally this Commission's position was anyone could
submit names, then the Commission would make a decision.
Attorney Kruppenbacher said the issue is this; does this Commission want to say
they are going to make the decision as to who is selected regardless of what names
are given to them, who nominates it, whether it comes from the president of the
Tuscawilla Homeowners Association Oak Forest or from whoever, the Commission will
pick them, or does the Commission want to delegate that to be as selected by a vote
as proposed from the Tuscawilla Homeowners?
Commissioner Jonas said his opinion he wants the names submitted and this Commission
will select the names and Commissioner Langellotti was in agreement.
Attorney Bricklemyer explained the draft ordinance that was considered at your last
meeting creates a special taxing district. It does not do the levy, the levy will
come from a resolution. The ordinance creates the district, then after the ordinance
is adopted is to go through the creation of another resolution that would establish
the assessment procedure.
Attorney Bricklemyer explained the way this ordinance is structured is the City
Commission sits as the District Board. The advisory board is merely that, members
from Tuscawilla plus the City Manager would be an Advisory Board to the District
Board which is the City Commission, so all the decisions that are made with respect
to the administration of the district are made by the City Commission. He said that
is one of the things that makes it a dependent district, a taxing district sets up a
whole set of legal constraints that would be different then if it were an independent
district if the Tuscawilla Homeowners were doing the assessment.
He said the assessment procedure there are two basic alternatives, Chapter 189 says
when you create a special district you either have to use the Chapter 197 procedure
which allows you on an annual basis to create an assessment roll, give it to the County
and the County actually assesses the property owners at the same time they get their
ad valorem assessment. He said that is probably the least administratively burden-
some approach, and the County Tax Collector can charge up to 2% fee to do that.
The other alternative is to use the same procedure that you would use if you were
doing a sidewalk improvement. It is under Chapter 170 and that procedure is more
liberal in terms of making an assessment. All that Chapter 170 requires in the
resolution is you describe how the assessments are going to be made, what the
formula is, what properties are going to be assessed and how they are going to be
Workshop Meeting, City Commission, March 15, 1993
Page 4
.
collected. He said you can do those on a monthly basis, and tie that to some other
billing procedures.
Attorney Bricklemyer explained the first time the City does this, there is a
statutorily prescribed procedure and that you have to create the ordinance and the
assessment role by the first of January for the first assessment. So for the
purposes of timing this year, we have passed the window of opportunity to levy
assessments pursuant to Chapter 197.
Attorney Bricklemyer said this ordinance uses the Chapter 170 approach. He said
there are prescribed procedures about how much notice has to be given,and the
procedures are set out in there, but the method of asessment and the timing for
creating of assessments is up to the Commission if they want to do it that way.
He said those decisions need to be made.
.
Attorney Bricklemyer said the City could do a temporary Chapter 170 system, then
as the first of the year switch it over and follow the procedures of Chapter 197
to get it on the tax bills. Commission was in agreement to work under Chapter 170
and then go with Chapter 197. He said one of the critical issues in terms of being
able to do this is its a special assessment based on benefit, it cannot be a tax.
This ordinance with some cleanup would be ready for adoption to create the district.
The next step would be to create a resolution that says here is what we are going
to assess for, here are the people to be assessed, and we need to determine what
the methodology is and the methodology has to have some sort of credible basis in
terms of your paying based on the benefit you are receiving, otherwise it could be
determined to be a tax if someone wanted to challenge it. He said the flat fee is
a little bit more difficult to deal with in terms of justifying that flat fee that
is based on the benefit. If it was all single family residential that would be
very reasonable, but we have to deal with some of these other circumstances like the
golf course.
Attorney Kruppenbacher asked if they work through what they think would be the most
legally defensible approach and bring that back to the Commission as part of the
ordinance, and the four dollars can be justified, that will be brought back, and if
not, Attorney Kruppenbacher said he would bring the different legal options.
Attorney Bricklemyer said one of the critical issues about the assessment resolution
under Chapter 170, you have to have on record at the time of adoption of the
resolution an assessment plat, and you have to describe what the properties are that
are going to be assessed and how that money is going to be used.
Attorney Bricklemyer said there is a sound legal argument to support your authority
to assess special assessments based on benefit and use the money collected to maintain
private property.
On Page 2, Section 4 of the ordinance, Attorney Kruppenbacher said would be re-
worked in light of the direction he has received this evening. He said one of the
issues that ought to be provided in here is that the City is only going to expend
for the district those monies that it collects from the assessment, so that if you
have a 70% collection and you have a budget of $144,000, you are only going to fund
it for 70%, and then if you happen to collect i.t later on you will begin building it
up but the problem you have if you attempt to indemnify the district from the general
.
Workshop Meeting, City Commission, March 15, 1993
Page 5
.
City coffers you begin to create an incentive not to pay it. Commissioner Jonas
said that between Attorney Kruppenbacher and Attorney Bricklemyer, they will find
a legal method of getting 100% collection of the area that is designated as a
district. That is the objective.
Attorney Kruppenbacher said he will put in the ordinance, "the public shall have
the right to nominate to this Commission anyone they want, and if a group wants to
bring in names, they can bring it in".
Commissioner Jonas suggested changing the terms to two years and Attorney Kruppenbacher
said there are two ways to do this, just say all members have x terms or two seats
can be for one year term; one seat for two year term, and two seats for a three
year terms so that the Board is changing but there is stability.
Commissioner Jonas said another problem is we have five commissioners and only four
positions. Mayor Kulbes agreed it should be changed to five members on the Board.
After discussion Attorney Kruppenbacher said he would check to see if the Public
Works Director and City Manager can legally vote which would bring the Board to
seven members. If they cannot legally vote they will have to go ex officio.
.
Attorney Kruppenbacher explained on page 4, Section 6 the "district" is the City
Commission. Commissioner Donnelly had a problem with paragraph E and Commission was
in agreement to remove that paragraph. Attorney Kruppenbacher asked how it is going
to be billed. Mayor Kulbes asked in addition to that question would the City get any
reimbursement for its administrative costs. Attorney Bricklemyer said for example,
when we go under Chapter 197, the Tax Collector handles that and he has a statutory
right to assess up to 2% for collections as an administrative charge and the City
could impose the same kind of authority in this ordinance giving the City the
authority to charge back for administrative costs.
Don LeBlanc, LDC, asked if we could have one assessment for twelve months and send
out one mailing to cut costs, until the 197 kicks in.
Mr. Jim Martello spoke to the Commission. He said he did not live in the City and
had no vested interest in this issue but did want to share some of his knowledge.
He said he worked in a number of capacities for Winter Springs Joint Venture and
prior to that, Gulfstream Housing Corporation. He said at one time he oversaw the
people that did the maintenance. He said the premise that everyone seems to be working
on is the City cannot do the job. He said look at the park, that facility is main-
tained on a level comparable with the golf course! He said another premise, the
Homeowners Association is concerned about having representation as far as the
allocation of the money; he said the Commission oversees millions in the City budget.
He spoke about the irrigation system and the need for repairs. He said the minimum
that system can be upgraded for is $270,000. Before you do any upgrading to the
boulevard you need water. He said the issue of the water is a tremendous capital
expenditure. Mr. Martello said if he was a homeowner expecting to pay four dollars
a month and it comes out much higher than that because we did not have all our facts
together, that is a consideration everyone needs to consider.
.
Commissioner Langellotti asked Mr. Martello if the golf course was releasing all
the water they are allowed to. Mr. Martello said you would have to check with the
Utility Director, but he said when the development company was there, they used the
median to get rid of the effluent.
.
Workshop Meeting, City Commission, March 15, 1993
Page 6
John Katker, Oak Forest resident, spoke about the City taking over and running
the proj ecL
Gene Lein, Winged Foot Circle, spoke about the irrigation system.
Ken Haynes, V. P. Oak Forest Homeowners Association, said there is a lot more at
stake than just planting flowers. He said they are talking about a wall that
might be constructed when the widening of Tuscawilla Road comes through, and the
upgrading of the entranceways.
Russ Robbins, Oak Forest, said this is a gift to the City because these lands are
Winter Springs properties. He said the people of both Tuscawilla and Oak Forest
are only interested in a type of landscaping that they have been accustomed to.
He also said he feels it should be an equal fee per household, not on the value of
the property.
Dick Coniff, Royal Oak Drive, pointed out the initial reason that all of this came
about was the fact that when the City planned to undertake the maintenance of all
these roads and medians they felt they could not do it the way that it currently
had been done and the residents of Tuscawilla felt like they would like, with their
own monies through a means of collection, undertake to maintain the area as they
feel it should be maintained to retain their property values.
.
Mr. Coniff also said these nominations are no attempt to dictate to the Commission
those members that the Tuscawilla Homeowners Association is nominating. A survey
was made looking at people who brought to this potential commitee unique talent,
bringing people in who they felt might contribute to this nominating these people
for the Commission's consideration, and he said our main request is that you look
at this from a professional point of view, not a political view. He said the
intent is to select qualified people because we have a board that has a major
responsibility within the City.
Mayor Kulbes said before the City assumes the responsibility of adding additional
maintenance of public roads there will have to be a study made of how much it is
going to cost the City, and he said he thinks we should go ahead and finalize the
ordinance.
Attorney Kruppenbacher asked if there was any problem with his figuring a way to do
a one time assessment in one lump sum bill and see if he can bridge it to take us
through to when we collect the monies under Chapter 197. Attorney Kruppenbacher
said he will need a list of the properties and a legal description of all the
properties in order to make the assessment.
Don LeBlanc, explained it is rather difficult because the City is taking care of
some of the properties and developers are taking care of some. He said all the
right of ways belong to the City, so you can put every right of way in there and
once you get out of the right of way, then you are on private property and that is
a decision the Commission has to make which private property to take care of.
.
Mayor Kulbes said the consensus is to direct the City Attorney to finalize the
ordinance creating the district in Tuscawilla and create a draft of a resolution
to spell out how the workings of the district will proceed.
.
.
.
Workshop Meeting, City Commission, March 15, 1993
Page 7
Attorney Kruppenbacher said he would have the ordinance to the City Commission
by March 22nd. The assessment resolution would come after that.
On the Country Club Village Lighting issue, Attorney Kruppenbacher will have an
ordinance for the first meeting in April to go with Chapter 197 and have it on
the tax rolls for 1994.
Meeting was adjourned 8:40 p.m.
Respectfully submitted,
Mary T. Norton,
City Clerk