HomeMy WebLinkAbout1993 08 16 Workshop Workshop Meeting, 8/16/93 called to order by DMJVT at 7 p.m.
Roll Call Comm: D.Jonas pr
MPAK absent J.Langellotti pr \,
DMJVT pr T.Donnelly pr
CMJG pr C.Kaehler,pre
Disc.of FY 93/94 Budget:
Manager: just go thru the budget and take each dept. if anyone has anything just bring
it up; we have it posted;
Langellotti, Harry have we been notified from the FLC of our health insurance premiums?
Harry -not that I know of.
Langellotti -the rep. Jennifer, woman that was working for them, I understand she was
going out giving proposals for 15% increases; on the health ins. plan; as it turns out,
that was not the figure that the League is looking at and they had proposed that to a lot
of cities; its really 27%. I sat in a meeting of the health trust, when it comes up to
that I think we should look into that;
Harry -10% inc. in this budget;
Langellotti -what they've done this year they've gone up 25 or 27%;
Chief -we just got a letter from FLC on Workmens comp.its going up more than what you got in
the proposal.
Page 6- Commission;
Torcaso -only thing I see is contributions that we should take a look at;
Chief -there was no increase or decrease; same as last year;
Cindy -then why were contributions raised then?
Jonas -youth soccer was one;
took 2300 out of community development and
Harryfput 2300 into contributions; for the youth soccer.
Langell. this federation for senior citizens; who is that? __
Harry- Sem.Co.senior citizens
Lang -is that the better living for seniors?
Harry -I'm not sure;
Lang -didnt we just receive a letter from RSVP requesting some monies;
Chief -they are requesting 5,000; that wasnt included in here
Lang -thats not part of this nu mber;
Chief -thats the reason we're bringing it up now if you want to raise or lower any or
eliminate any;
Lang -who does it go to that's what I'm trying to find out;
I'd rather see it go to a service thats going to service the residents of W.S. I'd like to
see exactly who that is going to.
Torcaso - should we take it out?
Jonas-we .can leave it in and maybe Harry can get us the answer;
Torcaso -how about the W.S.Art Festival?
Langl -what do we get out of that?
Jonas -I am a Rotarian and am part of the Rotary Club that puts that on; last year we were
very fortunate to have it in the park; what I would love to see is a joint venture between
City of W.S. and the Rotary Club that puts that thing on. By having it in the park it has
turned the art festival in the right direction; the crowd that we drew at the park really
excited the artists and this year will probably be the best we've ever had; and its a very
very profitable art festival.
Torcaso -are the Rotary Club ashamed of the name Winter Springs?
Jonas -no;
Torcaso -can anybody in W.S. belong to the Tusc. Rotary?
Jonas -yes; anybody;
Torcaso -dont see why it cant be changed from Tusc.Rotary Club and W.S. Art Festival;
Cindy -Don since you're involved with the Rotary Club why dont you make the suggestion
that they include Tuscawilla /Winter Springs Rotary Club so that this way it does have
something to do with the City; I dont know how much that I would like to see the city get
involved in this art festival, because its only like 5 mos. away; what I would like to see
is the Rotary Club make a presentation to the commission of why the city should get involved
in what they've already started and are running and see what the benefits are to both the
city and the Rotary Club. and see how we can make it grow; they've had one year at the park
this could be the second year, then lets move forward;
Jonas -we are in the process working with the city in the entire makeup of what it takes,
the electricity, etc. last year there was more expense because they had to put a pole, etc.
thats all done now; hopefully the expenses are going to be minimal now because of that;
I would like very much for the Rotary Club to make a presentation, to the city because
I4,feel the output for the city will be almost nothing;
Cindy - before I as a comm. would like to commit this city to sponsorship of something like
this I'd like to know what is involved so far as the city side of this; until they tell us
we dont know;
Langellotti -who pays the city employees for working that weekend?
Jonas -I dont know what arrangement is made;
Lang -do you know what it cost the City last year?
Jonas -I have no idea.
Lang -I am dead set against our city people having to work overtime for an organ. that the
city gets nothing in return; they dont pay the city anything its a private club; you have
to be asked to join it; I think that if they are going to have a funciton in the city park
that the taxpayers are paying money for, the taxpayers have to pay for the services,
and if they expect a free ride out there, first of all the city couldnt open up the
concession stand last year. if its going to be at the city park the city should have whole
control of it; if they want to pay rent to the park, fine, let them pay rent; and let them
pay for the services; why should the taxpayers foot the bill;for a private club making
profit;
Jonas -I have to claim ignorance but I dont know what the intermingling is handled by
Dick Rozansky last year; with the Rotary Club, how the funds came, how it was separated,
I dont know; you are right; and thats why we would look in the future as a joint venture;
Chief -to give you a quick update; the homeowners had it; went over to the Rotary Club and
last year as everybody knows the park was just opened up, it was a joint venture toxge with
the city to go with the park and try the park out for police, fire and everybody else.
but we are presently in the process of putting a permit for any function anybody coming
into the city, whether it may be - Rotary Club they will have to pay for the police, fire
and rescue Father Bluett he has been paying;
we're going to come back, its being put together by staff right now, to give it to you
what it will cost for police, fire, rescue, etc. so its not the taxpayers paying but
whoever may be putting it on.
Jonas - however, there are gonna be times that the City would like to make a joint venture
and one example the case we're talking about, with the revenue, that is created at the end
of the art festival be determined where those funds will go, whether they go to charity,
scholarships, etc. be determined by the City and the Rotary Club, because it is a joint
venture, then the profits of that event can be split betweent the Rotary Club and this
City to go wherever this City so desires;
City Manager's Dept;
we reduced down 1,337 from last year leaving the salaries inc /decreases not knowing what is
gonna take place on item 1;for the salaries; any questions on that?
no questions:
City Clerk page 8:
Jonas -we received a 92/93 revised final budget; my assumption is we take this compare it
with this
Harry -when the 93/94 budget was generated we didnt have that revised budget.
AORRsx Cindy- under reg. salaries, what are we doing?
Barry -that position that was under admin. for the secretary is moved to the City Clerk -
recept/cashier;
Chief -it was under the admin.section and last 2 yrs. the admin.section has been more or less
abolished; so we have the girl up front that answers the telephone plus Margo the two
salaries that was put into this one;
Cindy -so what we've done is taken from page 11 Comp.Planning? is that where the decrease in
salaries the $15,000?
Harry -yes;
Chief -moved it over to City Clerk;
Langellotti -I have a question on the legal fees; so far we paid $130,000 some to our attorney?
Harry -not quite that much; as of July 97,000;
Jonas - according to 92/93 printing exp. went from 800 to 3300; according to your figures
in the 92/93 budget its 800 now its 3300;
Harry -we ;moved monies out of what was Gen.Government section into the City Clerks printing
for ballots,elections; we used to put that under gen.government;now its under the City Clerks
Dept.
Cindy -we're also moving telephone from Comp. Plan to City Clerk's office; why?
Harry -as city mgr. stated we in a sense we've kind of done away with the dept. the Administra-
tion that's where telephones, etc.
Cindy -no but this dept. has always existed and telephone has always been under it;
and I understand it used to be Administrative /Comp.PLanning so in other words what you are
telling me we are going to take parts of Admin. and roll it over into the Clerk's office.
a
Harry -right
Chief -city Clerk's office;
Cindy -o. k.
Langellotti -that gen.insurance is that including their proposed increases that we intend to
have? and when was the last time we had an audit on
Harry -with the bill that we just received today the general ins. will cost us about $152,000;
this next year;
Langello- that's including all our property and liability, correct?
Harry- correct;
Langellotti -when was the last time we had an audit? on that ?Have they ever done an audit?
Harry -not in my 9 yrs.
Langell -I recall asking this question last year; I think that we should have them come in
and give us an audit;
Cindy -I think you asked for that last year and we never did get an audit; if the rest of
the commission agrees this is not a request this is what we are asking you to do and we
want to know that its done; o.k. not next year at budget time do we have to come up here
and bring this up again;
Commission was in agreement to ask for an audit;
Jonas asked why General Ins. was not on the 92/93
Harry -it was under Comp.Planning /Admin. Jonas -o.k.
Cindy -then why doesnt current budget say zero and requested budget 180?
Harry- should be changed;
Cindy -the legal fees we do have 6,000 for retainer and now we've got 15,000 more added
into the budget. Did I miss it or was there a particular reason for that? I mean we're
done with the Comp.Plan and that was a good portion of our legal fees and I understand
we've got the LDR's coming up; but it shouldnt be more than what we've already paid out;
Harry -we've already paid thru July 97,000; we originally started out with 60,000 in our
current budget and I upped it to 125,000; we are at 97 thru July; we just received a
statement last week for 7 or 8,000; so we're over 100,000 right now;
Finance:
Page 9-
Cindy-on City Clerk's office we have exec.salary broken out; then we've got regular salaries;
this dept. all we've got are salaries; city mgr.'s we've got executive salaries and regular
salaries; why are some depts. broken out one way and others another way?
Harry- according to the uniform acctg. code put out by the State, the City Clerk, City
Manager fall under the executive category; everybody else falls under what is referred to
regular salaries; those are the only 2 depts. that you will see executive salaries;
Cindy -why?
Harry- that's the uniform acctg. code put out by the auditor general, so we have to follow
it;
Cindy -and they broke out very specifically city clerk and city manager;
Harry-if Mayor and Comm. were paid a salary they would be under that category;
Cindy - probably because its set by code; the positions are set by code;
Cindy -other equipment? anaa nnu a its and
Harry- Chief -high speed printer to accommodate printing month end /¢ouIdoe ucilizea
by the utility dept. for billing.
Harry -I had originally asked for a high speed printer to print utility bills and our
monthly reports; where it takes currently with the printers that we have 7 to 12 hrs. to
print utility bills; I was going to ask for a high speed printer that could reduce that
down 2 to 5 hrs.
Cindy -o.k. I have brought it up before and I am going to bring it up again now that we are
going to a different system in our billing; we have an 81 x 11 sheet
Harry -thats why it takes 12 hrs. to print
Cindy -what I think that we need to do, I think we need to move into the 20th century and I
think we need to get a laser printer for this; I dont think we need to be spending 7,000
for a high speed dot matrix printer whenever you can be spending 2,000 and get yourself
a very decent laser printer and print those bills in nothing flat; and I know exactly
what you are talking about harry because I used to print batches and it took 12 hrs. to run
tem; I now print the same batches with the laser printer and it takes 2 hrs.
I dont have a problem with equip. that is going to save money but dot matrix printer for
7,000 is not gonna save that much time; when you can get a laser printer, get the laser �.
printer;
Torcaso- change that figure?
Cindy -I think you can get a decent laser printer and I'm sure that the Purchasing Dept.
can piggy back onto somebody else's and get more than adequate laser printer for 2,000;
you can get rid of middle of the road for 1,000;
llarry -we'll see what we can find;
Cindy -I dont think you'll have a problem finding anything harry.
Chief -L.C. 6410 changed to
Torcaso -look it over; next Dept. Personnel;
Chief -no questions on personnel? next one, page 11, Comp.Planning;
Jonas -92/93 we had 16,000 for utility services and it doesnt show up on the new 93 where
is it?
Harry -it was put into the Purchasing Dept. the Purch.Dept. oversees the maintenance of City
Hall and all the expenses related to it; took it out of Comp.Planning which was the old
Administration Dept. and put it into purchasing.
Cindy -I would like to reserve conunent on a couple things; I have some suggestions after
we get done with this budget; and one of them is on the Comp.PLanning Dept. so I reserve
comment for the end. "
next Dept. Purchasing;
Jonas- I have a note on here, took Repair & Maint. from P.W. to Purchasing Dept. 12,000;(4661)
Harry- correct;
cindy -that should have been a current of zero and a requested of 12,000;
Torc -under salaries, 31,000 and 59,490;
Chief -thats also part of what came out of P.W. for David, the janitor service. he was under
P.W. everybody here in city hall is under city hall budget so P.W. never knew what they
were doing so accountability for time off now we put it under this dept.
Cindy -I'm not so sure I would like it to be under purchasing; if you are going to do
administrative all under City Clerk, do we pay our maintenance person 28,000?
llarry- that's 2 people;
Cindy- what's the other person;
Harry -part time; Ralph;
Cindy -what do we pay him? Harry -7 an hour; roughly 10,000; 29 hrs. How much money are we
talking about? what's this other position?
Harry -David is full time; 10,000 for part time; almost 18,000 for the other;
Cindy -is that really where its supposed to be?
chief -we took them out of P.W. he wont be there under the reorganization if you look at that;
but at budget time that's where he was, so we left it at that; they'll be under a whole
different classifica.if you look at so it would be under a different individual not
purchasing but we had to put it some dept. to give it to you at budget time and we didnt
want to leave it at P.W. so we brought it to City Hall;
Jonas -both David & Ralph are here full time in this bldg. and to say that Steve is
responsible for him and Steve having to do his own assigning of everybody that goes outside
to say that Steve is responsible for those 2 people; we'll just put him under the purchasing
dept. who is in this bld. its just a consolidation and takes the responsibility off Steve
knowing where David & Ralph is;
Cindy -o.15, and when ever we reorganize everything it would be under Gen.Services, anywhere,
which makes more sense;
Chief -when we break it down under General Services when we break it down to the 6 depts.
so it wont be under Purchasing at that time.
Torcaso -Page 13, Information Services Dept.:
Chief - Information Serv. it is not a new position; that is one that was under the Admin.
that is current, but just named different;breaking it out again from Planning Dept.
to a separate division altogether;
Jonas -who are the people that will fall under this
Chief -only 1 person, will be under that and that is Jeanine Porter.
that's where all the computers for the information for repairs, maintenance, equip.operating
supplies and everything else that was currently there; broke off from Administration;
into this line code here;
Jonas -this person is responsible for all repair and maint. of all computer equipment?
all computer equip.that exists within the City ?because of the fact the repair and maint.
line code is 26,524 which is a lot of money and that's the point I am trying to make;
this person is responible for all repair and maintenance of all equipment, all computers
throughout the entire city?
Chief - right; that person, you need anything which was created 2 yrs. ago for the computer
person and this person is just replacing Greg Kerns who was hired at that position before
Jackie left, then Greg moved into planning and this person was hired here to continue on.
Jonas - that's the girl that works in your office Greg? Qualified? Greg -yes
Jonas -I'm glad you didn't say no.
Cindy -I want to reserve comment on this one also;
Chief- Engineering-
Jonas -we have a problem with operating supplies:
Chief -5230?
JOnas -went up 750 dollars;
Jonas- we budgeted 450 last year
Chief -he's asking for copies of engr. drawings, reproductions 450.00; floppy discs
70.00;printer ribbons at 185.00; printout paper computer 40.00; film 180;00; eng. drawing
tubes 15.00;
Jonas -I just happen to have it here April of 93 he was furnished 450.00; at that time he only
spent 9 which was 2% of his actual budget;
Chief -whats he got now Harry?
Harry -35% used thru July;
Jonas -357 of 450 and we're asking 750 more? Jonas -will you get to 100% this year?
Leonard -I dont think so sir;
Jonas -why are you requesting 750 more?
Leonard -we have acquired 2 computers now within the dept. and I did want to get some addtl.
things like we have a lot of stuff just havent got in storage if you will,
we do have 2 different printers in the dept. I do go thru a fair amt. of polaroid film
periodically; these other items are items I am trying to get better storage of various things.
Jonas -this is 1 thing that disappointed me on this budget; we had requested 2 yrs. ago that
when you send a budget in to be approved by this commission the thing that we asked was
each dept. put down on a piece of paper what was the request you wanted, what did you want,
and how much did it cost; and when we got this budget and went thru this entire budget there
was none; we dont know what you are requesting; we have no idea; I was a little disappointed;
obviously we have an acting city manager but like you're saying that's why we put 4, 5 and 6;
we dont have 4, 5 and 6;
I'm glad you mentioned that because there was a point I wanted to make; when I saw the budget
I said well wheres all this stuff that they are supposed to if they wanted something that
was in excess of what they got last year they were to print out for us what they wanted
and how much it costs so we would have an idea as a commission; it was not there;
Cindy -not only that, there's other equipment on here that even if they asked for it, last
year; we still have to have justification for it this year; its not something that just kind
of rolls over; in just flipping back thru all of the depts. almost all of the depts. asked
for money this year for other equipment; granted some of them were down; but I dont know what
this is so I think what we also need to do not only for this one dept. we need to go back
thru this and we need to look at what all of the other equipment is because we are talking about
a substantial amount of money here;
Jonas -I'm not happening to pick on you Leonard its just tht you triggered something in my mind
and I wanted to mention that;
Leonard -I thought you had a copy of the individual items that are spelled out item by item
and a quantiy and dollar amount;
Cindy -I reserve comment because after this is all over with I'm gonna hit you with something
and I want an opinion so I reserve comment again;
Land Dev.Coordinator:
Jonas - available for merit; does this commission know we are eliminating the merit system ?
Cindy -I think theres a proposal in the back and I dont think that we're eliminating the
merit, what John's doing is creating the merit system that we had envisioned in the first
place and that not dividing up between each ind.dept. x no. of dollars and saying use it
or lose it kind of attitude; whatever dept. has an employee that has done an outstanding job
and is recommended and it doesnt get added to the line code; I cant tell you how that
annoyed me in the last couple of budgets; that's not what a merit system is for;
I guess JOhn's put them all in one place;
Chief -if you look at the last part in your binder there are the merit proposals; which is the
true merit system; you have to do something to be recommended for it; and its a 1 time deal
and its not added on to your salary each and every year;
Jonas -there were situations within the city last year when this merit pay was adopted that
people would get an increase, a step increase plus they would also get a merit increase; and
that point was going to be discussed as to is that what this commission meant when they
went to a merit increase and if you got a step increase were you also eligible then to get a
merit increase; on top of that; and this was something we were going to discuss hopefully
at a workshop to determine what the intent of this commission really was and because some
people last year got some pretty good raises both step increases and merit increases where
others got el zippo; and I want the commission to keep that in mind of something that should
be open for discussion hopefully in the future.
Police Dept: other equip; Cindy - there's a list on this one;
Langellotti -have we switched doctors on physical exams?
Chief -yes we have; we will the first of the month; for the last couple years our city dr.
was not certified by the hospitals; so when our employees went to a hospital and wanted
him to attend, he could not; so the Fire D. and Police D.we all got together and went to
different doctors, and one we are going to will be Dr. Gram he used to work with Dr. Neuman who
had all the county Fire D. so he is familiar with it and will be our new doctor as of the
first of the month;
Jonas -Harry looking at the budget you give us on a monthy basis you go down to software
maintenance and license, page 16, on the monthly thing there was 2,098 dollars;
•
on the budget that you have now, current budget you have 2,400 which is 302 more than
its supposed to be;
Harry-they made a L.C. transfer that why the reduction;
Jonas - there's little things but theres just a difference in numbers, I dont understand,
like janitorial supplies, was 865 not 800; under emp.develop. there was 802 and you have 500;
Harry -that where the 302 come out of the 2400; Jonas - o.k.
Cindy - I dont have my monthly in front of me but the computer program, did we spend any of that
money this eyar?
Jonas -as of the one I got which was back computer program new update, 8000 allocated,actual
6,058; budget remaining, they expended over 75% of their allocation
Cindy -my point is that that was supposed to be for a program; bing thats it;now we have another
line code in here thats 8,000 for another program; I want to know what this program does;
I want to know what the last program was supposed to make things easier, what does this one
do?
6412 -
Jonas-last year we spent 8000 for that program; why are we spending another 8000
Cindy -it could be a different one but I want to
Chief -the main one we went after was the computers we have in dispatch and records and they
got the computer into the detective section from the state and we are going to be responsible
for updating those and keeping them up to date, including the FTIC, MCIC plus the ones you
are going to be sending the girls to school right now, for the drug
Charlie -spoke about the drug program; we're sending the girl to school I think next week
the one you mentioned from FDLE, 2 yrs. ago they were going to do everything and they've
been facing some tremendous budget cuts; then they were going to keep up the maintenance and
all of a sudden we got a letter that says we're going to do the maintenance they will take
care of the software; last week we got a letter from FL DLE that says there will be updates
coming out but any updates you will have to do; if we are going to continue on the computerized
crime reporting then we are going to have to have the expense of updating our software;
otherwise we go back to filing our uniform crime reports by paper;
Cindy -how much are the updates vs. and what are the new programs?
Charlie -they will be - we dont know right now what those updates are going to be; we're facing
a lot of things that FDLE gave us a couple years ago that we were looking at its a freebie
from the state and now its ours; whatever requirements they require and any of their program
changes new programs that we were hoping to put into our CADD system when we started out
our CADD system was going to be a buildup; from the time that we got it as a basic complaint
taking system to increase it up to the ability for laptop computers; for the guys inthe
cars to be able to run their own registration thru the system and we hope to keep updating
it every year to have a modern cadd system.
Cindy -what you are telling me is you want another program to add to your cadd system?
and then the rest of the budget woudl be spent on updates on your existing software
Charlie -right which FDLE will be requiring us to make some changes.
Chief - there's an article in the paper that Sanford & Alt. are gonna start the programs;
we thought we all in Sem.co. get the crash reporting program which would be computers for
every officer in addition to in house reporting city county to the state; that would be
going into lap tops so what we'd be looking at in the long run doing away with the mobile
units in cars; adding a lap top; bypassing the dispatchers, going directly to Tallahassess `•
and when the officer gets off duty he takes into the main frame and all the reports
are done and over with so its gonna be on going the state has been passing all this off to
us more and more and if we are going to stay on top of it its going to be almost a yearly
budget update; the p hl dspanca we try to get all the grants, and this main one right now
is &ne hundred some /ao ?fars this would be a grant and if we get that next year that will be
another 100 - 200,000 dollars so when we do away with the mobile units we'll be into the lap tops;
you add your drug tracking, your detective tracking, automobile your FDIC reporting for all
reports the P.D. used to do by hand; now we got that from Tall.but its our problem to
maintain it and keep it up to date;
Jonas - when you say you are gonna go from the mobile
Chief -when we go into the lap tops we want to do away with the mobile units
Jonas -you are talking about the little radio in the car,
Chief -not the portable radio, so then your portable is going to be more expensive because
you are going to have your individual units but your lap tops is gonna be replacing your
radios that will go directly from car to car to dispatch, directly to Talla hassee also;
Chief -that line code is gonna be there every year and the Fire d. is finding out on what
they want to do to tie into the county;when they tie into the county their reporting system
is going to Ocala; one of the other things I forgot Charlie the Police Standards is setting
up a program for the state that you want a new officer; you put it into your computer; they
will send you an application on Don Jonas, etc.
Charlie -by going to the crash reporting system on computers we will file all accident reports
therefore the county will be able to get more money back from the 11wy.Safety Fund.
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Jonas -One particular category that concerns me, Employee Relationsis that a catch all for
everything? according to our reports and monthly report if you look at Employee Relations
whatever has been allocated has already been spent. Is that a catch all harry.
Chief -that is your commissioner's bonus to employees at Xmas;
Cindy -the one they didnt get las t year;
Employee Development went up how come? went up 9,000?
Chief- 5430; Police Education Fund; down at the bottom;
Harry -all the monies that come in 6 of our fines and forfeitures that comes in goes into
the Police Education fund and it is allocated to Emp.Development in the P.D. can only be
used for training.
Chief -thats the one we also just got for training and education that the Police Educ.
authorized for the new computer that will be going in there; strictly for P.D. education and
training;
Cindy -but the money doesnt come out of the Gen.Fund, it comes out of Fines & Forfeitures;
so I'm assuming that on the Balance sheet we have a completely different line code that says
Police Education Fund and we show where it comes in from that it doesnt come out of the Gen.
Budget, correct?
Chief- correct.
Harry -that money is included in the money we get from the County, the fines and forfeitures;
I write a check out of that to Police Education Fund.
Chief -out of that fund everybody goes to any of their school training; not the Gen.Fund.
Jonas - there's an increase of 32,000 in other equipment with the P.D. the next page the
Commission may want to look at and verify the fact the other equip.the P.D. is requesting for
this year; following page;
Cindy - talked about the copy machine;
BOWS Board-Dick Denny -Vice Chairman, at our last meeting we received a notice from H.Martin
to the effect that the arbor fees which you folks allocated to the BOWS Board on ?/8/93
had accumulated to 3,825.00. It was our understanding in reading this memo that/ is money
was not used by the end of this year it would go to the Gen.Fund and we would lose.it. What
we would like to ask the Commission to consider is to work out some arrangement where this
money can continue to accumulate due to the fact that some of the plans that the BOWS Board
are working with, state and county, are maybe a year or more out and we have to make plans
and allocation of money -if the monies arent there we are high and dry; if it goes back in the
Gen.Fund we lose it.
Cindy -I dont see any reason why we cant go ahead and roll it over.
Denny -if we could do that that would be great.
Cindy -I think thats a policy decision and everybody sitting up here is shaking their heads
Chief -if that's General Fund under state law you cant do that;
Cindy -then what we can do if the commission is to allocate them funds equal to what was done
the previous years; if you have to dump it all into the Gen.Fund fine; do that then pull it
right back out and say that we are allocating these funds for next year's budget of the BOWS
Board; thats the way to do it;
Carl Stephens spoke but cant hear him;
Fire D.
Chief -one thing on the Fire D. you'll see but the Fire D. and Paramedics used to be separate
budgets; they are rolled into one budget now; Fire Chief here feels the accountability
equipment and everything else its still Fire D.;if we put it in one budget makes it easier
all the way around;
according to the
Jonas - there's a lot of changes and this probably could be the reason; monthly available for
merit which was 21 715 and you have 26308; down here to FICA 66,254 you have 81,
Harry -this is because they are combined;
Jonas - operating expenses you have 5,500 and we come up to 14,000 in the what you are requesting
for this coming year ; other equip.16,000 this year, 48,000 that probably I guess that
covers it; I knew there were a lot of changes and I assumed it probably was because its combined
in salaries
Cindy -what does the increase /equate to in people? how many people?
Tim -we currently have 36 people;
Cindy -but you are asking for 42,000 more and I want to know how many more people we are hiring
in that dept.
Harry -cant hear;
Chief -that will be the 3 people on page 29;
Harry -yes
Chief -where they asked for 3 firemen total would be 71,594; but spread them out thru the year
would only be 42,537;
Jonas on page 19 when he requests other equip. I guess he doesnt request othr employees,right?
Cindy- according to page 29 those firefighters are gonna cost us $55,000 and I understand if
you are going to stagger them its going to cost us 42,000;what I dont understand is that
FICA if you hire them up front is 4200 and according to this chart FICA is only 1200 increase;
now that doesnt make any sense;
Harry -cant hear;
Cindy -I'm not questioning that, what I'm questioning on your sheet page 29, you have
salaries listed for the f.f. 55,314; you have got FICA listed as 4,232; what I'm saying is
given this plugging it into your other chart it doesnt make any sense; one or the other
chart is wrong; do 42,537 X .075 and tell one what the amount is;
cant hear Harry;
Cindy- that's what your increase in your FICA should be;
cant hear Harry;
Cindy -what you are telling me when you deduct the merit you automatically took that into
consideration each of the line codes and you took out - but you didnt even catch it you had
to think about it;
questioned power generator; do we have one now are we replacing one?
Tim -yes we are replacing the one at STa 24; in 1973 when they built that fire station they
had a very small power generator; that they moved to the station in Tuscawilla. They
replaced it with a 121 KW generator; however what we propose to do cause that generator at
Sta 26 is 20 yrs. old; we are constantly pouring money into it; so to replace the one at
Sta 24 with a larger generator; and move the one at 24 to the Tusc.Sta. 26;
Langellotti asked about the heart monitor; Tim said we were first in Sem.County to get the 3;
we got them on a grant 21,000 from HRS;
Building Dept.
Jonas -Harry looking back at your current budget operating supplies was 1,316 not 500;
I'm sure you have an explanation for that; other equipment last year 184 not 1,000; follow
me there; 5230 operating supplies current budget you have 500; and the current budget was
not 500 it was 1316;
Harry- that's line code transfers the city manager has approved and we redistributed it;
Langellotti -it was brought to my attention today about occupational licenses; I understand
there are a lot of people out there not coming in and getting their license and I understand
the only way we can enforce that is go thru the Code board. Am I correct?
Chief - correct at this time
Langell -do we need an ordinance for that? I understand we have something presently on the
books but theres absolutely no way of enforcing it; I understand the income that could be
coming into that Bld.Dept. that could pay quite a few bills.
Whitey -the way the ord. is written it says that the city can put a bus. out of business in
the city, but there's really no way the Code Enf.Brd. can do that; that's a legal action;
its possible I've got about 5 large ones that have not gotten occup.licenses; I've turned ,
them over to Al White and also issued a letter and I've written letters to the people involved
in business that this is what I'm doing; I have to wait now to see what the Board does;
before I can make any suggestions as to a better way possibly of bringing compliance about;
Chief -from what he is saying why don't we write a letter to the License Bureau of the State?
Whitey -some of these arent licensed thru the State;
Langellotti -what I'm talking about is people opening up a business in their homes and not
coming to the City to get an occup.license;
Chief -if we go find out about it then we go serve notice on them to come in and get a license
which he charges them double and if they dont get it then we go to the Code Board; which
the Code Board can go to 250 to 500 dollars; so what he's talking about I'm not aware of.
Whitey -I just found this out last week; I didnt know you were talking about hone occupations;
I'm talking about actual businesses;
Chief -under state reg. it should go to the state;and state will send an investigator down
like we're doing on the bond; that was turned over to the state; and the state is doing an
investigation;
Langellotti -why would an independent store owner go to the state for an occup.license?
Chief -I'm assuming you're talking about a professional or a builder
Whitey- no,no;
Langellotti -no a business
Chief -we've been doing it;
Whitey -on home occup.lic.we have been doing it
Langellotti -how about on businesses
•
Whitey -lets say one that is not licensed thru the state; like a auto repair shop; its not
licensed thru the state its only licensed thru the city;
Chief -if they are licensed thru the city, they dont have it we serve notice on them and take
them to the code brd.; we've been doing that for years;
Lang -we have
Chief -yes
Langell -and when people pay the fines where does it come thru?
Chief -goes to Gen.Fund.
Cindy- travel,per diem,up 2500 a develop up 1500; what is that?
Whitey -as everyone knows the/ tas passed some new rules concerning bld.depts.;our dept. other
than myself has very few of the required certifications; I have 1 inspector that has 1; I have
another inspector that has none; I dont know how its gotten to this point; I just took over as
you all know about 4 mos. ago; the requirements will be within 2 yrs. A total of I think 17
certifications; we attempted last Friday to take these tests and some of them without any
schooling on these particular areas; I took 2 myself; I dont think I passed either one;
and I'm fairly up on it; David needs a lot of trainin i you intend to cut loose these
inspectors we have and go out and hire fully trained/Inspectors its going to take quite a bit
to get them up to speed;
Cindy -are you talking about employee development then the 1500?
Whitey -all 3 tie in together; travel,perdiem, employee development and dues and registrations;
they will all tie in together because of the requirements you send them to a school somewhere;
most of the schools are in Birmingham, Ala. To pay for the course and required books and to
pay for the registration for the tests; I've only increased the amount that I think they can
handle in one year; I have 2 yrs. to do this from Oct. 1;
Langellotti -arent there any schools in Florida?
Whitey -there are very few; the Congress right now is working on it; we're supposed to by the
middle of Oct. get they are trying to set up schools in Orlando;
Langellotti -didnt the Leg.just pass something about continuing education for bld.inspectors?
Whitey -yes thats on your requirements for recertification. Each year I have to be recertified;
in order to not have to retest I have to have a certain amount of hours of conventions,
seminars, etc.
cindy -these new requirements have come down from the state and we have to send our people to
Alabama, my point is the requirements are state mandated and the state is not providing a
place for these people to do their training I think something is wrong;
Whitey -its not only in Alabama; there are some in Charleston S.C. theres a couple in Gainesville
depends on what technical code we are talking about.
Cindy -when did all of this change?
Whitey -its always been apropo to have certification; I dont know why the City of W.S. inspectors
dont have it; I dont know;
Cindy -but this is a state requirement?
Whitey- now is a requirement
cindy -in other words it was just nice to have and now its a requirement; is this going to be
enough?
Whitey -I think for the first year yes; second year I'll have to reevaluate it;
I have to know whether the inspectors can grasp the training and pass the tests; if they
cant grasp the training and cant pass the tests its kind of a waste of time; I'd have to go
to other avenues;
Torcaso -on the job training help them at all?
Whitey -on the job training is like learning how to fix your own automobile; we're talking about
9 different technical codes; 3 levels of certification;its a lot more complicated then a lot
of people would think;
Chief -while we were at the FLC convention I was checking intoit; Whitey,just so there is no
misunderstanding on your part, and my part, there's a misunderstanding between many cities;
if its state mandated then we dont have any choice; if its not state mandated then its just
a luxury as I would call it; and I want to bring it to Whitye's attention, that him and me
have gotten into an argument and I will not approve for him to go on to training school
conferences 4 times a year; Bld.Officials annual in Feb., mid year July and then in October,
thats 4 of them.
Cindy -as I understood you were saying that if you go to all of these things you dont have to
take the test;
Whitey -I dont have to take the test, I dont have to recertify;
Cindy -well you may just have to take the test and recertify;
Whitey -that would be more costly but yes you are absolutely correct;
Chief -every person sitting here, then they have to go to it their assistant has to go to it,
and we're talking about spending 30, 40,000 dollars? No way
Whitey -I'm sorry, I'm talking about for one year an increase of 5,000 dollars;
Chief - that's right; and I say no way; if we hire you for certification its up to you to
maintain it; just like its me; just like its anyone sitting out here;Tim just come back from
one; summertime, wintertime, I dont care what you were promised before, I just want to be on
record that I'm not spending city money for you to be going and not everyone sitting in here
going to the same thing.
Whitey -that is a disagreement that we have.
Chief -if you disagree with me let me know and I will change the budget.
Cindy -I think that that's a management decision and that's your decision to make.
Jonas -I think you're right that its a management decision and think the only thing I'd
like to inject in here that Whitey made a good point is that/is going to cost him more
money on an annual basis
Cindy -but John is saying that he needs to maintain his own certification if he wants to keep
his job.
Chief -if I want to keep my job I pay for it;
Whitey -then would the manager be willing to allow me the time off
Cindy -I dont think that we need to get into this right now,
Chief -what everybody else does in the cities is what I'm proposing to him.
Torcaso -this is not part of this discussion tonight.
Chief- its part of the budget is why I brought it up
Cindy -its your decision to make.
Torcaso -thats what we have a city manager for.
Chief -at the FLC they are checking into it and I will be keeping tabs on it; for all inspectors
also if it is required by state.
Jonas -do you anticipate in this coming year quite a bit of revenue on permits? I know we've
approved a lot of developments that are going to be taking place; do you anticipate a good
influx of permits?
Whitey -yes I do; I've done a little research over the past 3 yrs in the Bld.Dept. and the
Bld.Dept.increase I only went back to 1990; determined that a total of permits issued in
1990 were 2,052; total issued this year so far 4,296; new housing starts single family
homes 1990, 143; this year so far 254; I predicted to Harry that this year we'd end up
around 285; I think thats where its gonna hit; the increase in revenue vs. budget for the
dept. since 1990 the budget for 1990 was 187,000 the budget this year is 163,000 which is
a decrease of 17%; the increase in revenue in 1990 was 160,000 ; the increase that I
predicted for this year is 318,000; not counting anything other than permit fees; so theres
an increase from 1990 for this year of $154,000 above what it cost to run the dept.
Cindy - that's the way that it should be; what I've always been concerned with when we had
boom we were running lot more money than that we did it with a lot less people then that;
so its a good thing, yes we did, we had a very small bld.dept.; we had much less people
working for us; my point is its a good thing that bld. did go up otherwise your department
would have to justify its current existence; I'm glad that you dont have to do that this year;
Whitey -we are running right now at about 4,000 inspections every year; this is extremely high;
we are taking in over 50 bld.plans a month; we are running at the very limit of the amount
of personnel we have.
Cindy -I think you need to check back a little further I believe it was 78, 79 and 80 you
had less people in the department and we had more bld.starts in Seminole co. then any other
city and we had more bld.starts in Winter Springs then in Central FL; tructi
Whitey -then you didnt need the technical expertise and I was involved in/ c it s was caiiZd
rubber stamp plans; you didnt have to know anything; you just stamped them and get them out;
Cindy -must have been the guy who inspected my house;I dont think I want to hear any more;
Whitey -I'd like to see every commissioner make a one day run with an inspector; to give
you an idea of whats involved;
Chief -we got until 1998 on certification recertification; we got plenty of time to get our
inspectors involved and the state will be having classes locally and all cities the bigger
cities wont have to be spending that money going out of state for certification.
Cindy -I would prefer to see us keep our people here if we can and let them have their classes
so if you could check on that Chief to see if they're gonna start scheduling classes locally.
I think that that would make more sense.
P.W.
Jonas -I got a note here janitorial supplies 2000 omitted;
Chief - transferred to City Hall.
Jonas -thats for the 2 people?
Chief - yes;you would also have the salary of those 2 people transferred over.
Torcaso- 5,000 decrease in mosquito chemicals?
Steve -yes; the state more or less told us we couldnt spray on a regular basis; we had to
as needed or call in basis; they said if you dont have any complaints then you dont need to
be out there spraying;
Tdt'caso -you havent got any complaints.?
Steve -not a lot.
Steve -since last Oct. we've probably only had 25 or 30 calls; thats not a lot;
Cindy -I have a question on salary; we've got 15,000 increase; correct me if I'm wrong;
we transferred 28,000 from this 1.c. to another 1.c. so if you add that back inxyiuix
the increase is 43,000 dollars; but according to P.W. Dept. on Page 29 it only
says 35,000. dollars and I would assume we are going to hire those on a staggered basis;
so did I not figure that out right or is there something wrong there?
Harry -cant hear; should be about 7,000 increase; proposed step increases for some;
is part of the difference.
Cindy -we're not going to hire these people, stagger them like we did for the P.D. & F.D.
Harry -cant hear; when we did the 92/93 budget we had a director making more money;
some salary adjustment of personnel on staff now and what was there a year ago;
Cindy -but Steve was there a year ago and we had Gil there so this should be reduced
even more than this; according to this it increased even more than what we are
asking for people;and what you are telling me you had some step increases for other
people
Harry -the people that were hired a year ago cant hear; if there were any new employees
come on those employees would be starting at a lesser salary so you would
have less of an increase
Cindy -I think I'd like to see that in writing; I think I'd like to see a list of who
went up and who went down and where all this money is floating around;
Jonas - repair and maintenance on the monthly report the current maintenance City Hall
12,000 dollars; then you've got as far as monthly status is concerned here, what does
that cover?
J.P. -air conditioners, light bulbs, cant hear;
Cindy -what are you looking at? Page 21
Don J. -I'm looking on page 21, its not in page 21, I'm looking at the monthly statement;
4661 which is 12,000 Repair & Maintenance for City Hall;
Langellotti- what's the emp.development, 1800?
Steve -we're also gonna be required to get different licenses in different areas;
right now were looking to have to get aquatic licenses for stormwater management;
also the mechanics have to be licensed to work on the freon;
also mosquito spray have to be licensed; got a guy going to school for certified
arbor for the trees;
Cindy -I want to know about the truck;
Steve -we had a 1979 dump truck and its rusting out but the motor is still good; we
would like to trade it in and get another truck preferably new but probably wont end
up being new for the amount of money and have a lift bucket on it to do tree trimming,
put up xmas decorations, etc. The method we were using before the State didnt like .
Cindy -look into approx.how much its going to cost you get some rough estimates
because lets say you go ahead and you need 30,000
Steve -Gil had asked for 3,000 for the lift last year;
Recreation -
Jonas -why is there a decrease in salaries;
Harry -in the REc.Dept. we have the concession stand, senior center, and parks;
years past all the salaries were in parks; this year I have tried to make the senior
center stand on its own bringing those salaries in the senior center the people that
operate down there Susie, etc. and what was in the concession stand the manager and
people that work the concession stand so those areas will truly reflect the cost to
operate and in doing so that reduced what we referred to as parks and recreation
budget somewhat because there is a request for some addtl. people.
Chief -what you should be seeing in the future also parks and rec. report budget
should be coming up like water and utilities; almost a private enterprise money making
project for the park to be self sustained to future expansion on the park etc. this
would be a start of breaking those other depts. down so probably within 2 or 3 yrs.
you should be getting like you do water company almost a half inch thick budget
on what is coming in and what is going out on each and every title and not what you
have right now.
Jonas -what falls under operating supplies to make an increase of 17,000?
Glenn -this encompasses chemicals, the new acreage we got; 5230- mulch, playground sand;
marble dust for ballfields, insecticides,paints, sealers, primers, grass seed herbicides,
hose fittings, batteries, concrete mix, nuts bolts and screws rope etc.
Jonas -we gave you 32,000 for that stuff last year; I'm asking what are you gonna need
this year over last year to want 17,000 more
Glenn -this year we got 9 more acres we've got a lot of projects out there that we couldn
not do because we didnt have the right materials;at Trotwood we'd like to make some
improvements out there;
•
onas -you are requesting 17,000 additional funding and just want to be more specific, I
/ can see the 9 acres yes, what are you going to do at Totwood to want 17,000 more? what
are you going to do at the park to want 17,000 more? than the 32,000 we're already giving
, V you.
0 Glenn -we got ballfields we want to build in there; Sunshine Park we'd like to reroof the
place; theres a lot of things we'd like to be able to do;
Torcaso -this is what Comm.Jonas brought up earlier about the increases in different things
that we have no explanation what they are for; and we thought that this year it would be
added on the bottom of the page; you have a list there but we have no idea what your list is;
Jonas -then we go over to the other page and you are requesting 45,000 for other equipment
and so basically you are asking almost 65,000 more not even including the addtl. 45,000
but for an example, the commission may decide for an example that they dont want to do what
you want to do at Trotwood; they dont want to do what you want to do at Sam Smith park,
dont , do you follow me but if we had it on paper as to what you specifically want to do
then we could say yes thats good, you follow me if it was on paper and we knew exactly what
you wanted to do then we could form an opinion.
Glenn -a lot of these things have been brought to me the last couple years by the Commission
about repairing the roof at Trotwood,sunshine Park, theres a lot of things on here that
were requested thru the citizens thru the commission that we havent had the time to do;
Jonas -which in many cases we are unaware of;
Bill -cant hear; I gave Glenn some of the figures; at Trotwood baseball fields, they
buried trash, we are starting to get sink holes and we'd like to relevel that whole thing;
need to take up about 3 or 4 inches of soil and put new top soil and go back and replant;
just refurbish the whole thing; the multi use field at Centyral Winds has been under
water for almost 11/2 yrs; the grass is shot and soil is shot;
Chief -to help resolve some problems here for future as of now for future budgets all
budgets from every dept. would be zero line with justification for each and every item
comparing anything at all so when you look at the budget you are going to know its for
50 for nuts and bolts, 1,000 for sand to be put on Central Wind, Trotwood or wherever;
when you look at it there wont be any questions; for future budgets we can start doing
it now to give it to you in between here so there will be no misunderstanding on any dept.
head or division we have and for future commissioners to know this is the way the budget is
going to be handled; last year it was 5% raise or lower that was only justification there
was; if I can make that suggestions -we'll have that from this day on
Langellotti- with every dept.
Chief -every dept. every budget for lfuture presented to the Commission;
Jonas -I dont want to see every dept. get so technical that you name nuts and bolts;
you had mentioned a multi use area, if that isnt being flooded out now we're going to have
to solve the problem of why its being flooded out why we have water thats lying down there
before we can do anything with it; we've got to find an avenue and an access to get that
water out of there
~
Bill -city "manager, we've got most of that stuff in line
Langellotti -this 5 mower, I'd like to address this to JP; down in Ft.Lauderdale I was
speaking to John Deere representative, I have a booklet at home I'd like to pass on to you;
they are working on a govt. contract and they are willing to work with you; I got the
felia's card I'll drop it off; have we done anything about applying for any rec.grants?
Bill -cant hear;
Langell -Greg awhile ago I asked you to check with the Bush foundation in W.Park; did we
ever get a response from them?
Greg -no
Langell- they've never contacted you back;
Cindy -I have a question why our W.Comp in this dept. went up $8,000. It says 6,000 but then
you've got to add the 2,000 thats broken away so that makes it go up 8,000; why?
Harry- cant hear;
Jonas -I think the 2 depts. you'll find that are probably going to be very high in that
particular area is Steve's dept. and Glenn's.because of the type of work they do.
Cindy -I went back to the P.W. Dept. and their W.Comp only went up 160.00; that's what I
thought;
Chief -while he's looking that up what did you think about that? I'll get with all the dept.
heads and make a'memo for the future thats the way all lbudgets will be presented;
Cindy -while Harry's looking for that, where do you keep your bathroom supplies, under what
line code? under janitorial; will you do me a favor and add a little to that line code;
and take care of the ladies room; I'm just making a point that I would like the ladies
room better equipped for supplies wise; thank you.
Langellotti- that cant be done in house?
Kozlov -some of it may be;it just depends; I dont know the magnitude of it right now
cause the reports not out yet; what has happened is we've reduced the amount of money
associated with the consultant but at the same token theres money left in there just in
case we have to use that for that purpose.
Jonas - Leonard out of the 2.04 what will that bring in annually?
Leonard- roughly about 240,000 this is round nos.;
Jonas -thru that program does that mean the retention ponds that lie within the city
whether they are in a development complex, housing complex or whatever, is the city
eventually going to take over and maintain all retention ponds within the City.
Kozlov -no Commissioner; thats not the way its set up; the way its set up is that the city
takes care of those retention /detention facilities that serve public streets; public areas;
there are those areas like where Mr. Langellotti where he lives they have private stormwater
over there; private roads and a private pond system; what they do they get a 25% discount
for maintaining their own system; now of course if they are not maintaining their system
in accordance with state regulations they can lose it until they come back into compliance.
that's the whole concept; thats the way the ordinance is written;
Jonas -on Seneca by Northern Way there's a bridge there; right down W.S.BIvd. coming from
Oviedo,
Leonard -yes
Jonas -that will be maintained by the city?
Kozlov -thats correct
Jonas -you come up Seneca the one that we talked about behind those homes; that will always
be their responsibility the homeowners there?
Kozlov -first of all the city has the entire area as a drainage easement so we have the legal
ability we the city to go in there and do any kind of work we may have to do. Most of all
these places do have a plat on them, I'm not saying everyone but most that I'm aware of
most have them disability visa vis the drainage facility; it was the concept when we got
into this stormwater management utility business that the city was to take over some of these
ponds that were originally dedicated or was placed in the hands of the individual property
owners to take care of a portion of these ponds and there are several instances where we have
this primarily in Tuscawilla; so we got into this area where we take care of this thing from
beginning to end because of public drainage if you will and thats why in this case the City
has been doing this work like cleaning the pond where you are talking about off of Seneca
that big circular pond
Jonas -the only reason I'm asking is not because its in Tuscawilla they just happen to be
retention ponds that I know of and I'm trying to separate your explanation what you called
public where retention comes off public streets and where it will not occur
Leonard -but there but as I say the individual subdivisions if they have a self contained
system then they qualify and I've gotten letters from all kinds of folks out there for this
25% discount which we have gone ahead and given them.
Langellotti-we pay 1.54 -if the homeowners assn. does not maintain that pond
Leonard -if something happens it goes out of whack
Langellotti -what does the city do to that?
Leonard -the way its supposed to happen they inspect it and see if its in compliance with
the state requirements a la the permit that was originally issued for that system. If it is
not then you can go back in this case to the homeowners assn. and say look you're not in
compliance how about bringing it back into compliance; it would be an informal approach.
Langellotti- because its the responsibility of the homeowners assn. to maintain the storm
water drains; the city has nothing to do with it so they are just paying a fee to join the
club.
Leonard - that's not quite the case; this as I mentioned earlier, there's eventually a dis
charge from that system into the waterways, like creeks, etc. and there has been for the
moment a stay with various counties and municipalities from the federal level of sampling
and testing all this stuff vis a vis this mtds federal requirement of stormwater runoff
with all the pollutants and so on. When I anticipate very soon they'll go ahead and get
this thing really rolling; all that stormwater does go eventually into the public water
bodies, and thats what drives this whole program.
Cindy -I'm trying to balance things in my mind, and I keep flipping back and forth between
the revenue and expenditures; on page 4 we have the description of revenues; the expenditures
match the revenues; but yet there's 120,000 fund balance that carries over; how did we do
that? or did we not spend the 243,000 and we dont anticipate spending it, which in that
case why are we upping it the budget for the next fiscal year?
Leonard -first of all we did not commence collecting money until January; the 240,000 is for
the entire 12 month period; so we shortfalled ourselves by approx. 3 mos. on the monies; now
of course, this was our first cut at it this particular year and I dont know how much we
were supposed to collect say a 9 mos period. Harry do you know what that is/
Harry -cant hear;
Cindy -if this figure represents 9 mos. and you short changed yourself then that means that
you short changed yourself now you have a 12 mos. period and you only have
/•
250,000;
Leonard -I did inquire as to how we got the increase of 372,000; for this year;
Cindy -the monies that are under expenditures the 243,000 these are like the balance things
that we do that we take it out of one and put it in another and they match; there is no
way then that that 243,000 the actual expenditures should only be 120,000; correct?
if that were so, just like a dept. doesnt spend all of their budget we carry it over, but
I thought in these kind of funds you couldnt do that so if this is 243; the other one says
243, I want to know where 120,000 comes from that says fund balance.
Leonard -we got 95000 thats allocated which hasnt been paid off to the consultant for this
year; I do know that;
Cindy -I dont have any of those figures in front of me; everything that I'm trying to figure out
is where the 120,000 came from in order to carry it over and then my point is 240,000 if
that was collected on a 9 inos. period I dont see how you can only raise this current budget
by 10,000 and then allocate funds for 372 when you only spent 120 last year;
Leonard -180 was collected for 9 mos.
Cindy -well this says fees collected current budget 240;
Leonard -I dont have that;
Harry -what you are looking at on page 4 that was prior to budget revision;
Cindy -but Harry what I'm supposed to be looking at is Budget revision so this way I have
something to go by;
Harry -we didnt do budget revision until July 12; this budget was put out July 1;
Cindy -then I'll tell you what I need to have; I need to have these sheets that are budget
revision so that this way what I'm doing is comparing apples to apples because this doesnt
do me any good if I'm not comparing what is actually current with what you anticipate is
current;
Harry-that's some of the questions Comm.Jonas was looking at - cant hear - it was adopted
12 days after this budget was furnished to you.
Cindy -then we should have had - then how do you propose to have a fund balance of 120,000?
if all you are collecting is 160 and you have expenditures of 240? according to what I'm
looking at you do.
Harry -cant hear
Cindy -then I repeat; how do you propose to have 120,000 carry over when you only have
60,000 left year to date;
Harry-we spent just about everything we are going to spend;
Cindy- he just said there's a 95,000 bill that hasnt been paid
Harry -he said hasnt been paid but my figures include it cause I encumbered it
96,000 of the 100,000 contract; I show expenditures and /or encumbrances of 100,000;
Cindy -so where did you get the 120,000?
harry -I cant give you an explanation as to where the extra 120 came from; I have to go back
in my paperwork; I cant give you an explanation
Cindy -you see the problem with approving a budget for next year we assume that we have x
no. of dollars coming in; we assume that there's a fund balance; if there isnt and we're
allocating monies that we dont have, we're going to have a shortfall. I dont like having a
shortfall. especially in this particular fund which is new.
I would suggest that No. 1 its kind of late and I think we need to have this budget
think we need to have the revised figures in front of us because no matter what we're doing
here folks its not going to add up if we dont have the current figures in front of us.
Because what we're basing things on is what we think is current and it isnt; so whats
the point. Could we set up another Workshop Mayor
Torcaso yes; we sent a letter to the School Board about having a meeting on the 30th and
we havent heard anything form them, have we? No. set up a budget hearing on the 30th;
Cindy -could I ask for something else too;most of the depts. have got listed other equipment;
and really dont have any explanation; information services dept. has got 5,000 other equip.;
and there is no explanation; I would like to see the Depts. supply to us what of this extra
equip. is. unless its been fully discussed here; so that this way we also have something
that we can look at.
Jonas -I say not only in other equipment alone, I think anytime theres a line item where
theres a certian percentage of increase above last year they ought to be able to explain
as to why there is that increase in that
Cindy -I dont disagree with you but for this particular budget as we sat here we kind of
went over most of them but there was a lot of other equipment that we didnt discuss and I
think anything that is listed here because all I'm gonna do is highlight it and I'm gonna A
bring it up next time; so rather than have to do that if the depts. could just supply
you know what we talked about; if we didnt discuss it and you've got it listed as other
equipment or you think its gonna be questioned because its higher than it was then go
ahead and write it out and submit it to the city manager and he can bring it back to us.
Torcaso -do we have any problems meeting during the week? how about Wedn.nite? how about
the 25th?
Cindy -I've also asked harry for some addtl. figures here and I wont have time to absorb
them until by time he gives them to me we'll be into Tues. or Wed.
• •
Cindy -I dont have a problem with it; thats o.k. just have to work harder;
Torcaso -meet on the 25th 7 p.m.
Cindy -I'm also gonna ask I had reserved comment
Chief -you just want 6410 other equip. for lists for every dept.
Cindy -if we havent talked about it the depts. know what we've talked about and what we
havent;
Chief -we'll provide them for all depts. that way you'll have them;
Cindy - that's find; I'm not gonna go into details right now, but I think we all realize that
with the new tax hikes that everybody is going to see and with everybody squeezing every
body else for dollars that we're going to come in especially since we are the front line,
of government we're going to come into some hard hits and part of my problem with government
is its top heaviness; I one of the reasons I also had agreed with Terri on term
limitations when you are in a position for any length of time it becomes more and more
difficult to make very difficult decisions; because whenever its regarding personnel and
its regarding staff you become less able to put your personal preferences aside and make
good business decisions. The way I look at this we're running a business. And there's
only so much we can charge the consumer for the services we offer for them. offer to give
them. I think that what we are going to need to do is make some changes, not just re-
organizing; I think that we are going to need to cut some staff positions; perhaps
what that means is giving current staff members more responsibility, compensating them
with more money, but in the long run making this a more effective operating business like
I said that becomes very very difficult; I've been here consistently concurrently for
longer than any of you; and there are some people that I would rather not have to do this
to because it does effect their positions; however, if I dont do what I need to do,
and if I dont make the recommendation that I' m planning to, I am not doing my job. and
I take this job very seriously; for the next meeting I will have in writing some of my
suggestions; I would like the rest of the Commission if you would to take a look at what
our situation is right now and really do some hard thinking and please try to put
personalities aside try to put, its very difficult to do that; we have a responsibility
and we are going to have to live up to our responsibility; and now that. I've scared staff
to death I'm really sorry, but we are going to have to do something;
Torcaso -this is the whole thing to make sure everything comes out perfectly legal.
and what our responsibilities are. Incidentally also about the resolution on the different
boards and their compensation; etc.
Workshop on the 25th 7 p.m.
Meeting adj. 10:00 p.m.