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HomeMy WebLinkAbout_2001 08 28 City Commission Special Minutes CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING AUGUST 28, 2001 I. CALL TO ORDER The Special Meeting of Tuesday, August 28,2001 of the City Commission was called to order by Mayor Paul P. Partyka at 6:30 p.m. in the Commission Chambers of the Municipal Building (City Hall, 1126 East State Road 434, Winter Springs, Florida 32708). ROLL CALL: Mayor Paul P. Partyka, present Deputy Mayor David W. McLeod, present Commissioner Robert S. Miller, present Commissioner Michael S. Blake, arrived at 6:32 p.m. Commissioner Edward Martinez, Jf., present Commissioner Cindy Gennell, absent City Manager Ronald W. McLemore, present City Attorney Anthony A. Garganese, absent Attorney Jeff Buak, present Commissioner Michael S. Blake arrived at 6:32 p.m. Mayor Partyka stated, "Let the record show Commissioner Blake is here also." II. AGENDA A. Community Development Department Requests That The City Commission And Local Planning Agency (LP A) Conduct A Special Meeting To Review The Recommendations Of Land Design Inll(]lvations (LDI) For The Evaluation And Appraisal Report (EAR) Based Amendments To The City Of Winter Springs Comprehensive Plan. Ms. Patricia A. Tyjeski, AICP, of Land Design Innovations, Inc., Consultant to the City of Winter Springs gave an overview of all Elements that the City Commission will be reviewing. Regarding the issue of access points, Ms. Tyeski suggested, "I've heard that - in the past you have tried to have - an Ordinance that says more than two (2) access points should be provided in a subdivision, but it has not been received well by the public. So it is something that - I recommend that you look very carefully into that and CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28, 200] PAGE 2 OF ]0 make sure that you, the Commission and the Plarllling Board agree with what we are recommending. " In regards to the preservation of flood plains, Commissioner Blake asked, "Is there anyway to build that in as a requirement - that we're not allowing development into the flood plain?" Ms. Tyeski stated, "Yes, you could put it in." Recreational facilities was the next topic to be discussed. Ms. Tyeski stated, "At this point we are recommending those as just standards. We - put them in as 'Level Of Service' (LOS), which means you can recommend but if they don't want to do it it's hard - for you to make them do it. We could put those as 'Level Of Service' (LOS). 'We have done it in other Cities and it works pretty well." The acreage of parks with the City's boundaries was then discussed with Ms. Tracy Crowe, Principal Plarlller with Land Design Innovations, Inc. Ms. Tyeski explained that "We have 140 acres almost. 145 acres of active, usable, upland, buildable, developable park land. And that would give us at five (5) acres per thousand - real close to just a slight surplus. Or right about, actually not it's right about there. We have thirty thousand, actually it's a slight deficiency of about - when we calculate the 'Level Of Service' (LOS) for the overall park land, we look at the 297 acres." Discussion. Mr. Ronald W. McLemore, City Manager stated, "No, we are going to, as I recall, we were going to recommend a 'LOS' ('Level Of Service') for buildable land. Is that not correct based on our discussion the other day?" Ms. Crowe stated, "We had - but I wasn't sure what the final decision was on that." Discussion. Commissioner Blake stated that in regards to the lower level of Central Winds Park's open space, are we "Recommending guidelines for active recreation facilities? Would that be considered an active recreation facility?" Commissioner Blake was advised "No. A field and a court is a recreational facility. It's not by acres. It's just by one field, one court, that's a recreational facility. So in one park you have passive recreation ~md then you have active recreation. You don't have to say that park is passive or active because - we start dividing how much is active, how much of it is passive." Ms. Crowe added, "The acreage that we're showing, the 297, now that's after getting a lot of detail from Chuck Pula, the Recreation Director. He has given us a lot of information so we had precise acreage to come up with this information. And it's all on the table and it spells out every park and how many acres that were defined in that park to get the 297. Now, when you go to the Future Land Use Element, the maps were done by E.L.S. and they prepared acreage categories for the Future Land Use and the existlng land use. Those acres differ tremendously from this. You are showing 580 acres of park land. The only thing I can do with that at this point, and at this stage in the game, is to say that - it's just from G.I.S. mapping and it may include rights of way and drainage and other CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28, 2001 PAGE 3 OF 10 things. But we are going with this acreage for park land acreage. So when you see that and the Future Land Use Element, there will be a discrepancy there and it's just due to mapping." Manager McLemore asked, "Couldn't we handle that with language though?" Ms. Crowe responded, "I am going to put a footnote in that table explaining that it does differ from the acreage in the Parks and Recreation Element." Discussion. Commissioner Edward Martinez, Jr. asked, "Does the conservation space that you listed at the bottom there, does that include the trails - we have here?" Ms. Tyeski stated, "We have the park land inventory which does not include those as acreage but we have a 'Level Of Service' for bikes - so we're saying the City should have - one (1) mile per 10,000 people that you have in the City." Commissioner Blake added, "The bike trail specifically ought to cross Seminole Trail, is owned by the State, managed by the County, in some portions managed by our City. That goes directly through the center of our City and should be counted I think. Because even though we don't own it is a public trail, public recreation facility, and part of the transportation - too perhaps. And it should be counted in this as well. Both in the acreage and in the 'Level Of Service' for facilities if we decide to go that route as well I would think. So those acres are in here also?" Ms. Crowe responded, "Oh now I guess just as a facility." Discussion ensued regarding whether golf courses are counted. Manager Mc.Lemore stated, "First question is, do we include those private as recreational acreage. And the other is, do we have golf courses as one of our buildable facilities. And currently the answer to both of those is 'No.'" Discussion. The proposed schedule was next covered. Ms. Tyeski stated in regards to the sehedule, "So far we're at the LPA (Local Planning Agency) and Cit~ Commission Workshop, August 28th. What we are proposing is that by September 5t , we'll try to have all the drafts ready for the P and Z (Planning and Zoning Board) Hearing to be held on September 12th. Now that would be a Special Meeting for them, it's not their Re~ular Meeting date. And then having the City Commission Meeting on September 24t. It would be a limited time for preparation of Minutes and adoption of Minutes, but it is something that maybe the City can work. And from our part we're going to be able to go in and make the changes that are necessary to the Elements. I don't think we are going to have a lot of time to do - to embellish the Elements or put things that are not really necessary at this time. Those things can be done later." Discussion. Deputy Mayor David W. McLeod stated, "If we go through this tonight and say, what was that date the 24th, I guess something like that, it goes to P and Z (Planning and Zoning Board) on the 12th, comes back to us on 24th. On the 24th, then we review it. If we approve it, it then gets sent, that's the first - and then it's reviewed by the State,. comes back to us, and then we have sixty (60) days at that point?" Ms. Tyeski responded, "Yes." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28, 200] PAGE40F 10 Furthermore, Deputy Mayor McLeod stated, "Right now, there are things in here that probably - the Commission may not agree with. But during the time it goes up and comes back, if in the O.R.C. Report that comes back from the State, if there are things in here that the State didn't pick up on and yet the Commission wants to change, can it still be changed?" Ms. Crowe responded, "Yes, we can work on changing it and improving it while it's being reviewed by the State to a certain degree." Deputy Mayor McLeod further stated, "I mean can we really go into it and change things?" Discussion. Ms. Crowe stated, "I don't know how to answer it. - r am not sure how to answer. r am not sure what our process is going to be." Discussion. "My recommendation is if we're staying on this schedule that we're on, we review it; we see if there are any changes; we go through our Hearings; we transmit it; you get it approved. We get an O.R.C. Report to see ifthere's anything else that we've missed that the State is looking for, if they have any new changes or anything else 'cause they always find something - because they have to prove that they're doing their job. - rfwe go ahead and submit it, after that you can amend your Comp Plan as many times as you want your text. I mean two (2) times a year you get it exactly the way you want it and you take your time doing it." Discussion. Manager McLemore then inquired, "How long do you, would you perceive it would take you to take the update 'Traffic' Element and include it in these documents." Ms. Crowe stated, "A couple of weeks." Tape I/Side B Ms. Crowe stated, "The data that's in there for 'Transportation' is just inaccurate; it's just outdated, so you always correct it. The concern would be any policies that require something that you don't agree with." Manager McLemore then said, "So as long as we were clean on the policies we wouldn't have anything to worry about?" Ms. Crowe responded, "Right. You don't even have to adopt your data analysis." Manager McLemore then added, "Okay, so the answer to the Commissioner's question is the thing which you would want to pay most attention to, is not the numbers but the actual stated 'Policies and Objectives' that are in each of these Elements. Now which leads to a second question - are there differences, any substantial differences behveen the latest version in terms of 'Policies,' and the version that's currently, the current version?" Ms. Crowe stated, "One of the biggest issues that we just went through, to give a lot of credit - there was another consultant working on the Future Land Use and - they worked really hard and got the maps done very quickly. We have been recommending from the very beginning that there be a 'Conservation Overlay' designation. He does not have time to get - well, actually he said he didn't have the technical capabilities to do it. And we talked to Ernest and we're not - doing the Future and existing land use maps. We can do it, but it's not something we have under this contract. So at this point we were told to take it out." Manager McLemore stated, "That's something we could always add though, right?" This was agreed to. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28, 2001 PAGE 5 OF 10 Manager McLemore asked, "On the 'Transportation' Element, do you know enough about the latest revisions to know if there's any substantial change in 'Policies' in the 'Transportation' Element between this one and the one that's been replaced?" Manager McLemore was advised, "Nothing for major changes in 'Policies.' There might be changes for 'Level Of Service' (LOS) on roads..." Manager McLemore then inquired, "So then in terms of that, we really wouldn't be hurt by going ahead and sending up the old one, correct?" Ms. Crowe responded, "Right. They may reject it because of using old tables." Commissioner Blake added, "We can handle that in the O.Re. Report." Manager McLemore agreed with this. Further discussion. Mr. Tom Brown, Vice Chairman, Planning and Zoning Board/Local Planning Agency addressed the Commission. Deputy Mayor McLeod asked, "Where is this Comprehensive Plan stand today with the P and Z Board? That's the basic question here." Vice Chairman Brown stated, "Personally, I see no problem, I go along with the City Manager. If we were to submit this plan, I don't think we'd have any problem. Ifwe proceed and really, we've got to be serious about it though, between the 25th and get the information back to bring it up to date with the things that are missing. But basically, my opinion is that I don't see any problem with our Meeting that we're going to have in September - that we won't be recommending this to the Commission. Except for - the items that are missing:; but the structure and the principals and the way it is set up is very good." Discussion. Mayor Partyka asked, "Do you as the Chairman of the P and Z Board (Planning and Zoning Board/Local Planning Agency) - is there some percentage, some part that is policy, correct that you can live with?" Vice Chairman Brown stated, "Yes," Discussion. Deputy Mayor McLeod stated, "The question basically is, between the time we transmit now and the time we have to, before the O.Re. Report come back - would it be wise then for the Commission really to have some of their own Workshops on these Elements; to make sure that we understand and agree on the 'Policies' - and once the O.R.e. Report comes back, can we change it even though the State may have approved parts of it?" Deputy Mayor McLeod further inquired, "Could we change this and send it back with the O.Re. Report. Or is that, or do they consider that a major rewrite, and would they reject it?" Ms. Crowe stated, "Yes, you can change it. Any part of it. Strike through and underline and submit it back to them as the adopted version." Manager McLemore said, "But that doesn't mean they accept it." Deputy Mayor McLeod stated, "No, that doesn't mean they accept it, but it would go back. You would get your O.R.e. Report; you'd try to do the corrections to it, plus any other conections you wanted to do, and they would accept that? That's basically my question." Ms. Crowe replied, "Yes." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28, 2001 PAGE 6 OF ]0 Commissioner Blake spoke of the old Comprehensive Plan and turning it into a usable tool and recommended, "That we make our first decision - are we going to stick with September 24th and do it that way? Or, are we going to do it right now, however long it takes; monitor any enforcement actions that may occur and try and get it right and done before that occurs? That is my first question. I would recommend we ignore September 24th at this point in time, and we go forward Element by Element and get it right. Because I think it will help us to have that looming enforcement action that will keep us on task and get this job done and get it done right." In terms of the Consultants, Commissioner Blake stated, "So far by all I've seen, I think you guys have done a tremendous job and I have a large degree of respect for what you've done. You know, we've had this thing now for two (2) years arid it wasn't until you came in that we had the first ink put down on paper. - To do arl - eighteen (18) month job in the short time you've had, I think you've done an exemplary job. I really do appreciate it and I appreciate the fact that you are here now. You know, if it's going to take extra to get it done, then it's going to take extra to get it done. That's my position." Mayor Partyka stated I think the three (3) points are here. We can take a consensus vote on this right now." Option number one (1) is, do we do it now and just get by or do it right, that's option one (1). Commissioner Miller?" Commissioner Robert S. Miller stated, "I think we need to do it right but, I'd also like to see us set dates tonight." Mayor Partyka stated, "And we'll do that." Mayor Partyka then said, "Do it right with firm dates." Commissioner Miller added, "Set a bunch of Workshops and let's get it done." Mayor Partyka stated to Commissioner Martinez, "Now and get by, or do it right with firm dates?" Commissioner Martinez stated, "From what I have heard so far, and especially from the people that worked so hard on this here and the City Manager, is this - we can't set this up and we have time to do it right - so, I don't see why we can't just proceed with that aspect of it and send it up, and then continue to work on this until we have the final right product. And submit it as a final project after the O.R.c.'s going to come back." Mayor Partyka added, "Now - option one (1) to get by and then work on it. Okay." Mayor Partyka then asked Deputy Mayor McLeod for his comments. Deputy Mayor McLeod stated, "I say we do it and do it right." Mayor Partyka clarified, "All right. So the consensus right now is to do it right - with firm dates. Okay. The second option and - as a concept - we do work on a contract revision with the City Manager and come up with fair compensation for the consulting firm. Are we all in agreement on this from the Commission standpoint?" Commissioner Miller responded, "If we are going to pursue this, get it out of here in a certain amount of time, and the Consultant's have got to work on it, I think this is an issue of the City - obviously what was said earlier, we need to make whatever accommodations that we need to make to get where we want to go just to get this thing done." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28, 2001 PAGE 7 OF 10 Commissioner Blake stated, "Mayor, I'm not sure if that question is one: for the Commission. I think we task the City Manager to get things done and it's up to him to work out the details. And all I was suggesting was, and reiterating again, the contract issue is not our problem up here. It's his problem. If he makes a contract, he's got to bring it to us for approval. If it's over a certain amount, that's understood. But I don't want to sit here and have a contract negotiation with two (2) Boards and Consultants.. .." Mayor Partyka added, "I think all we're trying to say is, conceptually this Commission - I want to know if this Commission agrees that there ought to potentially be a contract revision and potentially we may be spending some money and just to give that knowledge, to the City Manager, even though he's - of the $12,500.00, but ifhe happens to go above $12,500.00..." Manager McLemore added, "You'll know." Mayor Partyka continued, ". ..He's concerned that, from my standpoint, he should be assured that at least if it's reasonable he ought to get it." Mayor Partyka then stated, "Let me finish the consensus on the contract issue, just so conceptually they are behind this thing. Commissioner Martinez." Commissioner Martinez added, "They deserve everything they get." Deputy Mayor McLeod stated, "Yes." Mayor Partyka then said, "Okay. There it is. Okay, you've got your direction City Manager." Discussion ensued regarding the process to proceed and incorporating changes into the final document. Commissioner Blake stated, "If we are going to throw this away and start from - your current and final drafts, which I assume will not include the final "Transportation" Element at this point in time, I would request that we have thirteen (13) or even five (5), or however you want to count it - Elements, at one time put them in a binder so that they are all in one place..." Ms. Crowe added, "That's not a problem." Commissioner Blake added, "If it is a binder, I think we have a tendency to hold on to it a little differently and then we will have it available to go through." Mayor Partyka asked, "What I am trying to do is - make sure we're clear with all of these changes that they've worked hard on, that they will be incorporated into this final document. Is that correct?" Ms. Crowe stated, "Right, and let me qualify that. We didn't agree with reordering the format. Okay, we do not agree with that. And that was the most substantial comment throughout all of them was for us to change where all the maps, and the tables, and everything are. I don't want to deal with all of the software crashes at this point. But the maps are all in one place because they are all color copies so they can easily be pulled out. And they are in the same order in every single Element. And we all agreed to that." Manager McLemore asked Ms. Crowe, "We could come back to this Commission with everything in two (2) weeks?" Ms Crowe, stated, "That's right. The final - the full document." Manager McLemore then said, "I would as part of that, I would like for the Commission to adopt, as part of that, at least a goal that we are done with this by the first of November." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28. 2001 PAGE 8 OF 10 Mayor Partyka asked Vice Chairman Brown, "What do you say?" Vice Chairma.n Brown stated, "If this is a procedure, I think you have got to come back to us, because we did not do that. We did not take that approach. We took the deadline approach." Manager McLemore suggested, "Let's have Joint Meetings where everybody can get - a discussion, and move ahead." Discussion. Mayor Partyka said, "So the summary on this one. Weare all in agreement that we get the final revised copy incorporating all of this with no blanks; no question marks; in two (2) weeks; in binders for all of us here okay, and ideally to go into a Workshop with all of us, so we can just go through it with one facilitator." Commissioner Blake added, "I think the question is really about the use ofthe word final. These are final drafts. They are not final, final. They were to be final but now we have broadened the scope a little bit. What they are going to provide us with is a copy of their latest drafts. Which then your Council and our Council will get together with the Consultants, with Staff, and we will go through each Element and we will detem1ine then what the final draft, or the final copy will state in that Workshop. And then it will be incumbent upon the Consultant to go back, work in those changes that we authorize, put in the correct language that we all agreed upon at that Workshop, Special Meeting whatever you want to call it. And then bring us back the transmittal copy." Commissioner Blake added, "The great thing is, it will be able to come from not only us, but it will be able to come to us with your input, with Staffs input, with the Consultant's input, and Mayor, I would suggest that should be a joint Special Meeting." Attomey Jeff Buak explained that the Planning and Zoning BoardILocal Planning Agency will be attending as the Local Planning Agency. Commissioner Blake continued, "It will allow the LP A (Local Planning Agency) to take a vote on it; recommend it to us, as we sit there; and then we can take a vote on it at the same time, and take care of everything that needs to be done." Mayor Partyka stated, "We're going to have a revised copy?" Ms. Crowe added, "And what would be very necessary would be to have the appropriate Staff, Department Heads." Manager McLemore stated, "They will be there." Furthermore, Commissioner Blake asked, "In what order should we handle these Elements?" Manager McLemore stated, "The ones that require the most correlation first." Tape 2/Side A The Commission discussed specific Workshop dates and the document they are to receive. Mayor Partyka stated, "I think we're clear. Total document now. So you've got to make sure when you finally send it out, it's a complete document." CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28, 2001 PAGE 9 OF 10 Discussion. The Commission agreed to hold the following Special Meetings with the Planning and Zoning Board/Local Planning Agency: . Thursday, September 13t\ 2001 at 6:30 p.m. . Tuesday, September 25th, 2001 at 6:30 p.m. . Monday, October 1st, 2001 at 6:30 p.m. . Tuesday, October 2nd, 2001 at 6:30 p.m. Mr. Carl Stephens, Jr., Board Member, Planning and Zoning Board/Local Planning Agency inquired, will Board Members "Get a copy of this final draft, and have time to look at it, just like they will?" Commissioner Blake stated, "Same as we will - on September 11 th." Deputy Mayor McLeod clarified, "Mayor, won't this be a Special Meeting for both Boards, so both Boards will be able to independently vote on the issues?" Mayor Partyka said, "I believe that's correct. Is that right, Jeff?" Attorney Buak stated, "Yes. In fact, that's what I was going to address - with the Clerk. We need to make sure that we advertise these as Joint Meetings, and just so we all keep in mind the procedure here - before this Board can take action, the LP A (Local Planning Agency) needs to take official action, and that can be done the same night." Deputy Mayor McLeod added, "If that's the case, then doesn't that mean then the Chairman of the LPA (Local Planning Agency) actually runs the main meeting, and then we follow through?" This was agreed to. Ms. Roseanne Karr, Board Member, Planning and Zoning Board/Local Planning Agency asked Ms. Crowe what kind of comments they were looking for from the Planning and Zoning Board/Local Planning Agency. Ms. Crowe responded, "What we're really concerned about especially are your 'Goals, Objectives, and Policies.' Now, I still want to speak with the City Attorney and get a definite answer on that but, we're recommending that you only adopt your 'Goals, Objectives, and Policies' so that you can update your data at any time." Commissioner Blake stated, "I would like to express my appreciation to the P and Z Board (Planning and Zoning Board/Local Planning Agency) and the Consultants, and Staff tonight." III. ADJOURNMENT "MOTION TO ADJOURN." SECONDED. DISCUSSION. MOTION BY COMMISSIONER BLAKE. CITY OF WINTER SPRINGS MINUTES CITY COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING - AUGUST 28, 2001 PAGE 10 OF 10 VOTE: COMMISSIONER MILLER: AYE DEPUTY MAYOR McLEOD: AYE COMMISSIONER MARTINEZ: AYE COMMISSIONER BLAKE: AYE MOTION CARRIED. Mayor Partyka adjourned the Meeting at 8:24 p.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED: HOLLY PIERSTORF AND NZO-LUACES, CMC ..-~ '"': "'... ,"- ,. , - - , ~- . '1.'- . . ~~~ -.~ ~ . . :-::<~~pAlJLP. ~4RTYKA J.MA YOl\~\ NOTE: These minutes were approved at th~eptembeSod;'k>egular City Commission Meeting.