HomeMy WebLinkAbout1991 02 13 Planning and Zoning Board Regular Minutes
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PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD MINUI~~
February 13, 1991
The meeting was called to order at 7:35 P.M.
BOARD MEMBERS:
David Hopkins, Chainman, Present
Martin Trencher, Absent
John Ferring, Present
David McLeod, Vice-Chainman, Present
John Horan, Present
CITY OFFICIALS:
J. Koch, Dir.Adm/Comp Planning
Attorney Lee Wortham
City Manager Richard Rozansky
City Attorney Frank Kruppenbacher
Approval of Minutes of January 2. 1991:
Horan moved to approve the minutes of January 2, 1991. Seconded by Ferring.
Vote: All aye. Motion carried.
Approval of Minutes of January 9. 1991:
McLeod moved to approve the minutes of January 9, 1991. Seconded by Ferring.
Vote: All aye. Motion carried.
Hopkins asked if there was any further discussion to came before the Board.
There was no discussion.
Hopkins closed the Planning and Zoning meeting and opened the workshop.
WORKSHOP
1. Comprehensive Plan Elements.
2. Discussion of Joint Workshop with Commission on February 18, 1991.
Hopkins stated that two weeks ago the Board received the preface and two
elements: the housing element and the traffic element. He stated that he will
refer back to the schedule.
Koch stated that the schedule that she had given out was made same time back,
and has retyped the schedule and the Board is down for a workshop on Monday
evening. Koch stated that she would like to explain the way it is divided up.
Koch stated that she has divided up the workshops into two sessions. One being
manmade environment and the second being natural environment. The first
workshop and public hearing will be on the 27th with this Board and the
Commission public hearing on the 11th. These meetings will deal with those two
elements.
Hopkins stated that the meeting on Monday with the commission is that correct.
Koch stated yes, the Board has the agenda. Koch stated that the meeting has
been scheduled for same time, the one meeting that was cancelled was that the
Mayor and Commission has an affair to attend and that meeting was cancelled.
This Monday will be the first one and an other meeting has been scheduled for
the 4th to make up for the one that was cancelled.
Hopkins said that at this point in time what are we going to present to the
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City Commission Monday. Koch stated that what is on the agenda. She stated
that she is trying to finalize this week. I am trying to get questions
resolved with revisions made, the things you have now plus two of the things
are recreation/open space and capital improvements that we will go oyer this
evening. The was that to me it is logical is manmade environment is the homes,
people, parks, roads, capital improvements. The second group is to do with the
natural environment, and included in that are three things that really don't
seem like natural environment, are solid waste, potable water and sanitary
sewer. The problem with those are what happens to the environment when we are
done with it. So that is why that is logical. Koch stated that she can give the
Board updates on where the City is on those things, for example, water and
sewer, Terry Zaudtke with Conkllin, Porter and Holmes, is preparing that
element, he was not able to be here this evening but he will be here next
evening to give that in person as it is a technical matter. I did give you the
capital improvements section for the water and especially sewer expansion which
is our main problem.
Hopkins said let me stop you for a minute. I am looking down the schedule at
next week, 2/20/91 at that time you plan on delivering the complete draft for
the transmittal. Myself I see that as impossible at this point in time. Koch
stated what she is concentration on at this time is trying to get some
resolutions on or finishing .uP the ones for Monday night and then going back
and finishing the three before the 20th and have a workshop on the 4th.
Hopkins stated that the problem as I see it is that we don't have ample time to
go over the written documents and see something tangible in front of us as part
of the document so at that point we can be coming along and following the
schedule when we go before the City Commission. Koch stated that what my
intention is with the answers that I received today to revise the traffic
circulation tomorrow and give that to you and housing on Friday and land use
and residential, recreation, and capital improvement we have quite a bit on but
we need to make decisions and recreation is what I was working on today.
Hopkins stated that I certainly see that franl the packet we received this week
that there is all kinds of supporting documentation that underlies this plan,
the foundation of it. Koch stated that that is what you write elements on, you
don't pull them out of the air and go look for data to support thenl. You go
for the data first then write the goals, policies and objectives and that's the
point that I'm at now. Hopkins said that maybe to a point you are right but we
need to look at goals of the City and find possible solutions as to how to get
there, we don't want to let the supporting documentation guide us as to where
to go. I don't believe that, I believe that we first need to set a goal,
practically of course as to where we want to go and then work towards getting
there. Koch stated that that's what I want to go over this evening-
recreation.
Hopkins stated to Koch - I would ask you to try I don't see how it is
possible at this time to go through this schedule the way we have it. It just
seems - Koch stated that that is the schedule that I can realistically do that
is what I am going to do - I probably wont even come into this building I am
going to do it at home and that's what I am going to do, I think we need to go
onto substance here. We don't need to go into procedures here we need to talk
about substance - you all have indicated that you did not want this plan to be
what I wanted - You wanted this to be what you wanted - therefore how can I
write it before you tell me what you want. Hopkins said that I think that over
the past year during all of the meetings we have had and with the neighborhoods
and everyth-ing I feel that at those meetings, the majority of them at least,
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the just or consensus of this Board could be taken ou~.
Fer-ring said on that basis I want to ask L.ee, other than advisory that you have
been giving us over the last period of time, have you been contributing as far
as the wr i t i ng of the e 1 emet,ts ; nvo 1 ved with th i s th i ng . Have you anyth i ng
tang i b 1 e to contr i bute in th i s area with ~Jack i e wi th these th i ngs.
Wortham stated I have been requested specifically at the last board meeting
that I get copies of draft in advance of them being delivered to you. I
consider that an order to me to act accordingly and I had specifically
requested of Jackie to deliver any drafts prepared recently of any elements for
your review through me I have not received any since last week. I am
interested in doing that I started out back around the middle of last month and
to me knowing what was before the City at that point my feeling at that point
that this is an overwhelming task and I don't know of anyone person including
God All Mighty could do this kind of work and accomplish putting together all
this data and compile them and prepare language and physically drafting this
document, but never the less in an effort to get the matter back on track
working with Jackie we did draft up this schedule which was adopted by the
Board on the 24th and I thought it was very ambitious but doable. Koch stated
by whom. Wortham said you were involved with the preparation of the schedule
and the Board and we discussed it and if there was any problem with it being to
ambitious then we should have really flushed it out back on the 24th. 1
haven't seen any minutes yet but I am sure that they will be silent about
anybody complaining about it. I recommended at that point early on because of
the volume of the task it would be advisable to get a consultant on board and I
had a lot of explicit discussions with the planner and she persuaded me that a
consultant would be redundant and a waste of money to the City and she
certainly had the capabilities to sit down and write it and so on the basis of
that discussion and the meeting of the 24th we came out with the schedule now
what I think what I'm hearing since that based on the way the schedule was
conceived the schedule may be improperly conceived that we need to get the data
down and the decisions based on the data inventory analysis and then arising
out of those discussions and decisions then the goals, objectives and policies
wi 11 emerge. We probab 1 y have pt-epared the schedu 1 e backwards we shou 1 d
probably revisit the schedule - I don't feel comfortable leaving the schedule
like it is knowing full well that the first week after the schedule was set up
we had broken the schedule and continuing to break it I will renew my
request/suggestion that the City /this Board should consider the recommendation
for a consultant to help Jackie with the massive undertaking. Ferring said in
all do respect I thought Lee that's what you were doing, that you were going to
be the consultant, I thought that's what we were paying for. Wortham stated
that you don't want an attorney to write YOUt- comprehensive plan, in the first
place there is a lot of work to do that people go around and collect data and
compile the data. What you need an attorney for is to look at the language and
make sure the language complies with 9-J5 with the fot-mula with the recipe for
the plan so it looks like a properly written plan. So there is no problem with
the language. Comprehensive plans give people rights to challenge the City
cause the City to spend money and so they have to be written with internal
consistency in mind. They have to be written in such a way as there are no
traps. My thinking is that i would be a consultant I would be available to the
City, I would look at language to make sure it says what you want it to say.
But in terms of actually writing it, and taking the data and complying the data
to the goals, objectives, and policies, I can't do it - I am a consultant but 1
am on an as needed basis, if you want to shift my responsibilities.it was never
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really clear to nle that the City wanted me to commandeer this project. Ferring
said that he thought it was cooperative effort. Wortham stated that he thinks
that was his feeling on the onset as well.
Hopkins asked Wortham how practical this schedule is at this time. Worthan
said I don't feel - Koch asked what schedule - Hopkins said the schedule that
was adopted on the 24th. Wortham said that unless Jackie is (can't hear what
was said). Koch said - that this again we are wasting time not talking about
substance that I need from you to put in this - my understanding - and it was
never told to me anything else was that the attorney agreed that his time could
best be spent answering questions I had about specific interpretation - we
spent a whole day Thursday - he has written on questions here - today I did
receive a memo that covers some of the questions on traffic circulation and I
will go through tomorrow and revise and get that out. Koch stated - I came
here to work and if you want to talk about anything else I am going to go to nlY
office and work - Hopkins said we came here to work also - Koch stated she
wants to talk about capital improvements. Hopkins said - I understand at this
point in time my concern is for the C"ity of Winter Springs and our carmon goal
here is to develop the comprehensive plan working together which we have been
diligently for quite some time now, however at this point in time now it is
getting so late and I feel that as my obligation as the Chairman of the
Planning and Zoning Board we need to do something to get to a schedule that is
practical for the deliverance to the City Commission of the final draft for the
comprehensive land plan and as the Planning and Zoning Board Chairman I am
going to do what' s necessat~y to get OUt' paper work to us as Board members so we
can make intelligent decisions concerning the future of our city so with that I
also noticed that the City Manager and City Attorney is here this evening and I
want to let you all know this too - so that I don't know what needs to be dcne
but I do know that I am gett i ng ner'vous about th i s schedu 1 e.
Horan said he would like to summarize where I think we are - with regards to
goals and objectives on two or three of the elements. We have a total of 7 or
8 elEments to write. We do have a draft of a preface, a draft of the hous"ing
element and 1 and use element. Pt~ev i ous meet i ngs part i cu 1 at-l y on January 30th
we did identify a number of different goals on the land use element. First was
to maintain and preserve the existing residential nature of the City. The
second one was to upgrade substandard developments and blighted areas. The
third was to pronlOte the creation of a commercial development to provide
personal and professional services within the city. Foul~th we had identified a
goal to protect natural resources ane fifth a goal to coordinate with local
utilities to assure future availability o-F essential services. I do have notes
identifying those particular goals, objectives and policies depending upon how
they are identified and how they are articulated. Specifically, on the
succeeding week, specifically last week, when we were reviewing the traffic
element we all were in consensus on the development and implementation by the
City of a collector road system whic1i is really the consensus of the Board that
was reached some months ago. We do have the data to back that up as far as the
studies are concerned as far as the financial data on the impact fees. We also
identified a goal to coordinate existing traffic circulation with the proposed
CRS - what does CRS stand for? - and future land use - I forget what CRS stands
for. Koch said - you have the traffic circulation - you have had it fOI- about
three weeks. It was dated January 29, 1991. So we are ahead of the game so
far. Right now the way I look at it we have a preface, we have a draft of the
land use el~lent and we have some things that have to be added to it, we have a
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draft of the housinJ element, we have a draft of l,rle traffic element, so in
terms of putting together a text here we may not be as far behind as we think
we are if we can just 9ather that data together and put same word-smith
togethet~ who can match up the goals, objectives and policies with the hard data
that is being compiled by the planner or am I off base here? Koch said - I
explained to you that I am going to rewrite the traffic circulation tcmorrow
with some of the answers that I did receive today, housing and land use I I 11 go
ahead and redraft or make the changes although I do not have answers to some of
the questions you all raised about that so I'll just indicate although there
are still questions to get some opinion on fran the DCA. McLeod asked which one
is that on. Koch said - housing and land use okay - I have recreation/open
space that I'm writing today and I don't feel the need to explain the fact that
I only had one hour to work on this - ! 'm writing I'm typing it up out there at
the break I'll finish typing it and give it to you. Hopkins - Jackie we're not
trying to . criticize your work - what we're trying to do - we're not trying to
criticize your work or your ability what we are trying to do is to reach the
ccmnon goal of coming up with this in a tangible product in front of us - Koch
- That's what I'm trying to do - Hopkins - and we are offering and here to help
that's all. Koch said what I want is to go over the elements that I
want to finish the ones we are suppose to be talking about - get your feed-back
- you have the capital improvements data, we talked about where we need to add
facilities especially parks,you have the data now to show you what
those cost you need to decide now where and how much you want to recommend for
the next six years and how it is to be funded. We talked last week about
suggesting a short term as a long increase and I have the report you asked for
in what we can afford on the roads, the map shows what we have to pay for and
what will be paid for in impact fees.
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Hopkins asked - Jackie do you need help in getting the pen to the paper. Koch
- what I don't need is people - Hopkins - do you need - Koch - I need time not
to have to do something else and not have to do secretarial work frankly if you
want to know that. I plan on staying hane tcmorrow to work on that - it is no
more frustrating to you than to nle - Hopkins - I understand that, that's
why I'm trying to assist you in getting the help that you need - Koch - you
have spent an half hour now on things that I'm trying to take care of the best
I can but I can't t-ead your mind. 1 want you to tell me now after going
through the capital improvements material especially on parks, I'll be glad to
stay and del ivel- it at 2:00 a.m. if you 1 ike - what do you want to do as far as
proposing additional parks. Hopkins - Jackie when a schedule was adopted by
th is Board for a 1: intent in purposes I intend J:o try my best to enforce it.
Koch - fine - the schedule I'm not sure was the schedule that was adopted by
the Board , the schedule that was given to the Mayor and was read by him in
public and that's the schedule that I'm going by. Hopkins - jackie instead of
being defensive about this, believe me "ill now trying to criticize the quality
of your work what ! 'm trying to get is the product up here - Koch - fine, if
you will tell me I'll be able to finish recreation if you will tell me what
additional improvements and capital impt-ovements - what do you want to do, what
do you want to recommend as far as addCtional parks and facilities Hi the next
six years. You want this to be your plan, I can make up what I want.
Horan said at our last meeting we did identify a
spec if i ca 11 y I have three that are down hel~e - first we were
on developing incentives to developers to pt-ovide recreational
we a 11 agreed that we needed new I~ecreat; ona 1 f ac; 1 it i es but
nUTIber of things-
all in agreement
facilities since
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them was not necessal~Y 1 n the new areas where we needed thern were in the old
areas but none the less that was an objective. That we should encourage
recreatiom.l facilities close to each residential area of the City so that if
we do have a new area developed we could locate a recreational area within that
new area that might be able to be accessed by a residential area that is not at
the present time accessible to recreation and also we did identify the bicycle
and pedestrian ways could and should to residential \areas to recreational
areas - that's three of the things we identified last week. We also talked
about getting a consultant to tell us in the future about what is the best way
to go about th is. I'm not sut~e whether we came to a consensus about th is, as to
whether we should identify a goal and objective to within a certain period of
time hire a consultant to do those type of things, quite frankly don't agree
we need but I'm open to be persuaded. Koch - what I'm putting in here the
things you mentioned are in here, what I plan on putting under that 1S a
proposed po 1 icy is to look at a 1 ternat i ves . We don' t necessar i 1 y need to h i I~ e
a consu 1 tant the Depal~tment of Natur' a 1 Resources has peop 1 e that they will
provide help to you through state fund~ng, they will give you advise at to
what to do as to the guidelines. Also we have the possibility of working with
one of the Universities, there are ways to do this without a great expense.
Horan - I would cer-tainly be in favor of including as a policy, because a
po'ic/ ~s a method of achieving a goal to identify those particular resources.
Koch - when we take a break I will run copies of what I typed and give them out
to you, but what I need with the cap i t(ll inipi'overJ1ents - you have the cost of
the super park, there are tV/O th i ngs to look at, one is the ba 1 ance of the cost
that is not funded. the second will be helpful to us as it tells us how much a
ball field costs, what a tennis court costs, we can find out how much it would
cost to put these things in another' neighboi'hood along with the land costs.
Ferring - Jackie, in regards to the info on the super park and the cost factors
these are only estimates is that correct, and each of these things will have to
be bided out is that correct. Koch - they will but we did get the consultant
to revise phase I, they called today and the figures for phase i is the same,
they do not have anything further on phase I I . Ferring stated that the comp
program from the Department of Natural Resources has a lot of good thoughts in
and I think we should adopt because: think it addresses a lot of our needs
Koch - if you want to talk about par-:-:s f i:- st, I wi 1 ~ I~ead what I have.
Hopk ins - what I would 1 ike to do fit'st is to get the consensus of this Board
as to how comfortable they feel we are cc:min3 along at this rate as far as the
preliminary/final draft of this comprehensive land plan and the delivery to th.=
City Comnission. Horan - when do vie have t.el do this - Hopkins - by April 1st is
that correct Koch IiO, I'm del ivering to them for the workshop Mo:,day
evening the elements that are thet~e, including what you are providing me, they
wi 11 sti 11 have questions on land use and housing. that we need to reseal-c!!
fw-ther, but they will be in there what we want to do is put the question in
there whether it is legal for us to do this. Hopkins - is everyone all
comfortable with this. Horan - so in ct!"!Elr words we al-e going to have draft
elements for the Comni ss ion O!i 1 a!-;d use, hous i ng, recreat ion/open space, 2,nd
t;-affic circulation and capital impro'!em'5:r~ts by Monday - Koch - by Friday:
hope, 1 '11 take the'TI to you as soon as they are done.
McLeod - "'::hink Jackie is making a gn.:;at effoi-t at this t~:ne to try to gathe,~
information for this Board the only thing I wish that four months ago I ccu'~
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have had this 'information so I could have read it, a I....~sted it, make sense out
of it and I'm right back to the same thing I feel that I'm trying to put a
rubbei~ starnp on this thing and I' jm sorry and I know you are trying and I know
you are pushing now but this is the information this Board needed four rronths
ago and it totally discusses me t~ s~t on this Board and now receive it. We
went through it Jackie around and around and around and never had nothing in
front of us to put OUI- hands on to look at to try to make sense out of at least
for myself, I couldn't sit down and digest one area and digest another area for
my input back to you or back to this Soard as what I felt the citizens of this
City set out here and expressed their concerns to us and some of the stuff
right now will take me weeks to read to digest to tl-y to make sense out of to
ask an i nte 11 i gent quest icn because my bus i ness is not th i s on a da i 1 y bas is.'
Koch - this is suppose to be a sumnary of what you all had said - McLeod - it
is not - Koch - well it is - McLeod - it is not, there is stuff I have never
seen unti 1 I received it in the mail , it is not sumnaries of what I said. :<och
- the elements are there - ~cLeod - so~e of the elements are at this time are,
but the documentation, we have seen the element, and now we are getting the
documentation. why didn't we have documentation so we could come up with a way
we wrote it element, what's happening is that we are getting an element writ":;':i"
and handed to us and saying this is it risht, you are saying all this stuff you
are going to do by Monday, and give to the Comnission, I guess that's fine-
Koch - no I'm just giving it for a workshcp for both of you, you can change it
however' you want unt i 1 the 3 i st of >1al'ch. McLeod - okay there is all kinds of
documentation we are receiving - Koch - a workshop is where you just toss it
around and then you go back and change whatever you don't like. McLeod - you
are doing a fine job in gathering the information for us now - Koch - I claim
no responsibility for Octobet-, tJovembe' and Decernber, speak to somebody else.
I wish we could get on with it so I can go. hcme and finish this, nobody wants
to get along with no mol-e than I do - now on pat-ks.
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Ferr ing asked - on capital cost for the super- pa;--k if they are gOing to stay
with these figures, i think it would be a good idea if they wel'e here to
discuss these figures. Koch they have made that pr-esentat i on to the
Ccm11i ss ion; what the Comni ss i on sa i d as of .'ow, we 11 actua 11 y they sa i d: they
are going to look at in the futw~e they 3.:-e going to try to get a lot of this
funded by private donations by funct~':T:S that wi 11 generate money other gl'ant.:"
but there is no set fund i ng sout'ce now fo~ the rest of that ffi;:)ney. So a 11 we
can do, we can not claim in the ele!T.c:it ''::hat it wi 11 be in place as of 94 or S:
whatever, we don't need to include that. in the level of service. We just won't
be ab I e to i nc' uce that since they hav (: not prov i ded or can not pt-OV i de a
fund i ng source. It doesn't rea 11 y cause us a prob 1 ern as fat- as wr- i t i ng th i s
plan; we say that we wi 11 do that, we are not claiming that we wi 11 doJ th,7';:.
befor-e 1996, that our level of service does not include that, we are net.
claiming,tle arc not prcmising that we wi 11 ,::dd that to our level of SEll'vice::.
Horan said - 1 don't understand what you mean by level of service in the
reCieat i on sense. :':och - we -; 1 genel"2.11 y the number of acres pet- thcusand: f
popu 1 at ion, what the county did and what e\lel~yone else seems to do and what :
suggest to you 1 S you ca 1 cu 1 ate what you h2.ve now and .:.et that ::-1"
especially if you know that with gro\'1th you can keep adding to maintain th"
1 eve 1 of sei-V i ce. There is no sped f -' c ;. r::::qu; i'Ement 1 i ke ther'"~ is fo:~ ,.;:)a:.ls.T
sewer capacity with parks, that is one cf the subject ive matter-, that you
really determine what it is that you want to be able tc.:)ffer. Y::.L,i cen
recorrme!'Id a much higher 1 eve 1 of serv i ce than we have right now, and reconmend
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that taxes be j-aised 3 mi 11s for th'3 next 20 years to pay for it or you can
recomnend that we be fTOre demanding on developers increase what they are
required to provide, you have that options, there is no authol~ity that says
that you must meet at least this, the guidelines that I gave you are based on
sw'veys at-ound the state. Those :1~-t~ pr-etty genet-a 1, what a f ae i 1 i ty can
hand 1 e. You set a number of acres fo;- ceve loped park 1 and and a numbel' of
ac,- es for undeve loped par k 1 and.
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Hopkins said okay Jackie what specifics do you need from us this evening. Koch
sa i d to cont i nue fl'cm 1 ast we~~k. Let me r-ead what ! have right now: To pi'av i de
passive and active recreational facilities taj/lor~ed to the specific needs to a
suburban r'.:::.:;idential conmunity of ultimately 40 thousand persons coor'dinatinJ
the public and pl-ivate sectors to ma:v:lrnlze the variety and dispersal of
recreation sites to be appropt-iate and accessible to persons of all ages,
interest groups and special needs in a derrographical1y complex population.
Horan asked what's that: ;<och stated that this is the overall goal. The fil'st
objective is what we were talking about and that is expand the City's public
park systems so that developed outdoor' ;-ecl~eational facilities and open spaces
are located within each of the majoi~ geographic at-eas of the City to provide
safe and convenient access fe;- all citizens for passive and active recreation.
That's what we don't have now; in order to meet that objective we have to have
a policy that would p:'ovide safe and convenient access which means we have to
put in a park on the southwest and south of 434 Oi~ throw out that object i ve, so
if th at is \"hat you want to do we can 1 eave that ob j €let i ve in; if you don't
want to recomnend that we spend the money fo;' a park south of 434 or the 'other
opt ion is to say we an-l-, ic i p"lte 'tie w'j 11 be ab 1 e to meet that obj":)ct ive when
Eagle Ridge is platted and that park is sout!l of 434 and is dedicated and we
don't know when that will be, -it will be a little inconven-ient fot- a lot of the
people but it will be on their side of the five lane highway they won't have to
cross to get to the park. Those are the two alternatives to keep that
objective. You can recomnend based on the cost that you are looking at, Greg
carne up w~th some f~8ures of what land VJould cost. The undeveloped area of'
unpaved roads in the Ranchlands is about 10 thousand acres the assessed va1ue
wou 1 d be a who 1 e 10:' j'"xe but on the other hand th i s mi ght be a good t inle tc
buy land since it is not moving, maybe this would be a good time to put ow-
money in getting land down there. If you lock over further scme ef the lots at
FoxfTOor East some of the lots that haven' t bee~, bu i 1 t yet, the cost goes up to
1 0 thousand, that's net that much mOI~e, those::lre pretty close to home. The
other area of Foxmoor there ar"en' t any lots there but we do have Foxmoor I V if
you recall that had some land that is IIOt yet developed, that I::; a 1 ittle bit
out of the way but you really don't need to make a choice of a place of a
specific site in setting a policy, the policy would be to find within the five
year period 01' by v;hatever you wish land that can be purchased and developed to
pt'o"/ide 3::::ti'le l'ecr":)ation il'; that quadrant of the city and to fund that
operat ion by whatevel' revenue source you want. We can't rea 11 y k~,,=-\tI up front
we have to go tht'CU9h a lot of land ser:cch and ap;::;~aisal and talks with the
neighbors about how they feel about ha\'ing a park next to their house whatever.
You can set that objective ycu can say' that we want to go to the expense to buy
land and to develop it to make sure we I,ave it rather than count on Eagle Ridge
or we can say we de expect that l'Ie \'1";:: h;,:v~ 21 park ; n th i S :.3rea by 1996, so Woo
cannot guarantee this, you cannot say you will meet this objective by 1996
because we don' t know so you wou 1 d ha'/e to e 1 bi nate that fi~om your 1 eve 1 of
service. Alternatbely find land, this could be an either or situation, you
c:;u 1 d have a pi~oposa 1 to buy 1 and and c:eve lop it elsewhere un 1 ess the Eag 1 e
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Ridge development goes ahead by 92 or wh:::..tcver you want to pick then that would
be considered to meet the level of service fo, that area or both.
fen- inJ ~sked what did tl-,e B03.n! '::ecic1~:; "':.::.' do with the "ve:::.t pocket pa.d;
concept". Koch stated that there is a difference in terminology. My idea is a
lit.tie place whe;e yeu can put a swing, 2 .:;ce-saw and a picnic table but :,ar::/
says his idea of a vest pocket pad< is socleth i ng 1 i ke Sunsh i ne Park. ! n th i s
~~~'2:;:ent we wi 1; define what we mean what :::;ur definition is by a vest pce;,et
park.You tell me what you mean by that. Ferring said he agrees that a vest
pccke~ park doesn't have to be gigantic tut a park accessible to all sect~ons
of the City for di ffe/ent areas, fOI~ each part of the City. Koch - each havins
tr:el( own, Fer;~ing - that's con-est. }~~';:h -we have quite a few of those now,
we have little ones here and there.
Wor::;ham said - I suggest th3t you misht want to make that a defined term, a:-...:1
rea 11 y spec i fy what you want to be i !', the parks yOU may want to set as an
obj'3ctive the establishment of one Ot' two :l..,ei-~. ~~a!:e sure yeu know what th::j
at-e going to cost, you have to be careL'ul on how you draft it exactly. He.:-a.;-,
stated that he has a problem in sett~:i8 specific goals with regards to
add i t i ona 1 parks in 1 i ght that we rea 11)' don' t have the funds to pay fe.:- -::he
super park that we have right now. we C~i.nt even, we have an engineers estir-ate
indicating that the pat-k is going to cost alrrost 5 mi 11 ion dollars, in the
const,uction industl~Y the engineet~:: est.imate is known as the cost r:;"
consb~uct ion in heaven, so i presume since we don' t have the fund i ng mec~a:l i 3''1
in place I p,esume its going to cost. pt-obably more than that and much 1 ike
~iaitland did and their consultant is also Gladding/Lopez, they probably v/i'~
have to ,eadjust going down the line as to exactly how many things they want in
the super park, because simi lai~ to Maitland maybe our eyes are bigger than
their stcmach. I'm not one to be '~ptimistic, but I -::hink as far as this
cOllprehensive plan is concerned I wou:c be hs:.sitant to put concrete 98a1::> as to
specific nev.J pal~k areas in i -:9ht of the fact that we can't even get this or:
line with the funding mechanism within the five year period of the plan. Kcch
- unfol-tunate 1 y that' s what we h 'lve ~_:o do, we have to be SpE:C i f i c so the
al-::ernative is not to have that obje'ctivc, 'Iol-an - yes that's what I'm sayil:S.
Koch - that's jour option.
;- e!-i~ ins : was go -i ng on the concept ~:hat th..=y had fran natut- a 1 I-esoe,wees 0:-1
what neighborhood parks consist of on page 102 of the comp program. Hopkins-
',,,,h2t c!Cle::::; it S2Y - ,",eli-inS) - it basicallj _.:,:,/; that a neighborhood pad: is a
walk to park generally loc2!:ec alo~lg the streets where people can walk 0:-
~ i oye 1 e without e~':::cun-t:ei i ng heavy ti 3~: .:.::;, ~~: Sei-'1eS the popu 1 at i on of the
neighbod'1()'~d in a t-a::Jius of up to one half mi 1e and should have at least two
act~es ':c;~ each 1,000 p.:.;pulaticn, its sL:E:~:.::;;al1j' l~anges frcrn S to iQ acres and
i-:: seives a population up to 5,000. Koch that',:; basica'ly :;unsl;i:-;-:
Pad.:, its .:;>.;\'en ,:,:fe::-, :Xit 01:'y abe.ut - Cli-'.:::!(-;\/eloped the ,-est is \\!oods i:, tha":
at-ea. Feiiing - liOU mentio:',ec.l Cm<nuo'- - Koch - what we't~e sajing based :::':-.
that beca:Js'2 : :-l:~d .";2"~er'ied t;-ja': her'8 as .3.!.~cptin9 their~ guidelines in genera:
but then refine to our particular case, you would have ":0 duplicate Sunshine
Park on the southwest or south of 4:4 v~ich JOU will do with the park in Eagle
Ridge but we don't know wheni the; wi'! cedicate that 20 acres as soon as they
plat phase i, at l'2i:is: i -;::h:; person that ",ade that COll1llitment has that
autho;- i ty they 'vJ ill, they have the piopel-ty up for sa 1 e and we don't know when
it wi' l be deve 1cped i VI'::; kno\"" that dele i opment is go i ng to be, \~Ie .::an' t
anticipate when it's gOlliS to be. We can not really count on that so your-
cho i ce is do you vvant t..:> te; 1 the peep "I e that 1 i ve down there - we 11 yc'u jU~1~:
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ha'/':2 to V'I'} it, ~.>,~1 t ' - I"" ,:~ chc;. ice, ":h,J.t VJl~ I" "1'':'~V we wi 11 get. -t.h i S S'::r:i8 day ~'~'..:;
vn-i:.te:-, in a legal binding agreernent \</-:oe./(;;' whQ buys the property w~ 11 have to
do th ~ S, \,,112 know scmeday ycu wi 1 ~ h,:rv'e one but we don't know '",hat yeaj- t;-,a'c.
ili 11 be; ,.);- d:) you \'/3.nt to say: we need to d:) s:)rneth i ng about th ~ s no'..' fol' SL::' S
anc1 by ~-: y:~.)r \'/8' r '290 ~ I-,J t.:: buy 1 and :.::.nc1 put i!l t:'dt po.t-k ever. if - HopI< i n.::;-'
myself personally I certainly feel tha': with t~le advent of this new park 60
aCI-es and just set:. 'h.:; the r'o:sour:.es '''0:' that alone is go i ng to be rn..)nUiy,e;i',tcus
ch:);-e so : 'r."l not sw--;:: if we need to addl-e::'is that because we don't know the
potentlal this pa,,'\, Dl- t.:je p':;~8ntla~ ben8-~it for t.~;e city's j'-esidents. ~<'::"Gh~.
one of the requil-el"le:lts is that. ~~cLe;)d - I think what the citizens wet-e
ask ~::3 fer is not another Tuscawi 11a Fa:-+ o;~ any thins 1 i:-:e that, it ..vas :.l.:::--:::: :Ot
:::,ma" 1 ar-ea, scmethin8 :3.:1d basica11y "3.~'9-:l enough that had a SCI-een, a l~ttle
bit of g,-'.::Jund at- ea. '.::',at -::,8 k i (~3::::U ~ c.: 8~;t-:ut thei-e and play ball and a S'>" ~"0
set that was i !-: the l'le ~ ghbot-hooc! a.nd it may (lot even be ca 11 ed a ne i ghborhoc-c!
park as i,u.:;h as it ,,:ay ;;9 an eqi.r: pmer~-t ,:::.r;:: ,::; ~ ay area and 1 th i rok t~at thei- e ',:::...:;
twe. areas -:;:.f th8 c~t)' they wer-e ~ook ins tc. have se,..net~ir;9 of that natur-e i:'1
their- neiSihborhoods. I<och '(eo:; t::a:' s the sO:Jthwest area and we. '....ere;
1 c.ck i ng at Oak Fcrsst, th-::"e 1 s none in Oak Forest, they have to cr-oss
~USCa\'i i 11 a pr,:ad to get to that. McLeCJd - and I th i nk that soreth i liS prc:bab ~ ;
in the five ac:-e s~te is what we're discussing that needs to be possibly
discussed regarding additional funding for the property but is was not intended
by the peop 1 e/res i dents to be a 1 arge pat-k as more than just at-, area that t";::
kids can go and in joy themselves. Horan - 1 'm sure that we have a situation
that there a;e bui ~dil-,g lots out thet-e avai lable and nobody is bu~ lding and
cash is king and de','e 1 opel'S are wi 1 : ~ n9 to 9 i \'e up 1 and, i wou 1 dn 't have c:':-'l
prc;:;lem with pu-:tkg s'.:-,nethins in the p13.n \'/e should encourage the City to seek
out tho.::;e s i tuat i::-ns 8spec i a 11 j in these econcmi c times and !Juy 0p'.:.:n
space if we can get it. l(och - the ccmp:-:Jmise is to fund the land al-,d (::0:-''.:.
wo,"-ya:;cut the develop;nent. F2::'il-,] That's ":'le p:)~i-''.:. i br:)ught out las':
week, spe':. if i ca 11 y wi th Oa:': i-orest that there are propert i e::. 1:-. .,)F that v/o:..11..::1
qualify for what we're looking a-:, bu~ unfortunate~y we wou:d have to take
other- parce 15 ,:,.f 1 a:-id that the deve 1 ope, wants to dispose of at the same t irne-
:<.:;ch like gl-eenbelt areas Ferri'-:j - yes gt~eenbe1t a.reas and certai:'.
drainage areas that they have unde:- their' owne:--ship, they have :"'2en mol-e than
wi 11 i;-.:J tc. :0 ive a: 1 to us. Koch - a:-e th:Jse net undel- the hcmeowr.er.3 - Fe:~r ~ :,g
- :,0, aga in they wer e proPQsed to us ane we refused them because V;2 wou 1 d n;:.':,
accept ~:he c,vel-a"1: liability of Salle (,'f :~-:ose greenbe;t areas. ~<::-,.:.h - ~ ;:l,~)-:':::::
Gle!! Mai~vin about this a:--e.:;t herc" betwee:-, the two power easements thce't they have
f""':ot develcped ill a lot of ~t w:~ 'Net --(can't uncer'star',J.:' ':.he r's~t~ l<och-
re"e"':!be:- we were 'talking about Braewid', tl,at's anothe1~ possibili':,,' because ':'!-'':':
school oca;-d i.3 ;-;et h'cei-'2sted in that anymore they ai-e talking about (.::sr:~:)'.::, .
asked Glen Mar'vin i~ there were any otl-Ier ai-eas we could lod: Ce't T-:).::,t :.,p tl-.~
rest is n-::;t de'/eloped and b~lcn9s to the golf course. Hor",'3t"' - Srae'l/~ck 1:=::
contiguous to U"e existing par-t.. I<'ecn - yes that is a Httle en",:.
McLeod - ~he ~reG I was speaking of i~ th9 area up 11: the older area, that's
where the peop 1 e were interested in par\s Horan - that's an a lm::Jst unsc 1'/ab~::;
problem, Koch - well thel-e is this pie,:.s way .)ver nere but that's kin~~ ',:"-; out
of the way - Ferring - and Eagle Ridge wi 11 be a little toc' .ca;- awa,/. Kc:.~,
there ~ s about 5 a''''-':~''''es in the Ranc~ 1 ancs V.fh i ch Vvou i d be good for a. park,' ...:;al-;' ':
unde;stand) - would int,'ude on their- way ,,)f life wi':::1-: othe!- people ccmin:j ii-,.
Putt~r~2 ~n :.ht~ ~d3a of jus~ ~undi:")g lajlc ".'I~::hout \t'ic!-rying ac<:.ut pu.:.-:~n:J .-
facilities, jus'.:. having the ope:-! hiSl', dr') land fot- the kids '.:.c sst off .LL,
~:'j-e8-t ~'"-; the;: .:..~~n objectl\/ea
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J-!oi~an - I thir;!:. \^le ha\'e a pretty 800J ~clc.:~ :-CM ~0i- Jackie '':.0 dr-aft scme 9'.::.::iL,
objectives and p':ilcic.3, il-l that ar~.;" as f3.~ as support date:. ~s '':OliCS:--:s.:l
t.hers 'is probab~i not ;;--;uch sup;:.:;-t G::~c.un'8ntation that's needed be..:ause "'il,=';-e
rea 11y not going t.:> get ove,-l/ aTtit ~cus on that - I' d 1 ik'2 tc m:>'. s on t:.
cap~ta; im~jn:JvemenL:; 2r,d sanitary sewer anl~ some at-eas that we real~y naierl'':
talked to much about. :-:op:-:ins - okay before we dc. want tc b.:'E; a b-it.:~
;-ecess. Hop!:. i Ii::: -. I wou 1 d 1 i ke to ca 1: th ~ s ? &. Z WOi-kshop back to crder.
Hopk i r:s - okay before we move on Jack i e i' d 1 i kc to just back -up fc:- a second
and ask YC'-l if there are any other- grey areas m the housing e; ement. :<cd--
yes there were tv,..:; quest i ens that we ra ~ sed one was whether 0:- not we can
require that older housing before it's resold, we can require that they ~e
inspected to see if it meets current codes if i',: could be up-graded; the othe
e"'''' ',';as if we Cl-eate deve lc.pmr;;nt '.:ategol-y or deve 1 epment star,da:-ds f..::-
affordable by clustering, providing other breaks for the develop~- ~n order to
be able to cuild housing mc-r8 ecencillicall/, ho\'! do we know that that will be
passed on to the buyer, ....,hat other V!ay:~ \'...~ 11 we have to insure that. Hopk ins-
couldn't 'tie wor!.; out an incel".t~\fe pian t.~, :.Jet into :ccrn'.::: kind of c:::Jnt!~act - Kech
- yes , that's what 1 den' t kilOW if W'2 have the power- to te 11 sanebody you h2c"e
to csmnit to a p-ice fOl- a house. We:~sharn - it's not so mush the fil~st cuyet-,
the deve 1 oper must se 11 f.:):- a certa i:1 p:-- i.:e, upon resa 1 e the quest ion 1 scan
you legally require it to be SOld at a eel-tairl lower depressed level. i:':"s 3n
issue that has been discussed and I' i11 :-,::.t sur c it's been :-eso 1 ved, i' 11 do SCi-r2
check i ns to see and i' '1 i try to get yo,-! 3 :, tatus report.:m that, Koch - that's
what we wanted to ~8 .;;.b 1 e to put somet!-. i :-1.0 in - we wanted to kno\'; ~ fit's :;=: i :-,~;
to work - is it going to be :-heto;--jc ,:::l:':,\,~:; s:r,f\:..rc::: it. Hepk ins - are th ::-195
lik-::: that submitted with the ccmpr-ehensi\f2 ;:-1a:. - Koch - sure.- !-:.:Jpkins- :en':
is it... i ewed and sha 11 enge.J al:e v/,3.:' :-r:::' - 'NOi~ sham - yes so 'w'e I....c=ed '.:::. ma!:.'2
sur-e that sOllething submitted is doable -- ee::'ncrnica11) that wi 11 wo:-k s:'cir-:S;
back to th~ f i;-"'st one a :-1',JU'::;f2 nju~t il188t cede when so 1 d - th';}!'"'e ~i-!.::;
requin:ments that ;-eq:.Jke an uj:s;:-adiiis o~ the olde;- housi:18 even ylithout being
:;01 d, Koch - is thel'e 1 i ke a statut'S'.:;ha:,vs C2.n ~ase it on 'Norsh.;m) -- ur,c::;:-
home ru 1 e 1968 -before th,Clt /DU had to :'laV8 ii charter that to 1 d exact 1,/ wha'..:
';/OU can dc, noVo' ut;der-' hCITle r'u~e ycu car, do Ctn~l~hlng un~cs3 t1-,,?:--,= ~s al ~a:i"l '~>J'::'-:'
saj's YC~ can't. The cities can :;)0 under- the heme rule, the CCU!,ty has chaf:'':'-:':'-
125 l'lh i ch is the equ i \:::~ '1 '3nt, so un 1 ess .t.~-,,:;.- '3 is a b.\^I '..:hat says you c:en' '.: ck) ie.
you Cl1 do it - i' ~1 check tc see think chapter 166 g~\SS yc~ th~'..:
authority - :<:och 1 haC: ta i ked tC:::lX :)~, -; 1 d i r':s.:::ff i cia 1 and he to 1 d me th3,~~
was no way we COli 1 C CC th2.t in F: s.:- i C:2., J~.:13.'::.' s wh)' we n'Sed to know fe'l- sc_w""
\vha:. t.he 1 :~V\i says -- the next th i ns i::; h.:>\'/ ~;- s we 9[~'; r;g to func -:h is. '/:Cl- sh21:-
that goes under the health sa~'Sty and we:fare of the citizens of the c~'..:J"
Kech - i ha.d put that i:1 the heu::; i ng I::; ''jl:ent. and I 'Na" about tC'~,ak.;: i':: '.: '.'.
based on what he was te 11 i ng me - just "/ant to make SL,r e that \'1'2 h2"s
semething to base it 0n.
;-k:,pk 1 :-;5 askeJ i.~ t.here are any othe;- a:'" ,:-::215 ~ n that element Jack i e th.):. -- ;(c,\:h--
in hous i ng : don't have it in f;--ont of me but when : go throu8~-i it and when I
ccme .'.:::; it:' 11 m::lrk it. Worsham'- any',:,:')in:;; else you want me to research::~
suppo:-t YO:.JI~ 8ffo:-ts just 1e'.:. me kno\-/. F3i-;--~l:g - maybe we should inc:--ease ..:.ods
enfc:,,-c:emel-:t fo;~ the i~e!-)abi 1 itation of nOLlsi;-,SJ. Worsham - : \.I2.nt to t:-j; a,-,::':
maintain my legal position as a source cf in.:ome fo:- the City iJ.:. f::-::ooably ,0:>
!-;-::t an'i":~; ~ !-,9 ::'hat COLl 1 d be ;-e lied I.:n ~o do an'y,th i ng w ~ th. as a mat t.eiO :;:=-
expe;-ience nc:,ne cf those p:-ograrns ever ~.:iI'eal< even. Koch \^IO:-lc!'~:- if '.:.:,.:::;
nli8!~t net ~~ any 8rants we could lsc!< ~~to.Fcrril'g - O:1ce ~.O~ stsp u~ =C~2
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cnfct':'Sfn8;~lt -':.h'2ti ";-:. ~.:; rr:....::.:('e of a detei'T'er'Jt and wi 11 ':3.u~e ~Tl0;-',::,,: ~;ec:ple tc be
awal-e e,; it at',d you will h~\'..: 30'-\ autanatic up-gl-ade of your housin:3. :~oc:-,-
8vel'/ rlO't/ ai-,o th::::, I get not ices:;f Ji ~nts t:,at k ~ ;,d of j-ef (;j- t,::> th~t 1 i \e
rehab i 1 i tat 10r, Qf rent.a 1 house.: ::mc! th i ;}gs ~ i ke that SQ there may ~e f;..HX; i :\J:'"
~:;Ul-c..es ~~~- lovl to n-.cderate 4nccxne ar'e~~ '/'IE: rrd:.;ht be ab~e to 9'~ c3ck to t~-;e
conm..lnjt/ development block SF-a,-,t p:-,:)gralli we wouls have to set th,::; C;:)UI-,t:,.' .CC
:~W,;;lit us :::om~ 0-:' the funds :::0 t:lei~e rni g:-it !>2 scme sc:,-,;-,::;es fei- that. !-).:.pki:-:3-
! see where you do address that in t!-,is housing element on paSJ8 3 unde,- b; a2
:a.i" .13 21:-, e,bj':lctiVf; sees t:) j-ec1airn the 1ive::..bi~ity of the neighborh-:,od in the
origina' townsite to improve th'.:: sta,,:l~:-d of 1 ivinS for curTen':. l-esidet',ts arc
;-es-:.ore the :l!-ea as a desi?-able hcrnc.s~te t~ ;Jctentiai buyers 3.j-;d then it ::;;c-s.:
on under the po 1 i ci es numb.:;:- '" a'-.'.:! nurnber. 1 as the code e:,force--,2!:t t..:::
elir:lio;ate al' e:-;'ceric:~ dr;;:T.2.daticn a'"'d number two to institute i-e-~nspe'.:::t1'.:'''\
requirEment upon resale prior to occupanc,/ by new owners to aSS1..we housing
meets current bui Id~'-9 stand2!-ds - sc t.hat. r:~etty much sews it up. Koch - fiCf'n
now \',Ie can change that to add U;'::::J:l scme determi na:. i cn the prob 1 ffJl e>~ i s:.s
without \'Iaitin9 fo;- i~esa1e, so we can ,'evise that. V'Jorsham - we could ha\/\::
someth i ng 1 i ke a cert if i cate :)f ;'e-cc::upanc/. Koch - we have a :-ei nspect i.:.o:-\ on
cannerc; a 1 pl-opert i es, Hopk ins - I >'.nov-.r of a lot of areas that dc::h i s fc.,-
ccmnercial propel-ties, howevel- the :--.ey is to de it effectively, : SUPPQse th2
supporting docurnentation to be effecti'.e because I can recall at one t~r.~e
renting out ~ place in Da/tD:-;:':.. Beach al-'23. and they i'eql..iired that reinspection
and they carr:e in but the place d i c.!n ' t ~:'enef i t ~ny fi-om ita 11 ~..... d i~ \'idS
require additional fire extinsuishers th~ngs 1 ike that Horan - -; think \'Ie'/'e -::-,
consensus ':.hat we ;-e~ 11 y do want to st," 3. i :jhten the code enfol'cement in the '::. i tJ
! th i nk the peop 1 e want it the So are.' wants it eVSj')'one has said th;;;.t that's
scmetl:ing that I s going tc 08 9':::oc! and ! th~nk we can even go sc fa;-' as tc $2
we want to increase funding fc;- it wed::u-:t to actually sp'2'-ld the Cit;:'::; "':C';-,E:;.
and do it. Hopr'.ins - the point that! ".,::,:; tr/ing tQ get at ;s th2.t I think th:
nuts a;}d bo 1 ts is perhaps in the zon 1 :'9 part ~,och - what we nee:! tc' GO ; '"" S('.\'
that th i:: is what we want tc de; and s<ly'::.hat th i::. is we C~T; put ; ti J",':
provision of the building code by 1992 e,,- what ever how you are gcir-:.;; to dc, ;~::..
HopI-- ins - that w~ 11 we:'k. Kec~i - that ).:.u are go.i!-J to ame:,d the aui ldin9 c::;c'.
and at that time that's when the sta:-,da~ds wou 1 d be worl<:ed ou":.
H:)i-an - sO' basical;y the ,hE:t.:)ric it-; the housing element afld l"','-d !,.;~,::; e:'3'-;I(:,':::'
~;i11 be c::>oi-jinated. !<oeil - ! was bo!dng at the county's p1ar-,3.!-,d tile) a,-",
;-ea 11 y not :-nak i ng any sped f i cs ancLJ,at is what t!l is i:; 2.11 a;:;:::",t p' .:if-,-: i ;'I~:
what you are going to dc, quite silTl~ b,' to what evel-yone else 13 c~chJ-
?v'orsham - DCA doesn't 1 i ke t.hat 1 angUage they say they ar'8 gc l"S f~,.: change i '-
you have to be mor-e spec if i c about wl-,at tlley are go i ng to change it to sc, J:hey
have serne performance standards which cat, be measured - :(ocl-: - \"f': si-'culcl p,,-
that in nQw.
Hopk'1ns - cka> n~ayl:)e at th-is -:irn~ we cc:r. 1.'.()V~; on-tc) ca~ital irnp~""c\!~31';lents. V'=<:~...
- okay we 11 , Hopk ins - un 1 ess you have someth i ng else Jack i e th21": )iOl! ar~ "...:-,re
prepa"ed fo!- whatevet-. :<cch - I nig1lt tell ycu O'ne thing that '.:ame up :,o:::!aj
th.:.t an individual that has been workil"lg with us is that they have been tal;,i!-.;;;
with the ~choo1 bcar~ ~bc~t t:~e ~ite tJ~3t is just nOI~th of c~t~. :-la~l. I to'~
t:', en', that it was in 1 ifie \vith ow- proposal, Hopkins - it would nece2sitat2 ':-'-,;:;
;-OC,C ::'::>nsti-uct ;c,r" Horan - that wou 1 d ;;:;8 'dc',dei'fu 1 -- Koch - tn'2:/ :-,':;", e -'::: "'~;- '2_:';
the ::,:::h,::>o' b0~;'d wa~-:t.:; :::0, the, a:-e :.::..-::::..ing at the possibility O'f bU)~-.9 the
,;) 1~ S3\V mi 11, th~i ai-S 1cc:k i 1',,3 at sh3r c ,l~ the park dUi' i il8 the G2/ t i:','? \';'hel-':~:-.,
pal'k i 1-: !iO::' i '-I use, ill retul-;-I fo~- the ~ ,- ma i ntenance. i encouraged thST: to puJ.:.
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7_ogsthej~ a i';8et ~ ns . Hor an - .::iU)' e
school on Tuscawil1a. ~cad, th S is n
'j ke a ;1 8h 3ch,;:,o 1 ther e bette: than a;', -: )-,
cr;.. .~J.. ,.. ts 1ntc:' Q'...ir traffic s.:henie.
::'::;.e!-, - : ta.lked to the pei''::'cn \'I~t!-, the ;-a-:l;-oacJ 3r;c!they hays',;:) plans J..:,:
va::ate the t'ight-of-v:ay s,:) I went through this with -':hcrn and was -':c 1d that tho:
on>/ place that :hey are 10d:iriJ at t:. '!aca-ce is -:";'011 Oviedo to :\loma. "Is are
back to the pr-c~ 1 ern is that ths)' wi: ~ ie::;U ire us to put ii, the r ail :'oae
c;-ossinSNhich.ve will have to .::10, 'd'lic:h wi 11 cost about 160 thousand_ ',\'2
misht :,e able to put under- impact fees the on1)' publ ic full fledgE: crcssins :.:.
Jet ~nto th,:;,;:: ;:;;-cperty. Fe,'ring :"s(,~d Wc/shcm - i-c it is possib'e i:' the
futu:'e that the City invoke condernnat ie,-, pl'c'::edures a9"" ii-:st CSY .::~n'':: ca:, iJ: ::::.
done. Wor:::;harn - ther'::: ~s no pul::1ic pw-pose, I'm thinking there is scme fede"a:
preemption. 1 can check on that, I'm .-,:;,t, pt'ep8:-ed tc' answer- t},a~. the Ci'l)
can': conde:l1i1 cet-ta i n types of Pl-ops,.-ti '2::>.
Koch - that's a good deal for' us, if they 3re !'ot "-; 1 owed any mOt-'2 C:-OS'::' 1 !lgs
then the people w~ 11 have to bui ld thei:- ':::0'2c:.ion of our :-aad to deve1c,p t~-,:;:;i;'
1 and. Ilopk i ns if we put up th i s PR o-css i ng whc is 1 i ab 1 e i f sc:me:'~-l ii-,]
happens at th:=.t cre::;s i ng - :<och - who evet- caUS8S the pr:)b 1 Em 1 gue:.:.:::,. ',11'2 ;-:.::l\iC
to pay fo:- it thaJ,:' s a 11 its not ou,-.::,.
Koch- :/cu had asked'cihat iJai-"'::. of -':I-,e ;-Jad system :.he c~ty would hc:.\'E: t:) pc.y'
for, and on the map it shows what vii 1 ~ be ;:laid for bj the developers e:-:pe:,se
and as it shews it is C;L;ite a bit cf iJ,: will be paid for by the c!e\elop'-:':-.
Un 1 eS3 we ~ i nd 'we neee ~ t a lot 30''::':-'2,' that the de'is 1 cpei- will deve 1 op the:
~ 3.nJ, bL~.~. ~h~; ilia -; j-: (...,f"")f; t.:-':at you ',.I\.ler'e l nterested i 1-; \vas the !-lclj-th sc':....:.1~>j
connection as ycu car: see we cat', get :'!-:'2 i isht-of-w3.Y donc,.:.ed. what we \'i'.)u1d be
pay i ng for bas i -::a":./ ,s jus:' the ;:2:, i .'19 and that is about one and a qua,-te:-
m; 1 es p ~ us 5, OCC feet. The cost th3:~ 2.;:,p ~ i es is frem a 7 m; 1 e I-cad syste;,', the
ave;-age is 1.2 milliot-: for th',:: ,-oac. '':he number uS'3d -is said h the':Td~':~'u-'c'~
is frcm the itTlpact fees c::;'u 1 c~ be changss 'J"el' time. We al~e co 11 eet i ng r,c,'-:s;
based cn that number -:;.f ye2T::;. 1 hav8 a'::;o est ;matec1 out that with the SW.J..it":
that 1'1'2: seE: for 96 that you had on p'.:..pu 1 at ion with t!-iat much res i del-it 13.1
develoi:r:'...:;:':t'de ca;; ;c.c.,k at about 2 ~/2 'l)~~l~or; dol'a,-::; in in-pact f8es b/ ~?::,
that's just residential. Corrrncrcia.l ~.:. ','8'-;/ iff; but it is very gocd re/et-l'..!':~,
depend::~ he.,,, the: e'.::orc:my picks up a~ter 93 things should start ~novi:iS. ii,:. ,C'c;"
years we shol,;:d st""rt getting :-eVe!lu': -I'I-Ul cOTt:1E:rcia1 i!llpact fees. We \'>'C'.,::; ~8
able to go ahead and ck.\ this p-:)j'2ct i'i~t!:';il the ;-;'2:<t fe':! i';C~;-S ;-is!-,t I":'.! \'f"
have about 400 thousand (:011 at-S as SOO:l as that's approvec we cou 1 d go ahea:!
and start that. That's the t. ';rne 'fIR need :.0 I::c..rne dC''J'Jn ,3t'-:d nlak e t.h..= dec.'; s i (")l-~ hc\'.'
to do this. W'-:en we d'.) th~::;, ViE: dcr,"c wa":~' to be intrusive, we could oesiS'-'c:'-::
J,:hat as a scen'j c road - Shore Road. ,':.... ' ~ we need to do is set tha~ p::'1 ing 211.:
sorne drainage. Hopkins - Jackie how many miles of road are we talking ab':-L:t
tota 1. Koc~, - probab 1 y no more th""n Ie ,11l 1,:;", i nc ~ ud-i ng everyth i ng we are st ill
lockingat2,? mi1lic",d0l1a:- project, the fact that we have a:ot of':he
;-ight-cf.-w3.Y and get donations of ,-i::)-;t-of'''.",ay \,>,e cculd pay fo;- t\:f~ pa\l':l-,J.
The pal-t c; the right-of-way nere is dorlated as part of Eagle Ridge and up ',ere
the pr'~pel..ty ':"\'ll-:Si'-S ':/~ll dedlcate i-: ,./'.~.i.l~d b~ ir: their In:.erest.. 1-<:., ;~~;-.
Jac;.:ie ~n setting these impact fees and c:etermining how much its goi:-'8 t.:- cost
in the cap ~ -:.a 1 imp,'cvement therr.se 1 '/es i c)rJce the cap ~ ':a 1 imprc't:lmer.ts ~l!-':: i ,-,
place, is there al'/ "'!3./ c.f k;-,0\''/'i::9 cf he;! tc pay for the upkeep and r,la~i-,ten.J.i-,c:::
CT the cap it.:. 1 irnpl'c:,'ements; ;:;;-esume tha't' s goir'9 t,:) be - :<OC> :~'la"::.'::
not pa~''': of illpa:t fees y.)u can on ly p,~/ f::; capital improvement. HOi-a:-,
see. l<c;ch it wi 11 be pa.'t of t.h8 ;-':;:ju1ar cucset l-ike any ct~'':.:r ':,':;-'2c:;~ :_
r'"
~
assess. Hc,,~~n .-- sc once the ;nf;"Ci.,:,~;'-uct.~;;'e .i3 in P~,.::.:::8 that t~-:e +:~.jpac:. -:-ef.;2
;;uild the way you maintain the infrastn~ctu,e is through ta>,e3. Ko..:.h" ';':.s
l-:;,e any o'::.e, stieet we take or. ','/8 <:(8 ,-e::;ponsible ;or maintenance ~t:;cme_,
o~t of the general fund. But the logic is that that road 0~~1 create
deve~opment which '",i11 ~ay rrc;-e ta,<es. ;Ie;-an - : thi!.k that's a corcept th,,:.:: ."
lot of people miss and I'm wonce,ing if tl"iel-e is a way we can ad::l:-ess that i!'
QUI' ccrr.prehe:nsive plan as p8rt of CUi capit,ll impt-ove-nent elc.rne:t. :-:.:::1-"
.;:.per-ations are not a part of capita~ improvement, its part -.:.f the bud9e"~.
t!c-ran - ! understand that but the phenomenon that is created by thE.: f~c':.; I--"~L
you - I have articulated this be~ore one of the problems of impact fees is ~h3t
';f you :-ely on impa.ct fees rather" tl--an tax b~cJse to bui ld infr"1sti-uctur'e '::y>c:e
your infrastructure is in place once your storm sewer is in p'a'.::;e ':.'nce :/OU'-
j-oads are in place once yow- utilities are in place \^/hat have you, the \va; /eu
ma i nta i nit a ftet- that is good old f ash i on taxes. I s there a ..../ay we can
articulate:hat as part of the land LIse element. That because of the capit3~
impr-ovements that we're go i ns to have that we must pran:>te the kind of
developm'2!:t ~~.at \ve need to expand the tax base so we'll have the j"e'ienLJ<2
avai lab~e to maintain the infra3b'ucture, 0:- is that something that's jL.~:.-
:<och - the..:cetkal1y if thej-e was no development -there would be nobody tearinS)
up the :"Oa0, so it wou 1 en ' t . you COU 1 d put ~ometh i ng in the tr a 7' f ice 1 eTie:',-';:
Ter the 1 C'i8 1 of standards YOI_ ,'Vant te. keep the J-.)ads up to and hO\'-I th i::; sh:.u 1:1
be funded. Horan - yes I can see in the year 2000 OUI" Pub 1 ic Wot-ks depart;nent
is going to be expanded, its ;,;,uclget wi' 1 le-ok nothing 1 ike its budget kcL:
tc.day. Koch - also if there is no development there won't be impact fees to
bui 1d the i-oad3 sc development ccmes fii"st HOI-an - I know, but jC'U see the
developllent that we have hel-e in Wirlter Springs though is alnr;:)st excl~sivelj
res i dent i a 1 and if we have the bedrocm ':oncept as the way to go for'N3.,-d, "IF;
have to understand that as 'we build infrast!-ucture through inlpact fees, \'/e'i~e
gOil;9 tc have il-;ceasec ad valo:-em taxes because \"Ie're gOll-18 to ha'v'e::o
ma i nta i '-, the i nft" asb-uctw'e. Koch - \'ie may get some benef i t from \'Ie get ~
share c.f thecc.unt~, impact ane it is actually based on what we actually spsnd,
and ths !lure we spend the mot-e we get::;.f au, share of the gas tax, and :) i d.
L,;.::.es t!iat a lot -":..- mair',tenancc; so if v/e':"e doing a let mOl"e conpared to t~-!.::-
othel- cities 0'. the gas tax then 'Vh; get n'O:-e. theo,-etically as the 2Irount of
t3.X 20e5 up 0\/ ~~;- the year's, If/e geJ: iT~r"!: "toC\. Ther"'e ; s another', I th i (-d, ~ t ' s
state money we get. Sor:,e r:,f the things are based on mi 1 es of t-oad. \lve 003.
i"eport annual ~y that we send to t!ie St3':': on \.."hat additional rni lage Wf:. :::rected
and that has an affect on wl-iat we get &j-O'll then -For roads. Horal"t - okay other
than ad laloi-em taxes there are other so\xces of 'income then - 1<och - yes.
Ferring - Jackie jumping aheac' a little bit on the se\'/ei' 3rea what'.:; the status
of the d<:'cision that was made by the City CCim,ission regal~din9 the ,-esen'ati'.)n
capae i ty chat-ges. Koel. - That's the ':' I f you ,-ead t!-.rougl"1 the cap ita 1
imp"o'v'en1ents pi'OpOS 3. ~ -;-Oi- was-~e wate," hr West that is \'/hat the;, w(;!"e bas ir'<~:
this on, how they \'1e;-e propos~ng to pay -:-0;- the e>:pansion the \'/est waste '''Ia:.e;'
ti-eacment plant. Fen-ing can't that be ;-t.;Si..:;'rected - :<och - ye~o S:.11'8-
FelTins - can \',e be a part of that YOUI' talking about $650,000. ~~cc:l - /SS :
c.::.'c know if there is an;: i-cason t.l", at )'OLl cculcn't 52.j je-i.; adopt th~::;
p:,,;:.p;:.sa 1, t'cccrrmend adopt i ns imp 1 e:-nsnt i n~ th i s propos a " they a It-ead/ voted::n
it, don't know if the!-e is any - FeITi:"lg - is t~';e !-(;st of the Bea(,j aware ,.c
th2.-: pat-t i.:u 1 ai- aspect. Koch ~ I th ink some 3.:~e.
:=-er;- in9
tJ t:-:e
- bas i ca 11 y th i s ...."as scmeth i n9 that was an c-b 1 i sat i::>n -:hat was eCiT;,j Uf:;
City a3ainst the devebpers that was V8i-y heavi~j lobbied an..:': wa.:; ..:t'2~
,,-..
.~
- .
~o\Vn b/ -::he Comnis:, k.", wher eby thej ha::2 Cl 1 88a 1 pes it. ion thd:: th~ J8/':: 1.:':;2.' ~
':.::an put into the po-:: anothei~ $:C50,00C1 f:Ji~ rese;--vation anc oapaoity ch::u-ges ~i':'::
it can be pLi'sued ..:::,,; I thin!. if we ~1C.'.'j ~,--:me ;"Iput in that 3TC:2 2nd LE'SC-: -'::h,,,
City' Camti.:;.:;iO!l to /-eview that; it car', ccme in with this. :;ooh - Ne:>:t k2~~:,
vlhen Tet-:-/ .;~.~ here ~-!8 -~~'J.n give 'leu ;1 lot rn'::'i'""e insisht in!.:/..:- t:l~l't. dtl(j \.\,I!-<.:t$.:. .::
wou 1 d i'sa 11 y mean, you are,' i ght tha".:. the~e was a le'.:. of pt-e.:;sut~s f:'c!;; t:'",
peop 1 e -s!':owere go -; nsto have to pay tl',c : nCI-ease i 11 fees, the i S$ue is S!:CL. ~ ~
people who already have reserve capaoity pay connection rates, I belie\s, .:..:
the pt- ice tney we~-e '.'Ihen they reservec i _c, :~\ien '':.hough t.he pt~ 1_:e may be h i ~)Ie:'
when the; actua 11 y connect or- sltou 1 d they have to pay the pt~ ice i "I eff e'.:!~ 'I,,?
year they c:otua 11; COi"':'lect. That was t.ne issue. Ten~y oan give you ,,-~):' '2
ins i ght and what other opt ions are in order to do -I:h ~ s, 1 H-,,~ we talked about
la~:;t w'3ek, tltis is wh::'lt w~ II hold up cll~velopment in th~s area out here. Ta~i'e~:J
with him today and he was kind of ant"ci;:'2ting that the Schrimsher de-/elc-p,:,s",:"
to the east of us weu 1 d hook UiJ to Se~' i :',.::' l e ut i ~ -j ties if they wanted to:' S,,-
ahead as long as they .:3.ie read:,- to pay fo:~ the cost fo:- s~<tendir:9 the 1 ~ne c:..11
that c~~tal',ce. th'c:,-e i,'~Jht 0'::; a \"ay, t!--:e.-e p:~cL)ably ~s a way that i'<" t1':;o;/ ,'~-::'
go ahead and fund the 1 i ne that when :..ther peop 1 e cleve 1 op c'n that 1 i ne ':.h:::J
oould get ,-e-irnbu,-;:;ed fer the oo:st of the lhe, t1':e/ arc Vel"Y good abou':" c_:~'j
a p:-,oject ve;--y well, and thej an:.: riot conce~ned about do4ng a.:::. 1 itt1e a;:;
possi~le, s:; t1-:sy mi::;/:t '':':c that if it:: ~r', ':.he'ii~ interest. But this area .:::..r':.
here we wou 1 d a lmost have to do it, because anyone of the pi'.::pe;-t i es i Sf'! '':.
b';g enoush that they::ould a-Ff:xc1 that, O:ie per-'son out here 1 ike with the 5C
acres, fo" than to front the money t:J d:J the 50 act~e deve 1 opment wou 1 d p:'obab 1 y
be prohibited because they wou1d just be paying the way for ~very one else to
come along, Horan - How does the :-IS i ghbor .; ng propert i es in OV i edo, ho',! aI's
they serviced. :<c:h - cQunty, Oviedo Goesn't have any sewer -::;per-at-ions. Tht:.:
have watel~ buJ: :Iot sewe;-.
Hopkhs Jacki:: de you intend tc adc'l~es.s the priorities as far a cap-ita~
improv9'l1ents 9':, Kooh - .sUl~e that' oS \'!hy' i asked yo:..! what you wanted to d:
becau::e 'de :,3.;e ~::: ~ n the cap i ta 1 irrp:-Oielllents \v!-!en 'we get a : i tt 1 e ru -,;
p.ecise estimate, : ca:-I es".:.ima':.e now ac.".:Jut.1 m~ 11 ion dollars th'-0~9h 96, what
we ::an do w -i th that, want to have th~ er!g i neer to hol< at th2.t. for ffi:)i- e
prec i se f i gw-e for wl,at. that \"OL 1 d cost today, but that amount of money yo. i
sa i d you 'f/anted to use 3 l)li 1 , ion do 11 ars::;f imp:'l.ct fe'2s for- th:51'':, t.hen we '1e,::,:I
to look at what's left. arc! loc.k at. what we can start on Ot~ do with tl-.e '-est of
the money, Hopkins - 1 believe the cou....ty uses the impact fees fer just th."
maintenance 01- expansion of ev:ist-ing faci'ities and capita' irnprc'ven':ent"" "".""'"
-!'"u:ided through other means. l<och ,- no the county's impact fee is diffe(e:-I'c:
than ours, they have a 20 year constl~uct i.:n Pl-ogram of roads the; wa:-,t t:
in~rove - Hopkins - so there -is quite a difference. Koch - ge!ler~11y they jus~
want to add a c.)u;::e of lanes, open 2. lanes t.) 4- lanes. Hopkins - but. ,:,ven a:
f'al- as watel- and se"ie:~ goes and what not, it's m/ uncJerst.::.n.:Ji;':g that they don".:
use impact fees to bu~ ld new faci l-ities, they on1';.- use impact fee:s fe.- eXlst-il-,S!
- !<:.:ch -, the impact fee for .."ater anc 3 awe 1- is the::onnecJ.: ion fee and th:;
reservation fee is paid before anything is built. For the roads they just use
the irnpact fee fot- cap i ta 1 impr'ovements, nc.::ody can use an impact fee ,..
ma intenance or operat ing cost I 'm afl~a i c.
f-kJpk ~ ns - in the book that you handed out tC) us it does J- e 1 ate that i r, thsl-e ~L
says: Impact :- ee.s shou 1 d be used O!-! 1 y ".:.s pay fe. new pub 1 i 0 f ae. i ; i J,: i es 0,'
-inlpr '.:,vernents to ex i st 1 ng pub 1 i c f ac i 1 i ties vvh i ch ale ;-equ i red so ~ '?: 1 Y' b8caL~e _.C'
a nevi develvpment. In;;:>act fees sllould not be used te finance the::u'Tsc':.ion ::;.f
I>.....
/""
..-...
existing problems however. Koch - they cannot be - Hopkins - it goes on ts say
that appropriate pol icies and ordinances which require developers to pt~ovide
land or pay fees for the identified public facilities that are necessary fc:-
them; is that the route that we are go i ng. Koch - yes as much as we caii
t~equ i re the cJeve 1 oper to pay - Hopk i ns - as in the roads north of 434 as in the
construction of our new road. Koch - yes, well there are two things there,
once we adopt this niap then they are bound to ----- create some road that will
add ----they can't say we won't do this we want to do that. Hopkins - suppose
Jackie there is someone in the middle is the first person that decides to
develop it. Koch - they come up with the money to do it, we are not bound to
do it by any point in time, 'we are using a standard system of impact fee, so
we're not bound to do anything at a specific time. Hopkins- but they are bound
to abide by it - Koch - yes, in concept - Hopkins - in other words they can't
get a piece in the middle and come to the City and say we want to go str-aight
out to 434, can they do that. Koch - they would have to appear -------1 think
their master plan would have to al least include the right-of-way. Is there a
danger of that happening Jackie, is there a danger of having 6 entrances on
this back road from 434. Koch - the p:)int is to control traffic - Hopkins-
that's what I'm getting at, and if we can't control it then maybe we need to do
something, to place something in an ordinance or something to - Koch - DOT
especially if anyone wants to access on a state road they have a management
system that we have to adopt in our traffic element, and they are setting the
standards they will not allow access points cer~tain standards they are
setting that's all under the control of DOT.
Hopk ins how about intet~governmenta 1 coord i nat ion then, does that stand a chance
at resolving some of those factors - Koch - sure, once this is adopted this
will go in the urban area transportatk'n plan, they get down even to the local
level. When this is official, I can take it to the Planning Council and every
year thi:.:; is revised to b~anspo;~tat;on irrpl-ovement program of what
everybody expects to do. I don't know about the enforceability - its n"fJre of
an informational program so everybody can keep up with what everybody is trying
to do, so it is coordinated.
Hopk ins - okay Jack i e is there anyth i ng else that you need ft~cm us as f at- as
this element goes on the capital improvements that you can come up with right
now. Hot~an excused h imse If because he had to get heme before 10: 00 P J1. to
receive a phone call.
Koch sa i d the ma in th i ng we need to cover with the waste water- expans ion,
remember I told you the last time, the only projects I included was estimated
to be built by 96 was those that already had capacity reserved, that was
residential, if we - to be internally consistent - say if we wanted to develop
downtown here and if we want to develop and start working on it and enCOUl"age
people to caTle in we can't say over in waste water element well we don't have
any sewer capacity; you know we have to be internally consistent we can't d~
both, I mean one without the other. In long term we want to develop down town
when we have the money for the capital improvements or until someone else
fronts the money so that they can go ahead and develop, that's possible too.
Sornebody with a big enough project might front it. Hopkins - let me ask j'OU
this Jack ie, ccncerning the workshop coming up on Monday, just for sc:-ne
resource so I know what's happening, how are you going to pt~esent things, hav'e
you a plan yet. Koch - well I had laid them out in that order, but basically
again that's a workshop and its informal its an informational session to tell
'l,~
r--
-~
thEm what it is your proposing and answer quest..ons and get feed back,
basically to inform them and get whatever comments on things that you might not
have thought of then add to that the conments fran the public on the 27th then
add to that and then its ready to go to the Calmi ss i on pub 1 i c hear i ng. Hopk i "s
- Jackie I'm not sure just what you gave the Commission at the last meeting.
Koch I am giving them new copies of everything - Hopkins - I feel its
important that they receive something, because that was the mayor's concern.
I'm cur i ous Mr. Worsham at~e you go i ng to be here Monday a 1 so. - Worsham - I
have to be in Tallahassee on Monday, if possible Frank may cover the meeting, I
can be available by phone. Koch - that has been scheduled for a long time, if
Frank can't come he usually will send somebody.
Koch - I called the expressway authority to get the new schedule and he was not
in, the person I talked to said that as far as she knew things aren't backed up
that much, our stretch to be opened at July 93. For what Lee has here is that
we can start permitting 3 years before, with that delay I don't see n~ch
happening with the econcmy and everything, that gives us more time to plan for
it and get the Code straightened out. I'm sure the Commission has the opposite
approach they would like to get things sooner. Hopkins - you do realize Jackie
your importance in all of this as we are getting closer to the dead line, lord
forbid if anything happens to you, we're in a deep bucket. Koch - nothing will
happen to me other than showing up here that's what I do wrong, I'm just
going to stay home the rest of the week and work on the plan, its not anyone's
fault, it is there is just so much to do. Hopkins - I know that I never
thought that there was so much involved as it is, it's been a long road to hoe.
Hopkins - so basically Jackie you will go over the hard copy. Koch - yes.
Koch - i did have the affordable housing in the housing element I will just
leave that in and add to it. Hopkins - Jackie I urge you to utilize anyone at
all to help you complete this.
The meeting was adjourned at 9:53 P.M.
I
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~>
PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD MINU'I'ES
February 13, 1991
The meeting was called to order at 7:35 P.M.
BOARD MEMBERS:
David Hopkins, Chainnan, Present
Martin Trencher, Absent
John Ferring, Present
David McLeod, Vice-Chainnan, Present
John Horan, Present
CITY OFFICIALS:
J. Koch, Di r . Adm! Coop. PI anning
City Manager Richard Rozansky
City Attorney Frank Kruppenbacher
At torney Lee Worsham
Approval of Minutes of January 2, 1991:
Horan moved to approve the minutes of January 2, 1991. Seconded by Ferring.
Vote: All aye. Motion carried.
Approval of Minutes of January 9, 1991:
McLeod moved to approve the minutes of January 9, 1991. Seconded by Ferring.
Vote: All aye. Motion carried.
Hopkins asked if there was any further discussion to cane before the Board.
There was no discussion. Hopkins closed the Planning and Zoning Board meeting
and opened the workshop.
WORKSHOP
1. Cooprehensive Plan Elements.
2. Discussion of Joint Workshop with Canni.ssion on February 18, 1991.
Koch stated that she has divided up the workshops into two sessions. One being
man-made environment and the second being natural environment. The first
workshop and public hearing will be on the 27th with this Board and the second
public hearing with the Canni.ssion on the 11th of March.
There was discussion as to what point the Board is up to at this time.
There was question on the level of service for parks and recreation. Koch
stated that generally it means the number of acres per thousand of population,
There is no specific requirement like there is for roads or sewer capacity.
You determine what it is that you want to be able to offer. You can recannend
a much higher level of service than we have right now. You have options as to
how this will get paid for, there is no authority that says that you must meet
any kind of level of service. You set a number of acres for developed park
land and a nunber of acres for undeveloped park land.
Koch stated concerning the recreation goal what she has now is: To provide
passive and active recreational facilities taylored to the specific needs to a
suburban residential community of ultimately 40 thousand persons coordinating
the public and private sectors to maximize the variety and dispersal of
recreation sites to be appropriate and accessible to persons of all ages,
interest groups and special needs in a demographically cooplex population. The
Board's main objective is to expand the City's public park systems so that
developed outdoor recreational facilities and open spaces are located within
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to
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Plarming and Zoning Board Minutes
February 13, 1991
Page 2
each of the major geographic areas of the City to provide safe and convenient
access for all citizens for passive and active recreation. In order to meet
that objective we have to have a policy that would provide safe and convenient
access which means we have to put a park on the southwest and south of SR 434
or throw out that objective. Another option is we could say we anticipate that
we will be able to meet that objective when Eagle Ridge is platted and use the
park they plan to dedicate to the City for that objective.
There was discussion on capital irrprovement and the road system and what the
developer is bound to do.
Koch mentioned that she call the expressway authority to get the new schedule.
She stated that she was told that things aren't as backed up very llllch, and
that Winter Springs' stretch should be opened in July 1993. Koch stated that
Worsham has told her that the City could start pe~tting three years before
the expressway is opened.
The meeting was adjourned at 9: 53 P.M.
Respectfully Subrrdtted,
Margo Hopkins
Deputy City Clerk