HomeMy WebLinkAbout2000 09 25 Informational A Winding Hollow Nature Trail Issue
COMMISSION AGENDA
ITEM A
CONSENT
INFORMATIONAL X
PUBLIC HEARING
REGULAR
9/25/00
Meeting
MGR. ~ /DEPT
Authorization
REQUEST: The City Commission requested that the City manager go back and review
all tapes of the February 28, 2000 Commission meeting regarding the
Winding Hollow Nature Trail issue.
PURPOSE: The purpose of this item is to provide the City Commission with the outcome
of the tape review of the February 28, 2000 Commission meeting regarding
the Winding Hollow Nature Trail.
CONSIDERATIONS:
· The City Commission met on February 28, 2000 and received extensive public input
and discussed alternative actions related to construction of a nature trail between
Winding Hollow and Oak Forest subdivisions.
· "I would like to make a motion that we kill this issue, that's before us, and that we
would then turn it back to the Homeowners' Association of Winding Hollow, at which
time for them to bring it back as the Association before this Commission, with fact
finding information at which time the Association's in agreement to do that". Motion by
Commission McLeod. Seconded by Commissioner Martinez. Discussion.
Vote:
Commissioner Martinez: Aye
Commissioner McLeod: Aye
Commissioner Blake: Nay
Deputy Mayor Cindy Gennell: Nay
Mayor Partyka: Aye
Motion Carried.
1
\
FUNDING:
N/A
RECOMMENDATION:
Information Item Only.
IMPLEMENTATION SCHEDULE:
The Winding Hollow Homeowners' Association has not brought back any fact-finding
information to date.
A TT ACHMENTS:
Attachment "A"- February 28, 2000 Meeting Minutes regarding Winding Hollow
Nature Trail Issue.
COMMISSION ACTION:
Agendal26
2
ATTACHMENT II A"
CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS
MINUTES
CITY COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETING - FEBRUARY 28, 2000
Page 3 of 19
B. Community Development Department - Land Development Division
Requesting Commission Approval For The Acceptance Of The Improvements
(Water And Sewer System) Located In Parkstone Unit 1 For City Ownership And
Maintenance.
C. City Clerk's Office
Approval Of The Minutes Of The Regular Meeting Of February 14,2000.
D. City Clerk's Office
Approval Of The Minutes Of The Special Meeting Of February 21, 2000.
(Continuation of the February 14, 2000 Regular Meeting)
Commissioner David W. McLeod briefly spoke about approving the minutes, and his
recent absence from a Commission Meeting.
"MOTION TO APPROVE CONSENT AGENDA". MOTION BY
COMMISSIONER MARTINEZ. SECONDED. DISCUSSION. ATTORNEY
GARGANESE STATED, "THE RECORD CAN REFLECT THE FACT THAT HE
WAS NOT IN ATTENDANCE".
VOTE:
COMMISSIONER BLAKE: AYE
DEPUTY MAYOR GENNELL: AYE
COMMISSIONER McLEOD: AYE
COMMISSIONER MARTINEZ: AYE
MOTION CARRIED.
.:. .:. AGENDA NOTE: THE FOLLOWING REGULAR AGENDA ITEM WAS
NEXT HEARD BY THE COMMISSION, ALONG WITH PUBLIC INPUT
PERTAINING SPECIFICALLY TO THIS AGENDA ITEM. .:. .:.
VI. REGULAR
ADD-ON
C. City Manager
Requesting The Commission To Consider Alternative Actions Related To
Construction Of A Nature Trail Between Winding Hollow And Oak Forest
Subdivisions.
Mr. Ronald W. City Manager introduced this Agenda Item and listed some of the
possible options.
In other business, Mayor Partyka commented that the dais lights were working very
nicely.
CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS
MINUTES
CITY COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETING - FEBRUARY 28. 2000
Page 4 of 19
Discussion followed regarding holding a Special Meeting; having everyone speak;
holding another (larger) meeting; and a previous vote regarding this issue.
PUBLIC INPUT
Mr. Roger Cooper, 313 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: spoke as "a
representative of the Winding Hollow residents who are in favor of the nature: trail", and
said he was interested in the suggestions of the Commission as to how to progress with
this issue. Mr. Cooper also spoke about fear; crime; property values; and suggested
several possible solutions including the organization of a committee.
Ms. Barbara Becker, 1066 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: mentioned
privacy; paying a premium for property on a conservation area; asked why this is being
revisited prior to all residents moving in; and that "fear" is not a problem.
Ms. Terry Hopkins, 1072 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: was not in
favor of the nature trail; and spoke of her concern with the possibility of crime and
motorized vehicles on the Trail; and a previous situation with a residence on a Trail in
Virginia. Ms. Hopkins also suggested that a stop light be placed at their intersection.
Mr. Randall Dombrowski, 122 Brookshire Court, Winter Springs, Florida: presented and
reviewed with the Commission some charts he had created; spoke of a petition that had
been given to the City and the votes that were counted; and asked for consideration of the
facts.
Mr. Harry Brockman, 1204 Winding Chase Boulevard, Winter Springs, Florida: advised
Mayor Partyka that he did not want to address the Commission, but that he was opposed.
Ms. Linda Jordan, 1069 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: spoke of her
always being opposed to the nature trail; asked whether Oak Forest should be considered
in this matter, as the impact seems to be less on Oak Forest residents than on Winding
Hollow residents; and the position of the Homeowners' Association regarding this issue.
Ms. Nancy Taylor, 304 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: was opposed to the
Trail; and spoke of two other experiences she has had living on nature trails.
Ms. Pat Kaltenbach, 1200 Winding Chase Boulevard, Winter Springs, Florida: said that
she and her husband are against the Trail; and spoke of negative impacts; premium prices
for some lots; and protecting nature.
Mr. Howard Cashman, 1076 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs, Florida:
mentioned that he was opposed to the Trail.
Mr. Paul Siwera, 1220 Winding Chase Boulevard, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed to
the Trail.
Mr. Robert Shrewsberry, 1222 Winding Chase Boulevard, Winter Springs, Florida:
opposed to the Trail; and the lack of support from the Homeowners' Association.
CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS
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CITY COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETING - FEBRUARY 28. 2000
Page 5 of 19
Ms. Linda White, 5907 Pitch Pine Drive, Orlando, Florida: as an "Eagle Watch
Coordinator" with the Audubon Society, she spoke of eagle nests; pemllttmg; not
disturbing the nests; easements; suitable buffers; and preservation of the species.
Tape I/Side B
Mr. John Pedicone, 388 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed to the
Trail; and mentioned a lack of privacy; preserving nature; decreasing property values;
and possible problems with crime.
Mayor Partyka mentioned several letters that had been submitted in opposition.
Ms. Trudy Dombrowski, 122 Brookshire Court, Winter Springs, Florida: felt that this
issue should not have been reopened; previous decisions and comments by Members of
the Commission; and wasting taxpayer dollars.
Members of the Commission discussed City policy in terms of public input comments.
The consensus of the Commission was that "Public Input" forms would not be noted for
the record, if the person was not in attendance.
Ms. Pat Stimmel, 346 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: was opposed to the
Trail, and spoke of the facts being presented; snakes; egress and safety concerns; and
opinions of the Homeowners' Association.
Ms. Lori Anderson, 359 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed _ did not
want to address the Commission.
Mr. William Anderson, 359 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed - also
did not want to address the Commission.
Ms. Nancy Dzamba, 305 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: stated, "I am on
the Board at Winding Hollow. I just want to quote for the record, that there is no official
position, by the Board of Winding Hollow Development, on this issue". Ms. Dzamba
further spoke of communication issues; other opinions; dealing with the facts:; and stated
that "We are going to go, as a Board, with the decision of the neighborhood". Brief
discussion followed on the Oak Forest subdivision.
Mr. Greg Coats, 1014 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed - did
not wish to address the Commission.
Ms. Sharon Testerman, 1101 Shadowbrook Trail, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed-
did not address the Commission.
Mr. Mike Wycoff/Ms. Carol Wycoff, 201 Springview Court, Winter Springs, Florida:
opposed - did not address the Commission.
Mr. Don Hyland, 1012 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed from
the beginning; suggested that this topic be left alone; and inquired why Oak Forest had
become involved.
CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS
MfNUTES
CITY COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETING - FEBRUARY 28. 2000
Page 6 of 19
Mr. Hubert Paprotna/Ms. Carol Paprotna, 308 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs.
Florida: opposed - did not address the Commission.
Mr. Tyler Weisman, 113 Brookshire Court, Winter Springs, Florida: said that the
Homeowners' Association did not take a stance; spoke of coercion and illegal issues; that
a Realtor who supported the Trail, had "received threatening letters from some of the
opposition"; and wanted the Commission and the Police to be aware of this. Mr.
Weisman stated that he supported the Trail.
Ms. Leah Weisman, 113 Brookshire Court, Winter Springs, Florida: was in support of
the Trail; spoke of previous surveys being based on conceptual drawings; and eagles.
Mr. Edwin Mixon, 312 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed to the
Trail; concerned with possible fire and drought conditions; asked whether fire hydrants
would be installed in this area; and asked about one individual being allowed to make a
presentation to the Commission.
Mr. Tony Trapasso, 1132 Shadowbrook Trail, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed - did
not address the Commission.
Mayor Partyka mentioned another letter that had been submitted.
Mr./Ms. Bravata, 201 Springview Court, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed - did not
address the Commission.
Mr. Gein Lein, 1173 Winged Foot Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: in favor - did not
address the Commission.
Mr. Jeffrey Maddox, 382 Twelve Oaks Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed - did not
address the Commission.
Mayor Partyka called out several names of individuals who did not answer.
Mr. Tom Colley, 1046 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: opposed - did
not address the Commission.
Ms. Dawn Shrewsbury, 1222 Winding Chase Boulevard, Winter Springs, Florida: stated,
"I am, for the record, opposed, like I always have been, since July, just before we moved
in". Ms. Shrewsbury said that there was no coercion; notification about this meeting;
facts; and solicitation efforts in this subdivison.
Mr. James Steinmetz/Ms. Carole Steinmetz, 1218 Winding Chase Boulevard, Winter
Springs, Florida: opposed - did not address the Commission.
CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS
MINUTES
CITY COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETING - FEBRUARY 28. 2000
Page 7 of 19
Mr. Albert Murro, 632 Cheoy Lee Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: as the President of
the Oak Forest Homeowners' Association, he stated that Oak Forest did not have an
"Official" position on this issue. Mr. Murro spoke of a previous ballot; that both
subdivisions are affected by this; and could the Commission inform all residents of both
subdivisions and get an official vote.
Ms. Barbara Aikens, 119 Brookshire Court, Winter Springs, Florida: was in favor of the
Trail and submitted letters to the City Clerk. Ms. Aikens spoke of neighbors reactions,
opinions, and attitudes; consideration of the facts; and the planned design of the trail.
Mr. Bill Gibson/Ms. Annette Gibson, 1078 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs,
Florida: opposed - did not address the Commission.
Ms. Joanne Krebs, 1002 Taproot Drive, Winter Springs, Florida: mentioned the original
intention for a nature trail; the impact on both communities; City problems; preserving
nature; and the interests of both communities.
Mr. Richard Grassa, 1054 Winding Waters Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: spoke of the
petitions previously presented; information about this meeting; signatures on petitions;
previous comments by the Commission; Homeowners' Association representation;
opposition to the Trail; and a letter written by Mr. Chuck Pula, Parks and Recreation
Director.
Mayor Partyka called out several other names of individuals who were not in attendance.
Mayor Partyka closed the Public Input portion.
Commissioner Michael S. Blake clarified, "The record needs to be set straight on - I
think there is some concern that people are here representing a position of a
Homeowners' Association that others feel a Homeowners' Association has not taken, and
it's been stated, even by Mr. Grassa, here at the end, that the Homeowners' Association
did not come to us, therefore, we should not have this on the Agenda again. When this
was removed from the Parks program, back in July, it was done so, with the caveat that
it's not dead - it's just delayed and postponed until such time that - meaning the
consideration of it, is not dead; but just delayed until such time that better information
gets out to the neighborhoods, that is - that the Trail involves, and those neighborhoods
communicate to us, exactly what their feelings are. It's unfortunate that this has become
such a decisive issue, in not just Winding Hollow now, but also in Oak Forest as well.
There was never a requirement that the Homeowners' Association take the position and
that the Homeowners' Association position would be followed by this Commission".
Commissioner Blake added, "I appreciate the comment that might have been made near
the end of that meeting, by Commissioner Gennell - but, I believe, and I don't want to
speak for her, but, she might have been speaking about the Association in terms of _
here's one way that this could be brought back up and put on the Agenda. Indeed, I think
it's the business of this Commission to take up any business that is brought to us by the
citizenship - or the citizens of the City, and give that due heanng. About the issue of
what is Oak Forest doing in this - well, quite frankly, I think Oak Forest is very much in
this - the property, some of the property where the Trail could have gone, may go, is
CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS
MINUTES
CITY COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETING - FEBRUARY 28. 2000
Page 8 of 19
envisioned to go - however you want to put it - is as close to the Oak Forest
development, as it is to the Winding Hollow development. Now, certainly, the original
conceptual drawing that was circulated had the Trail circling all the way around it - most
of the way around Winding Hollow and certainly seems to be more of a Winding Hollow
issue, than any other place. But, if there is going to be any consideration of a nature trail
in that area between Oak Forest and Winding Hollow, then Oak Forest has a dog in this
race also, and I think that they need to have some say and input in what goes on here".
Further discussion ensued regarding the charts that had been submitted; statistical
analysis; fairness; accurate representation; determining what the entire community wants;
whether a ballot could determine actual opinion and the related costs; and who should
vote on this issue.
Commissioner Blake asked "Is there a way to delineate just those people, on the
November ballot, when we have an election"? Manager McLemore said that he could
check into this.
Commissioner McLeod asked where the land allotted for this nature trail originated from,
and that the records could be checked. Discussion then ensued on the Oak Forest and
Winding Hollow subdivisions; the democratic process; and previous opinions.
Tape 2/Side A
Commissioner Martinez further spoke of the efforts of the Winding Hollow residents; the
preference of the majority; the November ballot; and related costs.
Attorney Garganese left the dais at 8:39 p.m.
Deputy Mayor Cindy Gennell spoke of her efforts as Chair of the Seminole County
Greenways and Trails Task Force, and the Seminole County Greenways and Trails
Advisory Committee. Deputy Mayor Gennell also mentioned the effects and impacts on
the two (2) affected neighborhoods, in addition to the disparity in size of both
communities.
Attorney Garganese returned to the dais at 8:43 p.m.
Discussion ensued on ballots that were used for other subdivision votes; possibly waiting
for most houses to be sold; and deciding on the best plan.
Members of the Commission and Manager McLemore discussed the November ballot; a
mail ballot; the concept and design of the Trail; the effect on Oak Forest subdivision
home owners; proprietary ownership; divisive issues; getting past some of the issues;
whether the residents of Winding Hollow desire a Trail; deciding on the right decision;
paved alleyways; walking paths; and getting the ideal results.
Commissioner McLeod then asked about a letter that Mr. Richard Grassa mentioned in
his earlier public input comments. Mr. Grassa handed the document to Commissioner
McLeod for his review. Brief discussion.
CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS
MINUTES
CITY COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETfNG - FEBRUARY 28. 2000
Page 9 of 19
Manager McLemore left the dais at 9:00 p.m.
Manager McLemore returned to the dais at 9:01 p.m.
"I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT WE KILL THIS ISSUE,
THAT'S BEFORE US, AND THAT WE WOULD THEN TURN IT BACK TO
THE HOMEOWNERS' ASSOCIATION OF WINDING HOLLOW, AT WHICH
TIME FOR THEM TO BRING IT BACK AS THE ASSOCIATION BEFORE
THIS COMMISSION, WITH FACT FINDING INFORMATION AT WHICH
TIME THE ASSOCIATION'S IN AGREEMENT TO DO THAT". MOTION BY
COMMISSIONER McLEOD. SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER MARTINEZ.
DISCUSSION.
VOTE:
COMMISSIONER MARTINEZ: AYE
COMMISSIONER McLEOD: AYE
COMMISSIONER BLAKE: NAY
DEPUTY MAYOR GENNELL: NAY
MAYOR PARTYKA: AYE
MOTION CARRIED.
Mayor Partyka reminded everyone that there are two sides to this issue.
Mr. Albert Murro, 632 Cheoy Lee Circle, Winter Springs, Florida: as the President of
the Oak Forest Homeowners' Association, Mr. Murro stated the following: "I've got to
say for the record, I kind of take exception if even five percent (5%) of whatever is done
between these two subdivisions, affects Oak Forest - then we should have a say in it".
Mayor Partyka called a recess at 9:04 p.m.
Mayor Partyka called the meeting back to order at 9: 21 p.m.
IV. INFORMATIONAL
A. Public Works Department
Inform Commission Of Action Taken By The Public Works Department In
Delineating Traffic Calming Islands
B. City Manager
Requests The City Commission Review Information Related To The Use Of
Community Development Block Grant Funds (CDBG).
D. City Manager
Informing The City Commission Of The Status Of The One Cent Local Option
Sales Tax Renewal. '